I just purchased another RCU member's Tiporare, and was wondering what current servos you guys recommend for one of these? I was told coreless, but there are so many to choose from and the Futaba 9101s I was considering are causing bad crashes for the rc heli guys due to low torque. Also, all the coreless servos on Tower's website caution against using NiMh batteries, which is a real bummer since I'm trying to get away from NiCads. I use the Hydramax 4.8 1000MAH+ packs in just about everything now. Any suggestions for servos or batteries?

Good Question...I was curious on this one also...

I'm JR equiped...Any recommended JR servos?? Thanks..

Did you get "insalacosm's" Tipo??

Have Fun...

Chuck

Here is something to keep in mind, when the Tipo was the popular plane to have servos were large and slow compared to even standard ones today. Just about any modern servos is more then adequate for the job. Coreless is better of course but not needed in the long run.

My current 2m ship has JR 4131's on the ailerons and elevator, 4721 on the rudder, 513 on the throttle and I forget the retract number. All are run off a 5 cell pack using a JASCO voltage regulator.

Well...That makes some sense...

Good Stuff...

Chuck

I'm in total agreement with (cllaurit). Tipo's had large rack driven servos (at least mine did-PLS 15 I think) these servos had a whoppin 10 to 12 in/oz of torque. One point to remember is these ships need very small movement of all the control surfaces 8 to 10° on ailerons and roughly 10° to 12° on elevator. After all this is "Ballistic Pattern" so at 130mph the control surface doesn't have to move very much to do a very good job. Back in the day, "Flutter" was an ominous calamity always in the back of my mind at least. Long torque rods made of 5/32" music wire to drive the 'Barn Door' ailerons instead of belcranks eliminated alot of slop in the connection.

My last recommendation is I will be going with ball bearing servos, but for me and my house, I want small, light and something in the 20 to 30 in/oz range. A Ballistic bird that was weighing 7 to 7.5 lbs in the old mag's could easily drop a lb to 2 lbs with the modern servos and batteries.. JFYI IMHO

Well if that's the case, I have some new in package Futaba S3004 ball bearing servos. The speed is .23 seconds on 4.8v, torque 44.4oz on 4.8, and they weigh 1.3 oz a piece. But what bothers me is it says on the back of the package, "The S3004 is suitable for model airplane and car applications, however, can not be used for gas powered helicopters." Yes, I know the Tiporare is a plane, however, if there's a limit to what you can use them in, I am concerned about there use in a 100 MPH + plane.

Since you won't be doing 3D maneuvers with a classic pattern plane, and since it will most likely weigh under 8lbs, I don't think you really need anything more that these $30 jobs:

http://www.jrradios.com/Products/Tec...ProdID=JRPS821

Go to radio south's website and download their servo torque calculator. You enter airspeed, chord of the control surface and deflection and it tells you how much torque you will need.

Just thought I'd chime in on this one, in the era we are talking about the servo most seen on pattern ships were the Futaba 9202's and 9101's. even in the late 70's these servos were in the $50.00 each price range but they were norm for most pattern ships.

One one of the problems of the time was servo centering, but all the surfaces with the exception of the rudders were pretty small so centering wasn't a big issue except for the rudder. I've seen people flick the rudder stick and see it center at a slightly different place everytime the did it.

My point is with the low cost of some of the entry level digital servos it just doesn't make any sence not to use them. Centering is much improved, off center holding power is also much better and power consumption is less.

Also if you using any mixes in your radio to help a planes bad tendencies you will get a better feel and it will do the same thing the same way every time.

On a final note, I probably would never use them, but the high torque digital micro servos could probably equal what we use to fly with 10 to 15 years ago and be a major weight savings.

I use Futaba 9252 digitals in my Tiporare and will use them in my Blue Angel. For my slower aircraft like the Kwik Fli III I use Futaba 3001 ball bearings.

I never considered digitals. Those 9252s look nice, but I'm not sure if I really want to spend $75 per servo when I need at least 4 of them. I was thinking about these http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...?&I=LXHKB0&P=C $30 Futaba digitals; I don't know what the difference would be other then some torque. Of course, it still goes back to the battery as well. What type of onboard pack would you use for digitals? I've never had such a hard time selecting radio gear as with this plane...

Tommygun, I'm actually using two 3152s and two 3151s in my UFO. The faster 51s for ailerons and the higher torque 52s on rudder and elevator. I'm using a 5 cell, 6v 1400mah NiCad pack I got from Radical RC. It has high quality Sanyo KR 1400AE cells. It's a good pack for four or more digitals.

David

That's an interesting idea, tayloring servos to the surface. But why wouldn't you want the high torques all the way around, say 3152s on everything? Usually these planes are flown smoothly at high speed. Do you find it makes a difference?

If you already have servos why not use them, as I said before they are better then the best ones were 20 years ago. I flew an ACE 30% Extra 230 with Futaba 148's for years with never a problem. I did add the BB conversion kit to them which provided a little more shaft support. I never had a servo fail in that plane and believe me I push that plane around.

All this talk of servos and classic planes got me a bit nostalgic so I went to my junk drawer and pulled out some Pro-Line PLS-15's and marveled at how big they were. Gosh I remember cramming them into my Phoenix 7. When I upgraded from Pro-line to a Futaba 8JN in 1980 with FP-121 servos I thought wow these are small and how easily they fit in the fuse. By todays standards the 121 are large.

LOL Tommy your avatar made me download some Rush.... man I love that older stuff!!!

Oh yeah, I'm putting digital minis in my own.

-Mike

Sometimes I think we get too carried away with servo power. When I flew the old, super fast,
piped 2-stroke pattern ships I used Kraft mini servos that were so small the cases didn't have
screws , they were taped together and never had any problems. I don't know how much torque
they had but it probably wasn't much.

tommy s

Tommygun, I bought the 51s first. Since the 52s are the same price and since most people put stronger servos on their rudders I just figured I'd give it a try. There really wasn't that much thought put into it. I would recommend going 6 volts, though. That can noticeably perk up any servo rated for 6v operation.

I have some learning to do..6V huh...

I'm just starting to buy battery packs to replace my old ones that are mostly dead...I'm confused by all this new battery technology..he he...

I just got a plain Jane 4.8v for my Ultra Sport so I can get Airborne quickly...

I need to study-up...

Have Fun...

Chuck

90% of the models I'm currently flying use 4.8v packs. But, most servos will give a little bit more torque and speed with the extra cell.

Here's the difference it can make with the S3151s. The truth is I would probably never notice it in the air, but it does give you a little more for your money.

Speed: 0.21 sec/60° @ 4.8V
0.17 sec/60° @ 6.0V

Torque: 43 oz-in @ 4.8V
54 oz-in @ 6.0V

Same servo, different specs simply by adding one cell.

Well if I did go with the $75 9152 digitals that 8178 has, would I notice any kind of improvement over cheap servos? If it's worth it, I'll pony up and spend the money. What battery pack would you recommend for those, a Nicad or Nimh? I'm guessing by many of your responses that 6v is the way to go for digitals.

I have no idea about digitals but if you go with a 6v pack use a voltage regulator as the servos can get jumpy with a freshly charged pack.

I have never used a regulator with my 6v packs, and I have never experienced jumpy servos. Maybe jumpy thumbs before a maiden but not the servos. LOL

Like Paternguy said, there is no need for a regulator (unless you use 2-cell lipo packs). When you take the 6v packs fresh of the charger they can have a peak voltage that could cause some servos to jitter. But, both NiCad and NiMH cells discharge that peak voltage extremely fast and will settle down to a safe voltage within several minutes. If you're worried about it you can wiggle your sticks around for a minute before flying to burn off that short-lived peak voltage.

I've been doing a lot more reading about these coreless analog vs digitals, and still can't make an educated decision about which servos to go with. It appears they have so many pros and cons that it's almost a wash. Here's what I know so far, please feel free to add corrections:

According to some things I've read, digitals are more prone to failure then analogs.....not good! Also, they are harder on the gear train and batteries since they're always modulating to keep dead centered. But besides the obnoxious price, all the wiring must be thicker guage and even with upgraded batteries, you get about half the number of flights per charge than with analog. So now you have to consider going with LiPo receiver batteries, an entirely new thing and opens up a whole new can of worms. "Cheap" digitals, the 3151s and , 52s, seem to be discouraged for anything above 40 sized models. According to the helicopter guys, the 9152s are a night and day difference over the standerd bb servos, so apparently its worth it in that application. I'm not sure if I'll notice it or not with the Tiporare. I guess since I already am comfortable with standard servos and batteries, I tend not to trust anything that requires such a steep learning curve. What other servos are you guys using in your vintage pattern ships?

If it helps I use JR 517's and 511's on 4.8 volts in Curare, Atlas, Superstar and Warlord. Won the points contest last year against all the modern stuff. `It aint what you use, it's how you use it...'
Evan, WB#12