RE: Old time pattern pictures
 

My November '75 RCM has a black and white picture of the Triple Trouble at the '75 Masters Tournament. Page 50. I don't know which iteration I saw Tony fly at his home field in New Jersey. I know it wasn't the original Troublemaker. I also know that the color scheme was his trademark black and white.

Tom

RE: Old time pattern pictures
 

Mike,
Was post 3,picture8 taken at Kickapoo woods in Harvey IL.? I can not read the sign, but it does look like that flying Field. I remember going and watching a pattern contest at Kickapoo in the 70's when I was in high school. I live about 15 min. from there.

Jim DeYoung

RE: Old time pattern pictures
 

Enjoying the pics....hey when I was a teenager and wasn't building or flying I was reading the covers off magazines.... Anyway, I was talking with my formerly NJ buddy Tom Pirrone last night (used to work for Norm Cassella building Pulsars) and he was asking if I'd heard anything about where Tony Bonetti was....I'd been wondering the same thing and I see that someone a few posts earlier asked the same thing....

Does anyone know where or what happened to Tony Bonetti? ( I always loved the looks of the Intrepid...bet that's one that is hard to find plans for....)

Thank you....</p>

RE: Old time pattern pictures
 

Not hard Chris, just impossible - unless you can locate Mr Bonetti http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/js/f...wink_smile.gif I don't know of anyone who flew an Intrepid (anda Triple Trouble) other than Tony which would suggest that no plans were in circulation.

Ray

RE: Old time pattern pictures
 

This was an 8/15/2006 post by Jason Shulman:

RE: Old time pattern pictures
 

Hey Jim your right that's a picture of my Dad and me at the annual RC3 clubs contest. Kickapoo Woods.
That was a great contest that ran for many many years. That area had a nice group of pattern nuts. Good eye dude!!!! Mike

RE: Old time pattern pictures
 

Could someone identify this plane for me? It looks a little 'Mach 1-ish', but the rudder is different.

Tom

RE: Old time pattern pictures
 

That looks like a Mach 8
Sort of a .40 size Mach 1

I don't recall who designed it though...could be Dan Deluca (sp? )
That might be him in the pic?

RE: Old time pattern pictures
 

It was actually the 2nd Mach 1 ever built from Norm's plans and Norm and Gary Leonard cut the cores for us and it was mine. My Dad and I built it and made some small mods. I flew with Norm all the time.Mike

RE: Old time pattern pictures
 

Thanks Mike.  It looks good.  I like the color scheme too.

Tom

RE: Old time pattern pictures
 

Tom the real story is the plane was made from the original Mach 1 plans. The red and white scheme on Norm's famous Mach 1 has a number 2 on the side. It was actually the second version of the Mach 1 and was a plane that went thru some changes mostly to the fuse. Like a lot less side area aft of the wing to help in crosswinds.
What almost nobody knows is Norm designed and actual Mach 2. It had a swept wing and he seemingly hated the plane from the get go and never flew it that much. The Mach 3 was a plane that a number of us built and I actually had some success with it.
It had a shorter wing span and a very thick wing. I can't find a picture of it. It was a great flyer but it was about the time when Norm was going thru a lot of changes in his life and pretty much threw in the towel on pattern. He didn't compete for that many years but he really left his mark in the history of the sport. His intellegence and skill was something to witness. I wish I had been a little older and mature so I could have enjoyed it better.
Mike

RE: Old time pattern pictures
 

Veeerrryyy interesting...
We had 2 Mach 1's in our club back in the mid 70's...one guy had a Webra speed in his and I always loved the way it flew...

There was also a Mach 8 that came along sometime later...it looked very much like the airplane in the above pic.
(after looking at that pic some more, I realize that that plane is too big to be "40 sized" )
The Mach 8 was featured in RCM I believe?

RE: Old time pattern pictures
 

Thanks Mike.

RE: Old time pattern pictures
 

Mike and gents,


In my thread: Redesign and reconstruction of the Oldest taurus on Earth on Page 11 post 260 I do show my simple way of compare the fuselages of planes to get an impression of the sensitivity for crosswind.

Too much surface behind the CG does makes a plane too much weathervane.
With a three wheel (nose wheel) undercarriage and too much cross wind it is also impossible to do the proto taxi maneuver.

The weight of the thick paper/material is representative for side surface without difficult calculations. The neutral point is balance position on the “knife edge”.
Important to know the both models in my situations are (also) nearly the same shape.

So an impression before flying a new plane.
This is also another factor as direction stability because than also shape of the fuse and swept back wings etc, are much important.



Cees

RE: Old time pattern pictures
 

Here it is proptop, courtesy of rainedave I think:

RE: Old time pattern pictures
 

Trisquire...
Thank you [8D]

RE: Old time pattern pictures
 

great photos, takes me back many years. Wondering where I can look at the rules for classic pattern. Interested in knowing if retracts can be used if the model originally was equipped with them. Thanks

RE: Old time pattern pictures
 

just remember, the thread title says old time pattern pictures.

RE: Old time pattern pictures
 

degray,

Have no attention for post 68 ,

Ignore, this was his own post in: Ed Kazmirski's Taurus, as a response on my posts,


Are you interested in Pattern Flying? Look for the rules of the different organizations in the USA, I did read a lot on RCU,
Ballistic Pattern flying Association (BPA) is maybe most interesting for you, not for me in the Netherlands.

See their website with slogan:

http://www.ballisticpattern.com/


My gear up, but I think it is not within the rules of any organization, so I call it "sport", the Orion with retracts, see the pictures.
Ed Kazmirski's Champion Ship of 1960, after modifications!
My idea to build this ship is generated by Jim Messer in the past, in a period to build "variants" of the Taurus, bigger, faster.

See the thread: Top Flite Taurus, page 2 post 50, April, 2004.
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_48..._2/key_/tm.htm

When you read Jim's post 50:

"It has a rear exhaust which interferes with the nose wheel, so have decided this one has to be a tail dragger."
"The ailerons will extend from rib 4 1/2 to 12, and will be wider than usual. If possible, as I get into it, theses will be Friese type, as per the real J-3 Cub. I like these alileons better than any other, so that's the plan."

And that was interesting because Jim did step back to the Orion without writing that down, Taurus, taildragger with frise (no friese!) ailerons.
My Orion has the wing outline dimensions of the Taurus, so a little bigger than the "real Orion" and the modifications are "unlimited", even the wingloading.

Of course my Orion does have the original frise ailerons just the Orion did have. Some people like them, other people not: http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_76...tm.htm#7799557

When we read UStik's post 330:
"the ailerons you show on your Orion seem to be modified Frises, just like the Cessnas have because they are so simple and easy to build. BTW, to me they seem to be a rave of the 1960 like the swept rudder."

UStik only does fly "simulators", never Orion with "frises", so did "bail out" the discussion in post 334. (modified Frises? there are dozens of different frises!)

It is difficult to keep the real inventions of the Old Time Pattern alive when I read these kind of posts from UStik!
The pictures of that period are less, most black and white, and does not show us enough details!

That's why I show modern "Old time pattern pictures" and stories.
(have attention for the smoke of picture 3, ENYA 4 stroke 0.60 (1980?) nearly without an exhaust muffler)

Ed and Jim did know it all!

Cees

RE: Old time pattern pictures
 

Dunno about originally equipped. The kit could come with the option, i.e., option to not put retracts in a retract designed plane or vice versa. I believe SPA rules say that if your plane has retracts, fly with them in the down position.

Crank

RE: Old time pattern pictures
 

Hi,

Had a Mach 1 I bult in winter 1975-1976. See images below. It flew very good. Competed with it in Swedish F3A championship summer 1977 (I was 16 years old then). Rossi 60 with rear exhaust and pipe, adjustable in flight needle, Goldberg rectracts, EK-logictrol Super Pro 7 ch RC system. I later changed to a Rossi 60 with rear exhaust and pipe (pipe was then through/inside the canopy) and I also made modification to the stab so I gave it negative V-shape like Curare pattern plane had. It was very fast with this setup.
It was a great time.

/Bo

http://www.algonet.se/~boem/nostalgi/Mach1.jpg

http://www.algonet.se/~boem/nostalgi/Mach1_landing.jpg

http://www.algonet.se/~boem/nostalgi...ro_1975_02.jpg

RE: Old time pattern pictures
 

Great pictures Bo. I really like the paint scheme on your Mach One. How did you get it so dirty??? Thanks, Mike

RE: Old time pattern pictures
 

Hi Mike,

The "dirt" is from the exhausts leaving the pipe. I do not know what You run 2-stroke 10 cc engines on today but back in 1970th we ran them on 80 % Methanol and 20 % Castrol M 2-stroke oil (based on recin oil) and sometimes also some percentage nitro in the fuel. The planes got really dirty with that much oil but that was what we used then. I used my planes mostly from grass strips so after a whole day of flights oil and grass covered most of the plane right side and right inner wing. It took some time before they where clean and could be carried inside a car for transportation home. As I understand it there are better oils now (synthethic) and only around 10% (plus/minus some percent) of oil is needed in the methanol fuel for 2-stroke engines and that result in less "dirt" on the planes.

/Bo

RE: Old time pattern pictures
 

Thanks Bo.
Do you remember who the hot shot pilot was in the mid 70's from Sweden? I flew against him at the first few TOC's. He was a very skilled piot, nice guy.
Yes I remember running with glow fuel. By the mid 70's I was running Webra Speed 60's but we were using synthetic oils like Klotz by then. Mike

RE: Old time pattern pictures
 

Benny Kjellgren ?

Oops...sorry to butt in :D

Ray