FSA Clubhouse
10-19-2005, 07:41 AM
#2
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RE: FSA Clubhouse
Brilliant idea laddie! You sure can pick 'em! A bucket of suds and some elbow grease will make this a fine lair indeed.
The rack and the thumbscrews will do real well next to the window over there. The center column in the main room is perfect for a whipping post and that dark room at the end of the stairs there would be perfect for the Hall of Shame. Imagine all we could do with such a fine meeting place.
On second thought... why don't we do something really worthwhile for a change instead of constantly suckling off the misfortune of others. All this badgering and bickering is getting old. If we wanted to we could make this thread the envy of the RC community. We could use it as a forum to talk about our learning experiences and the finer points of aeromodeling. The service we could provide to other hobbyists would be invaluable. Just think, we could develop it into a model site that encourages an open and intelligent exchange of new ideas. The possibilities are endless. What an opportunity we have before us..............................
But then again, what would be the point?
The rack and the thumbscrews will do real well next to the window over there. The center column in the main room is perfect for a whipping post and that dark room at the end of the stairs there would be perfect for the Hall of Shame. Imagine all we could do with such a fine meeting place.
On second thought... why don't we do something really worthwhile for a change instead of constantly suckling off the misfortune of others. All this badgering and bickering is getting old. If we wanted to we could make this thread the envy of the RC community. We could use it as a forum to talk about our learning experiences and the finer points of aeromodeling. The service we could provide to other hobbyists would be invaluable. Just think, we could develop it into a model site that encourages an open and intelligent exchange of new ideas. The possibilities are endless. What an opportunity we have before us..............................
But then again, what would be the point?
10-19-2005, 07:41 AM
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RE: FSA Clubhouse
B. Wildered... I like!
I think this was suggested a while back.... thanks for making it happen
Flying Irish... just think of how boring that would be [&o][&o]
Now if only we can get the guys to move........
Blessings!
Albert
I think this was suggested a while back.... thanks for making it happen
Flying Irish... just think of how boring that would be [&o][&o]
Now if only we can get the guys to move........
Blessings!
Albert
10-19-2005, 08:41 AM
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RE: FSA Clubhouse
Hey guys........
a couple of pictures of the field, taken from my Raptor60
This was my first attempt at designing our field on RFG2. I did this a while ago, and I believe some changes have been made since then.
Blessings!
Albert
a couple of pictures of the field, taken from my Raptor60
This was my first attempt at designing our field on RFG2. I did this a while ago, and I believe some changes have been made since then.
Blessings!
Albert
10-19-2005, 05:48 PM
#9
RE: FSA Clubhouse
Ok, for the sake of peace on RCU I will post over here.
My take on this heli thing....
Our pit boxes are to close to the shelter, without redoing the whole field
I think the heli guys should walk the aircraft to the center of the field and fly
from a box.
If the Heli had been placed at the center of the field and the pilot forced to
stand in the flight box, I don't believe the flight would have happen...
it was so dark there is no way he would have tried from a safe distance.
My take on this heli thing....
Our pit boxes are to close to the shelter, without redoing the whole field
I think the heli guys should walk the aircraft to the center of the field and fly
from a box.
If the Heli had been placed at the center of the field and the pilot forced to
stand in the flight box, I don't believe the flight would have happen...
it was so dark there is no way he would have tried from a safe distance.
10-19-2005, 08:58 PM
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RE: FSA Clubhouse
No, not at present! That spinner's probably still 6 feet underground though. These days, I'm glad whenever I bring my Mustang down in 1 piece after those lawn-mower landings. I'm still learning how to fly it without giving the runway a trim every time I land.
PS. I forget who it was that went after that Turkey Vulture on Saturday, but man, that was some funny stuff...
. PS. I forget who it was that went after that Turkey Vulture on Saturday, but man, that was some funny stuff...
10-19-2005, 09:25 PM
#12
RE: FSA Clubhouse
Picked up one of these the other night, it was on my doorstep today...
http://www.swanyshouse.com/mojo/mojo.html
To bad the Mail Man had a bad day and stomped on the end of the box!!!
Now I have to wait for replacement parts.
In other news I have the Showtime finished, but not flown...
OS 120, HS5645 digital servo's, SWB servo arms, 2400 Li-Ion pack,
15 x 6 prop, FAI true turn spinner, remote glow igniter (no reachy under
the plane)
And the Patriot is about half done, but I have lost motivation for now...
It will have retracts with my YS45, tuned pipe, 9x9 or 10x9 prop.
What do you think 100 MPH? It will look fast anyway.
Now if I could just fly as smooth as Dave or Kurt
http://www.swanyshouse.com/mojo/mojo.html
To bad the Mail Man had a bad day and stomped on the end of the box!!!
Now I have to wait for replacement parts.
In other news I have the Showtime finished, but not flown...
OS 120, HS5645 digital servo's, SWB servo arms, 2400 Li-Ion pack,
15 x 6 prop, FAI true turn spinner, remote glow igniter (no reachy under
the plane)
And the Patriot is about half done, but I have lost motivation for now...
It will have retracts with my YS45, tuned pipe, 9x9 or 10x9 prop.
What do you think 100 MPH? It will look fast anyway.
Now if I could just fly as smooth as Dave or Kurt
10-20-2005, 06:03 AM
#13
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RE: FSA Clubhouse
A certain heli pilot was out again last night. No crash, but still doing rockets, hovering within 5 feet of the boxes, inverted hovers over the runway, 1/2 loops into inverted no more than 10 feet away from the boxes. Was he by himself on the line, better believe it, if you go out and fly with him you're an idiot-period.
I would have approached him but only had two newbies as backers including one very nervous polish pilot. Based on past performances and the fact I would like to remain above ground for a few more years, I remained quiet.
Monty: Why not put up a set of temporary rules based on the dangerous situation that occured stating that all heli's will be placed in the middle of the runway, there is no hovering over the runway except to t/o and land. All manuevers will be performed over the grass. Are these not the same rules already posted ?
Once again, post these on the flight boxes and impound. This particular pilot seems to take any advice on safety and flush it and that requires some kind of immediate response. He has had at least a dozen crashes at our field, the majority in or near the pits and parking lot. That is dangerous and should be addressed. Some of our worst F/W pilots have not come close to those statistics.
Remember all of you, it's our field not just his. If he kills or injures someone, we will all lose.
These rules should not even have to be debated, it's just common sense.
Albert, you're almost right but not wrong.
I have seen other heli pilots do some dangerous things with heli's too. But as of late, one in particular (Not the one above) has been very well behaved. Are you concerned with losing heli's all together or do you disagree with the idea of starting in the center of the field and remaining out over the tall stuff ?
The fact is FSA is primarily a fixed wing club. With only a dozen helicopter enthusiast, I would say that the heli guys should be doing everything in their power to keep the majority happy. Yes, we do welcome all forms of aircraft, in fact at one time we offered a control line circle to the local CL club.
I have operated a helicopter at our field. I am nowhere near as good as most of that dozen, yet I have no problem keeping that eggbeater out away from the boxes and pits. It is my goal to fly the thing but also keep others happy, that should go for the others.
Remember:
"In flying I have learned that carelessness and overconfidence are usually far more dangerous than deliberately accepted risk"
Wilbur Wright / 1900
and today's thought: (Love this one !)
"Mix ignorance with arrogance at low altitude and the results are almost guaranteed to be spectacular"
Bruce Landsberg / AOPA Safety Director.
MT
I would have approached him but only had two newbies as backers including one very nervous polish pilot. Based on past performances and the fact I would like to remain above ground for a few more years, I remained quiet.
Monty: Why not put up a set of temporary rules based on the dangerous situation that occured stating that all heli's will be placed in the middle of the runway, there is no hovering over the runway except to t/o and land. All manuevers will be performed over the grass. Are these not the same rules already posted ?
Once again, post these on the flight boxes and impound. This particular pilot seems to take any advice on safety and flush it and that requires some kind of immediate response. He has had at least a dozen crashes at our field, the majority in or near the pits and parking lot. That is dangerous and should be addressed. Some of our worst F/W pilots have not come close to those statistics.
Remember all of you, it's our field not just his. If he kills or injures someone, we will all lose.
These rules should not even have to be debated, it's just common sense.
Albert, you're almost right but not wrong.
I have seen other heli pilots do some dangerous things with heli's too. But as of late, one in particular (Not the one above) has been very well behaved. Are you concerned with losing heli's all together or do you disagree with the idea of starting in the center of the field and remaining out over the tall stuff ?
The fact is FSA is primarily a fixed wing club. With only a dozen helicopter enthusiast, I would say that the heli guys should be doing everything in their power to keep the majority happy. Yes, we do welcome all forms of aircraft, in fact at one time we offered a control line circle to the local CL club.
I have operated a helicopter at our field. I am nowhere near as good as most of that dozen, yet I have no problem keeping that eggbeater out away from the boxes and pits. It is my goal to fly the thing but also keep others happy, that should go for the others.
Remember:
"In flying I have learned that carelessness and overconfidence are usually far more dangerous than deliberately accepted risk"
Wilbur Wright / 1900
and today's thought: (Love this one !)
"Mix ignorance with arrogance at low altitude and the results are almost guaranteed to be spectacular"
Bruce Landsberg / AOPA Safety Director.
MT
10-20-2005, 07:15 AM
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RE: FSA Clubhouse
Kelly,
Hovering is sooooooooooo overrated ! Foward flight is much more challenging !
Real airplanes don't hover !
MT
Nothing beats a nice pair, cept' maybe.......
Hovering is sooooooooooo overrated ! Foward flight is much more challenging !
Real airplanes don't hover !
MT
Nothing beats a nice pair, cept' maybe.......
10-20-2005, 07:51 AM
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RE: FSA Clubhouse
Fwiw, I have been working on a clarified version of the heli flight rules. This is a draft version. There may be changes.
------------
- Helicopters must take off and land from the center of the runway. Putting the helicopter on the edge of the runway (just past the white line) does not provide enough seperation space between the helicopter and the pits. (This is simular to the expectation that fixed wing aircraft will take off and land roughly in the middle of the runway and should not be trying to take off and land right on the runway edge). This means that all helicopters must be carried out to the center of the runway prior to take off.
- All flying of helicopters must take place beyond the far edge of the runway, over the tall grass. This speicifically includes all extended hovering.
- After taking off from the runway, all helicopters must move directly outwards over the tall grass or to the left and then out over the tall grass. (This avoids having a helicopter depart directly across in front of other pilots in the pilot boxes).
- When landing, helicopters will always approach from the left, and land to the left of the flight boxes. (This avoids crossing directly in front of the other pilot boxes at a low altitude and close in).
- Acrobatic takeoffs (high rate of ascent, piretting, etc) shall only be done at the far left end of the runway, and only after the helicopter has taken off normally, flown, and landed at the extreme end of the runway.
- Autorotations and other acrobatic landings shall be performed as a normal landing, ie, only from the left, and not extending to the right of the helicopter pilot box.
- The helipad is for hovering only. No transitional flight or forward flight is allowed in the helipad area. The space is too small for such activity.
- When flying at the helipad, the pilot will stand with their back towards the parking lot. At no time shall the helicopter be closer to the parking lot than the pilot.
------------
- Helicopters must take off and land from the center of the runway. Putting the helicopter on the edge of the runway (just past the white line) does not provide enough seperation space between the helicopter and the pits. (This is simular to the expectation that fixed wing aircraft will take off and land roughly in the middle of the runway and should not be trying to take off and land right on the runway edge). This means that all helicopters must be carried out to the center of the runway prior to take off.
- All flying of helicopters must take place beyond the far edge of the runway, over the tall grass. This speicifically includes all extended hovering.
- After taking off from the runway, all helicopters must move directly outwards over the tall grass or to the left and then out over the tall grass. (This avoids having a helicopter depart directly across in front of other pilots in the pilot boxes).
- When landing, helicopters will always approach from the left, and land to the left of the flight boxes. (This avoids crossing directly in front of the other pilot boxes at a low altitude and close in).
- Acrobatic takeoffs (high rate of ascent, piretting, etc) shall only be done at the far left end of the runway, and only after the helicopter has taken off normally, flown, and landed at the extreme end of the runway.
- Autorotations and other acrobatic landings shall be performed as a normal landing, ie, only from the left, and not extending to the right of the helicopter pilot box.
- The helipad is for hovering only. No transitional flight or forward flight is allowed in the helipad area. The space is too small for such activity.
- When flying at the helipad, the pilot will stand with their back towards the parking lot. At no time shall the helicopter be closer to the parking lot than the pilot.
10-20-2005, 07:54 AM
#18
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RE: FSA Clubhouse
Mike,
Do you still have a link to the airliners.net page for those Spitfires? Looks like wallpaper material.
It's too bad we just had a meeting. Is there a provision for an emergency meeting so any decision about this guy can be nice and official? Apparently the authority of safety officers isn't enough.
-Jeff
Do you still have a link to the airliners.net page for those Spitfires? Looks like wallpaper material.
It's too bad we just had a meeting. Is there a provision for an emergency meeting so any decision about this guy can be nice and official? Apparently the authority of safety officers isn't enough.
-Jeff
10-20-2005, 08:01 AM
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RE: FSA Clubhouse
All-
I've brought this up before but the I believe the solution here is simpler than we think. Enforce the rules we already have in effect!
Below is an excerpt from the Training Manual we used three years ago. This is from the official field regulations which I got from the Club president when I was writing the manual. As far as I know there have been no changes to these since then.
HELICOPTER SAFETY:
29. All novice helicopter pilots must be certified by an Instructor or designated Club Member prior to operating a helicopter at the Club Flying site.
30. Certified Helicopter pilots may practice hovering maneuvers without and Instructor at the designated location.
31. Only one pilot may practice hovering at a time.
32. Hovering maneuvers may not extend beyond a twenty-five (25) foot radius from the pilot.
33. Hovering in the pit area or in the flight line is not allowed.
34. Rotary Wing Aircraft shall not come closer than the center of the runway to a Pilot Box at any time. Rotary Wing Aircraft will take-off and land in the designated area only. During normal flight, Rotary wing aircraft shall follow the same Rules as fixed wing aircraft.
Seems pretty clear to me. Especially 33 & 34.
Slan
PS: If anybody wants a full copy of the regs from the Manual just PM me (if I can figure out how that all works) and I'll be glad to email 'em to you.
I've brought this up before but the I believe the solution here is simpler than we think. Enforce the rules we already have in effect!
Below is an excerpt from the Training Manual we used three years ago. This is from the official field regulations which I got from the Club president when I was writing the manual. As far as I know there have been no changes to these since then.
HELICOPTER SAFETY:
29. All novice helicopter pilots must be certified by an Instructor or designated Club Member prior to operating a helicopter at the Club Flying site.
30. Certified Helicopter pilots may practice hovering maneuvers without and Instructor at the designated location.
31. Only one pilot may practice hovering at a time.
32. Hovering maneuvers may not extend beyond a twenty-five (25) foot radius from the pilot.
33. Hovering in the pit area or in the flight line is not allowed.
34. Rotary Wing Aircraft shall not come closer than the center of the runway to a Pilot Box at any time. Rotary Wing Aircraft will take-off and land in the designated area only. During normal flight, Rotary wing aircraft shall follow the same Rules as fixed wing aircraft.
Seems pretty clear to me. Especially 33 & 34.
Slan
PS: If anybody wants a full copy of the regs from the Manual just PM me (if I can figure out how that all works) and I'll be glad to email 'em to you.
10-20-2005, 08:25 AM
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RE: FSA Clubhouse
ORIGINAL: SpitfireMKI
Albert, you're almost right but not wrong.
I have seen other heli pilots do some dangerous things with heli's too. But as of late, one in particular (Not the one above) has been very well behaved. Are you concerned with losing heli's all together or do you disagree with the idea of starting in the center of the field and remaining out over the tall stuff ?
The fact is FSA is primarily a fixed wing club. With only a dozen helicopter enthusiast, I would say that the heli guys should be doing everything in their power to keep the majority happy. Yes, we do welcome all forms of aircraft, in fact at one time we offered a control line circle to the local CL club.
I have operated a helicopter at our field. I am nowhere near as good as most of that dozen, yet I have no problem keeping that eggbeater out away from the boxes and pits. It is my goal to fly the thing but also keep others happy, that should go for the others.
Albert, you're almost right but not wrong.
I have seen other heli pilots do some dangerous things with heli's too. But as of late, one in particular (Not the one above) has been very well behaved. Are you concerned with losing heli's all together or do you disagree with the idea of starting in the center of the field and remaining out over the tall stuff ?
The fact is FSA is primarily a fixed wing club. With only a dozen helicopter enthusiast, I would say that the heli guys should be doing everything in their power to keep the majority happy. Yes, we do welcome all forms of aircraft, in fact at one time we offered a control line circle to the local CL club.
I have operated a helicopter at our field. I am nowhere near as good as most of that dozen, yet I have no problem keeping that eggbeater out away from the boxes and pits. It is my goal to fly the thing but also keep others happy, that should go for the others.
Mike you know how I feel about safety...... I was almost punched in the face for suggesting to a certain heli pilot that maybe he should operate a bit further out. And this in the presence of the Safety Marshall. As a matter of fact, I believe I expressed the exact same sentiment at the time "If anyone is hurt or killed, we'll all suffer for it".
My thoughts are this.....
1/ If the club is ONLY for fixed wing airplanes SAY SO!!!
2/ If helis ARE allowed, then no one should make out like anyone is doing the heli guys a FAVOR by letting them fly.
3/ If helis ARE allowed, make sure the rules - and there are rules, by the way - are enforced. And that means for ALL heli pilots!
4/ If the rules are not working or are too vague, maybe this is the time to review them.
I think the aim of ALL of us, club leadership in particular, is to encourage a safe, problem free environment, where everyone can have a good time and enjoy their hobby/sport.
I would like to believe I'm a pretty easy going guy. For the most part I try and get along with everyone, and if anything I post on this thread elicits insultive pm's from anyone, then I really do believe that person is out of order!
Blessings!
Albert
edit/ happy to see that in the time it has taken me to write this up, there have been postings that seem to be in a positive direction.
edit 02/ And by the way, why can't anyone correct this one particular individual that appears to be operating in such an unsafe manner?
10-20-2005, 08:47 AM
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RE: FSA Clubhouse
1/ If the club is ONLY for fixed wing airplanes SAY SO!!!
2/ If helis ARE allowed, then no one should make out like anyone is doing the heli guys a FAVOR by letting them fly.
2/ If helis ARE allowed, then no one should make out like anyone is doing the heli guys a FAVOR by letting them fly.
So, while #1 is false and helis are allowed, #2, is quite true. The majority of the membership would agree that we are, in fact, doing the heli guys a favor by allowing them to fly at FSA.
A favor that some of us have actually worked hard to make sure continues. I personally get rather offended when someone takes pedantic, snarky and 'holier than thou' approach and totally disregards the history behind the current status-quo. And on top of that, doesn't listen when informed what the full situation really is. You want to go throwing a bit of text from the website in to my face, then act all bent out of shape when you get a reaction? Sorry, you get back what you give.
Put another way, just because heli flying is allowed does not put on an equal footing with fixed wing flying. You REALLY need to understand this. So far, I don't think that you do.
10-20-2005, 09:03 AM
#22
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RE: FSA Clubhouse
ORIGINAL: Montague
You want to go throwing a bit of text from the website in to my face, then act all bent out of shape when you get a reaction? Sorry, you get back what you give.
You want to go throwing a bit of text from the website in to my face, then act all bent out of shape when you get a reaction? Sorry, you get back what you give.
I rest my case!
Blessings!
Albert
10-20-2005, 12:29 PM
#23
RE: FSA Clubhouse
Just a plane to play in the wind with....
[quote]ORIGINAL: SpitfireMKI
Kelly,
Hovering is sooooooooooo overrated ! Foward flight is much more challenging !
Real airplanes don't hover !
[quote]ORIGINAL: SpitfireMKI
Kelly,
Hovering is sooooooooooo overrated ! Foward flight is much more challenging !
Real airplanes don't hover !