SigKavalier

Funflyers and extreme acrobatic planes aside. Why is it that most people seem to overpower their planes? My father who's and old RC'er says it's to make up for a lack of skill. For example I have a Sig Kavalier with a Magnum .40 XL. It flies nicely and thats the largest engine it's rated for, but people tell me I need more power. I like long scale take-offs and flying not just powering along. I saw a trainer once that had so much power you'd mistake it for a 3D plane I mean it would hover. I have a Sureflight P-39 running an Magun .40 XL (they were on sale) which is also it's highest rated engine. But when I asked about some other stuff on it I got replies that it needed more power. I read others posts about scale planes talking about which motors they've used and said "It flew real scale but needed more power." Maybe I just don't have a clue but it seems a common thing.

Geistware

My Feedback: (16)

I have found that people forget that planes are suppose to fly, not be pulled around by the propeller. I notice guys at my field who stall their planes on take off because they are trying to climb too steeply. I had a guy comment on my takeoff that "I should get a better engine for that plane. It doesn't have enough power" I just look at him and agree. I only use 1/2 throttle at the most for my takeoffs. My plane is a GP Giles swinging a APC 20x10 at 7400 RPM. I only need 1/2 throttle to fly. I need the rest for extended uplines and hot humid days. I for one would welcome scale flying. I enjoy 3D as well but the old 2D flying is what got me in the hobby to begin with!

MikeL

My Feedback: (3)

Scale-like flight isn't bad. It just isn't popular.

vegas mossie

A little off topic, but what kind of landing gear does your P-39 have, fixed or retracts? If retracts, what type. I want to build one of these, but want retracts. The nose gear looks a little tricky. Thanks Loren

rcpilotsteve-RCU

My Feedback: (5)

We have a fellow in our club that fly's scale. It is pretty impressive and additictive. I have adopted his flying skills and strive for the perfect flight. Almost as much as Pattern, I love scale flight. Our field wouldn't be the same without it.
When the War planes come out, the sky is ours.

ajcoholic

My Feedback: (10)

I think that the past few years have seen 3d (both in fixed wing and heli flying) stuff go ballistic. Everyone seems to be going that way, and a lot of guys who fly that style exlcusively dont understand that most planes are actually flown on the wing. Being one guy who is into many different types of planes, I can appreciate both sides. I like my overpowered aerobatic planes (both giant scale and small profile) that can go like snot, and on the other hand I enjoy planes that you have to "fly" around managing your power. To me both are fun and none "cooler" than the other.

If someone puts down your scale type flying, ask them what else they fly besides 3D - if they dont fly anything else, they wont understand anyhow. Just have fun and carry on!

AJC

PS- I still like to have a bit of "reserve" power for getting out to trouble. You can allways throttle back, but a plane that HAS to fly at full power can be dangerous if you get into trouble, say in a strong wind, or in an aborted take off/landing, etc. Having a little extra sure comes in handy.

MAJSteve

My Feedback: (-1)

I have a Kavalier and a Komander - both fly nicer on .40's than bigger engines, plus you don't need to add weight to the tail.

My Kavalier has a K&B .40 with a tuned pipe and it screams by at 1/2 throttle. The Komander has a Magnum .40XL and again, flys best at 1/2 throttle except when doing big loops.

TIGER2PLANE

Well Sig most of the hot fliers in our hobby think that the most power is the way to go. Just like I fly a H9 P51 and I only Put a OS60 in this bird, thats the motor the kit calls for. But you read in other posts where people have but 100's and bigger into this bird. Then they ask how come it wants to nose over on take off or landings. My 60 flys just like the real plane flew and I like it and I still fly at 1/2 speed. I just say to my self that when someone over powers a bird, there goes another nonflyer, and watch then destroy any bird because they didnt build it strong enough to handle the higher power, or they just point and go flyers.

SigKavalier

Wow somebody else has a Kavalier too! I haven't heard much about them or seen any but mine. The guy at the shop told me they were discontinued and he had 2 kits left so I said what the hey. To answer another question the P-39 doesn't have retracts and it lacks the room in the wings for them. I doesn't bother me though since I only have a 4 channel radio and on our ruff grass field I don't think retracts would hold up well. I'm sure someone could engineer a way to install retracts but you'd definitely have to glass the wing. I've heard that the nose gear needs to be strengthened but I don't know about that as I tend to land on the back wheels. I never 3 point as I like the scale landing. Really though for the price of a ARF at around $50+shipping it's hard to beat especially since I'm an on a budget college student. But back to the main subject I guess maybe my having flown gliders for so long it what makes anything with power to me powerful lol. My first RC plane was a Gentle Lady with a power pod which had just enough getup to fly to a nice altitude before it cut off. I know nobody likes a grossly underpowered plane but I feel it should cruise well at 3/4 power just like a real plane. I'd have to say my hardest model to fly is my GWS Zero. It's small size with a small geared electric motor really makes it scale. Not to mention it has very poor low speed handling characteristics.

majortom-RCU

My Feedback: (40)

People will always want to explore the limits of what is possible. When powerful engines are readily available, and high torque servos to handle control surface deflections that no old-fashioned scale aviator would ever think of, people are going to experiment with new ways of getting their kicks.

My idea of fun with model planes comes from watching crazy young men looping and rolling their Piper Cubs over our houses back before WW2. One of them had to ditch (successfully) in the local reservoir. I used to have a snapshot of the tail sticking up as the plane went down in our drinking water, with the pilot in the foreground swimming to shore. I don't know if the Cub is still there, but I never heard of any recovery effort, and in those days everyone knew everything of any interest that happened in our neighborhood.

For me a semi-symmetrical airfoil is a thing of beauty, and the things it can do when flown within its limits will probably fascinate me to the end of my days. But if I were a young man choosing from today's possibilities I'm sure I'd want to try everything that might offer some new excitement.

Volfy

My Feedback: (23)

Some may not admit it, but a lot of it has to do with the macho factor as well. Afterall, this is mostly a guy's sport. Having that hotshot .91 in a .40 plane may not a good flying aircraft make, but it sure gives the owner a whole lot of bragging rights.

Ed

You will rarely see scale flight at your local field. You need to go to a Scale Masters or Top Gun event, to observe people who really know what they are doing.

Taildrager-inactive

My Feedback: (11)

You can come to my field and see many people that know exactly what they are doing. What is scale flight for a Patty W. extra model is certainly not scale flight for a Cub for example. Blazing round the pattern in a Voodoo P-51 Reno racer is certainly scale flight, as putting around barely above stall speed is for a WWI type plane. I think many have scale speed mixed up with slow flight, as many planes were designed with huge power plants that propelled the plane very fast in scale flight.

SDCrashmaster

I've never seen Patty hang on the prop attempting to drag her tail on the ground while other planes are attempting normal flight down the runway.
If it acts like a heli, fly it where the heli guys fly.

Taildrager-inactive

My Feedback: (11)

Who would be dumb enough to try to fly down the runway as someone is doing 3D flying in the center of the runway using all the airspace they need to do their thing. Patty W. in fact flies very precise maneuvers that are used in world aerobatic competition. Matt C. on the other hand does throw his Cap 232 around the sky in very violent 3D maneuvers. I also love to see the model chopper guys doing their 3D in the middle of the runway, not some corner of the field where some would have them fly.

SDCrashmaster

Yeah... at a Heli Event!

MikeL

My Feedback: (3)

I'm sure the guy that started this topic to talk about scale-like flight appreciates the two of you arguing about 3D over the field.

SigKavalier

Well I'm not confusing scale flight with slow flight, but when I see a trainer stall but it won't stall because the motor is juts dragging it along it's over powered. I see a lot of 10 foot rollouts followed by high angles of attack coming off the runway from a large mix of aircraft. I'm surprised at how long this thread has gotten.

Cdallas2

Just take a look over at the Aerobatic Forum. Plenty of questions about stuffing a .90 into a .40 sized plane. It's all a little ridiculous after all. Just look at those TF gold edition planes, most of the call for a .60 - .75. Almost all the ones I have seen have .90's or 1.20 4-strokes. Plenty fast but have a very high wing loading.

My opinion is like yours. Nothing beats a long takeoff roll and long climbing turn to enter the circuit.

Geistware

My Feedback: (16)

I guess we have shown proof that if you put a big enough engine on a brick, it will fly! Next we will go after pigs!

Cyclic Hardover

My Feedback: (3)

Here in NM our filed is owned by the city. What this means is AMA rules appy but you see just about everyplane around and is a good chance to see if it is worth it or not.
*Lets take my Sig Cap 231ex.Nice plane. It is rated for a 1.20 engine. Here at 5000ft, a 1.20 in this plane is a pig. I have seen it.
So altitude is one logical consideration. I run a 3250 in it. The 1.60fx is perfect.

Taildrager-inactive

My Feedback: (11)

If you want a slow flying war bird with a small engine that can't get out of its own way, go ahead. I will have a very powerful motor in my war bird, just the way it was designed to be from the factory. Go ahead & put that 60 in your 60 size bird, I will shoot ya down with my over powered winner.

Nuker

Now that would make a great funfly event. Have the pilots do a 'scale' takeoff. Even a scale landing where they are not 'hovering, just above stall' to bring it in.

We see less and less of that type of flying and see more Saito 1.80's in the .90 sized planes where the throttle control is on a switch instead of a stick (on/off).

But even with lots of engine, as MAJSteve pointed out, you don't need to use it. I like a gentle takeoff but I also prefer having some extra power to help pull out of a stall, a dumb thumbs manouveur or fighting sudden wind that comes up. Other than that 1/2-3/4 throttle is ample and loads more fun; at least for me.

A long scale take off is a lot harder than it looks but is truley a thing of beauty to watch and/or execute; especially with a bi-plane. Planes tend to last long too

Scale is just a term but it has some negative connotations; at least until you challenge someone to try it

Bob aka Nuker

Sneakypete

My Feedback: (5)

I enjoy flying a plane as it was meant to be flown. I fly my Cub as a Cub should be flown and likewise, a Corsair as a Corsair was meant to be flown. This is what I enjoy. The guys and gals that fly the fire belching rockets--its OK--have fun!! What ever floats your boat.

SMALLFLY-

My Feedback: (19)

Another consideration for a large motor is the size of the prop you want to swing. Building a great 60 size warbird with a 60 in it swinging a 12-6 2 blade ruins the whole appearance. put a 100 or a 120 4 stroke in it and your swinging a 14 -7 3 blade and it looks much more impressive with only a small weight gain. That is why they put a throttle on the transmitter, you dont have to fly full bore. Try to do a really large loop with that small engine. The real warbird could do it.