Just posting a general curiosity here...

Being a former musician, I enjoy watching pilots fly to music, which is nothing new. I was curious how many other people do this.

I was talking to an engine guy about the limitations of the aircraft I was building, and he suggested I create a sequence that would take advantage of the changing characteristics of my particular airplane through-out it's flight envelope. I was thinking that music is a way to make this interresting.

Anyone think I'm just... well... wierd for thinking this way???? I was wondering what the appropriate avenue to show this would be (in the context of classic pattern airplane flying), or if there would be one. I think I'd enjoy watching others do this. I enjoy watching the pros pull it off.

Anyone else doing this?

Brian

Brian,

I sometime listen to my ipod while practicing flying and even at times during rounds at a contest.

s.

I find it funny that people nowadays are allowed to use music. I don't remember what year it was but at a TOC Hanno wanted to fly choreographed to music and it wasn't allowed.

Well when I'm flying, I'm the only one who can hear it.....

Most of the invitational IMAC competitions have a musical segment. The ETOC as well. The Europeans call them Aeromusicals.

Is there a place for this in the classic pattern community... some way to insert it into a program?

Brian

The best sound ever is the sound of a two stroke unloading on a pipe and the Doppler Effect as it streaks across the field. Something that mostly only classic pattern flyers get to hear nowadays.

Totally agree Mike.

Although, would 1 part of a program ruin it for you?

Brian

I flew "in the day" and YES it would ruin it for me.
In Classic, if you are not stylish enough with the airplane, maneuvers and the power then IMO you aren't
in the mix at all.

That's the way it was back then and we all watched !!!!
We had all kinds of spectators too.
Phil Kraft was pure aerial ballet. The most pleasing to watch out of the whole group.
I was fortunate enough to have been with them all.
Witness that I still feel that way today and the last competition is ancient history now.

A few years ago they tried 'Artistic Aerobatics'. That was with music.
You don't see it today so there is the answer.
At least IMO !

8178 has it right.
Anything else isn't recreating the genre at all.

That's fair. And I appreciate your response.

Just so you know, I am completely happy working under the guidlines you feel passionate about. You make a great point when you say:

I like the music idea, but do not HAVE to have it. But I missed the "Glory Days" of pattern by a long shot. I've been influenced by watching Chip Hyde, and Mike McConville. I only wish I could see Joe Bridi, Phil Kraft, KAZ, Ron Chidgey, Dean Pappas, Jim Whitley, Dave Brown, etc. fly live and in person. I envy you, and those that have, and learned from them. I put Chip and Mike into that category as they were the pilots I saw fly, and could look up to the most. I don't know if they enjoyed the "Artistic" part of it, but being a musician, I certainly appreciated it, and find it to be a form of self-expression.

Brian

The point I would like to have you consider is that each maneuver in what we now label
Classic has a definite rhythm for maximum points and maximum visual effect.

To music is a fine idea.
BUT - what music is going to give you the right rhythm for a slow roll (5 seconds)
three rolls (5 seconds) and then throw in a loop with a snap and a half on top,(today called an avalanche)
vertical 8 etc. etc.

I think you can see my point. It would be a very unusual piece to say the least.
I expect that what would happen is that you would time the maneuver for that section of the music
and while it might fit musically it might not fit the maneuver timing specified in the judging section.

In other words I believe you have to go one way or the other.
Coming from 'that time' I pick the maximum grace for the maneuver being flown with no adjustments.
(for the musical timing).
Also don't forget that the turn around is neither judged nor timed (save for having to be within the allowable time
for the whole flight).
It is used to set the position you want for the next maneuver on the schedule / sequence.

Onewasp.

Thank you for this. I think I understand better now.

In the context of things, it would not work. I'm thinking my idea doesn't fit this context. This would need to be done in a different arena altogether, where maneuvers aren't judged in a specific box, but by the tempo of the chosen music. That idea is not pattern in any sence. Pattern is concrete in mandatory maneuvers. So this idea does not work in the context of classic pattern.

Thanks for taking the time to clarify, and I have been swayed.

Brian

I have to commend your idea ILikeBipes.
I used to listen to Music during our endurance motorcycle road races (4 hours). Ity made everything look completely different.
I spend alolt of time on you tube just looking what others are putting together. Most of it is complete nonsense, but every once in a while someone does what your talking about. Putting music with an action, an it really compliments the video. I guess the TOC freestyle is kind of like this, but it seems like they are forcing the plane just to try to keep in time with the music and I never really cared to watch it. Lack the flow, IMHO.
Would be interesting to see a video of classic pattern flying arranged with music that has been composed for the flight. PLEASE dont flame me guys! I do love the 2 strokes on pipes, and the most memerable time I have in R/C is doing split esses with my 20 size Mattlas wide open and hearing that OS 28 on a Mac pipe Scream by... But I would also appreciate someone else's artistic veiw.



DM

DM,

Thanks for that. I still think I personally like the idea. I wasn't thinking when I associated it with classic "pattern flying" though. There is a difference. However, if a meet was put together with the understanding that there will be classic pattern flying broken up with artistic segments, it may not be so bad. ...so long as everyone knew what it was about- to begin with (no surprises). Hopefully those that aren't into the "artsy" part of it could endure until the next round starts. It would be something to see/do while points get tallied, if an event would so choose to do it this way, or to break up the events. It adds the old with the new. It is a way to interrest new blood as well.

The reason I put the 2 together originally is only because of the aircraft involved.

Sure, there's a place. We'll put it right next to the pylon racing segment and the bomber-batics routines. It'll be a hit. And we shouldn't have any problem getting it SPA accepted as long as we either make it mandatory to burn 30% nitro in a pumped .91 four-stroke, or put a minimum price of $400 on each flight battery pack.


Ed Cregger

Ouch...

How about telling me what you really think...

I didn't realize people flew bombers and pylon racers in pattern competition.

The SPA has done great things for this end of the hobby. I'm happy they have been here (and I'm a CPA advocate).

Brian

Brian, please don't be discouraged by my feeble attempts at humor. They never work around the house either.

I'm not against trying new things or incorporating new performance paradigms in modeling. However, I am a bit of a stickler when it comes to diluting our existing nostalgia events with "new" aspects. Why do we have to run it through the SPA, or even the CPA or BPA for that matter? Why not leave those folks alone and have your regional clubs get together for choreographed flight? Competition isn't even needed, though it is inevitable.


Ed Cregger

Ed,

Thanks for putting this into perscetive.I happen to agree with you on this.

When I first saw this thread I was thinking oh no here we go, now where going to have to deal with Classic Pattern Ballet or Classic Pattern Dancing with the Stars. Not what I would want to see in a Ballistic Pattern Plane. Just seeing the words choreographykinda reminds me of the Black Sabbeth song Fairies Wear Boots. Sounds, well not very manly for Classic Pattern, IHMO, although the song rocks. I just want to hear a Classic Pattern plane with a screaming60 on the pipe like I used to see back in the 1980s' when I couldn't afford one. I think the background music would cover up that sound.

If done well I would watch it but I think it would be better suited as a different genre of flying not necessarily Classic pattern.

Bryan

Hi Ed.

My apologies... I really appreciate your kindness by taking the time to clarify.

Honestly, I am starting to understand what is being said, and have been swayed. Personally, I have an artistic background, so I am not entirely against it. But I certainly will respect the wishes of those who don't like it at all. I can be completely happy carving patterns out of the sky, listening to music in the mannor Scott was speaking. -To myself.

Who knows... Maybe there would be an arena this could be persued. Pattern events don't seem to fit that context for most.

My answer to this question is two sided.

One... You don't have to at all. Fun flys are a great venue.

Two... It was my desire because I believe in the direction of the CPA, and wish to persue all interrest pertaining to classic pattern aircraft with the idea of promoting the building and flying of classic pattern airplanes withing the blessing of this organization. Why?

I missed out on the opportunity to participate in the hobby when it was taking off. I lament this, but am also greatful for the advances it has offered all flyers today. I can understand those that look back to their participation and input to it's history, and wanting to preserve that and keep it that way. I think this should happen as well. The sound of the piped 2 strokes screaming through the air... the precision of hand constructed aircraft... advancements in technology... the true commeradery and kindness... It was a time where we still believed in having heros, people to look up to. These things are lost today in many repects. It is a removal of stress and frustration to be able to put one's self back in time. With that, we do not want other people to ruin what it was. I use "we," not because I was there, but because you are my heritage in this endeavor (I say that with no disrespect, but with honor to lift those up that were there.). And I wish to stay completely inclusive within the CPA as I believe the CPA upholds these endeavors better than any other. If others don't want this, it does not need to happen, but if they do, it is not outside the bounds of the CPA either (as I understand).

So I have no right to change what it was. I do not want to. I like it just fine the way you suggest. The CPA is my ticket into this heritage. I would not want to frey from it, or splinter it, because it is open enough to accept my wishes as much as the next person. I do not have to have my way, but am interrested if others share a same opinion.

Wow! That was wordy. I may try to clean this up. I don't know if it came across clearly. If I am too confusing, give me some time- I am in the process of re wording this...

Brian