I just read the post from Chook regarding help with a C\L ship choice. I find myself in a similar situation and hope that you can point me in the right direction.

I took my daughter to the Scale NATS this year and she was thrilled. She wants to compete next year so I need to find a plane with the following characteristics: Easy to build (built up wing is ok, but must be a profile), available in a kit, acceptable for beginner scale competition, acceptable for a Thunder Tiger .15 R/C engine (I plan on helping her add throttle control). She is only 11 and has been flying a Brodak Flight Streak Trainer this year, so the model selected does not need to fly aggressively.

Thanks for your input!

Tom

Tom and daughter,
Welcome to C/L profile scale. I was one of the static judges for profile at the 2003 Nats and have flown the event several of the preceeding years. Let me offer a different approach. The builder of the model rule is satisfied if the contestant constructs the model from the equivalent of a typical kit. This means that you could cut out the parts for any plane she wants and she can assemble them. Find a plane she likes and get your documentation drawings. Then take the drawings to Kinko's or some other copy shop and have them enlarged to the desired size--probably 36 wingspan for the .15. Then use the plans to make her kit. Wood sizes the same as her trainer ought to work. The slab fuselage and tail surfaces should be no problem; just trace them. Use any wing airfoil you like, even the scale one! Scale incidences will work for most normal airplanes. Set the CG at 20 or 25% of the wing root cord. The taxi option for the flight routine is a good one for throttle only aircraft. In my experience a wide main gear works better than narrow. Feel free to send me a PM if you want any additional information.
Chuck

Check with Larry Richards at this link:

http://www.builtrightflyright.net/La...sIntroPage.htm

He kits some 15 size warbirds that are exactly what you describe. They aren't cheap, but the quality is astonishing. I have one of his P-40s and it its great! The are reproductions of some old Midwest kits with all the bugs and errors removed. I want to do my P-40 in the colors of the Aleutian(sp?) Island P-40s of WWII.

Kelvin,

Good job! You did indeed spell "Aleutian" correctly.

Paul

Thank you, Paul. I is eddicated beyond my means.....

Check out my 8 year old sons .15 size profile PT-20. It was built by Vaughn Sharp about 30 years ogo. It's a scratch built spin off of a Lew Mcfarland Shark .15. I'm told it will fly the entire AMA patern, but I'll probably never be good enough to find out. It has a Fox .19 for power.

Here's the boy in action!

Maybe I'm just too stodgy, but I can't bring myself to use "Scale" and "Profile" to describe the same plane. Sorry.

Just my opinion.

Bill.

I know what you mean Will but it's a fine way for someone like CL and his daughter or anyone else just starting out to get their feet wet with builiding to a set of rules. And while the model may be simple it's a great canvas for the detailing and color scheme work that can help them along for the step up to "fat" scale.

Green River, your PT suddenly got me thinking about a semi scale stunter with a full fuselage base on the PT. With the sacle simple non-compound curves of the real one it would be a cinch to come up with an Al Rabe like "almost scale" stunt model. Man that would be an eye turner. Too bad I just don't have the intrest in stunt competition these days. Would make a great sport flyer too I suppose.

Ah well, another potential model to add to the list.....

CLFLyer, if you make that model with a Ringmaster style wing it could not only be your daughter's scale model but if you pick the right design it may also serve as her stunt trainer for the basics like wingovers, loops, 8's and inverted. As long as there's enough wing area the ability to stunt or be super stable is more related to the balance point and control throws than the actual design. Set it up super stable for now and trim it for stunting as she gets comfy with it.

Semantics aside, and no argument he should have said "stand-off scale" which is by definition all any profile model can be at best, I'd suggest and you'd probably (?) agree that it's a wiser starting out point for those discovering a penchant for scale. eg: Just as starting out in combat with an F2D Fora or Viper engined Faisov style model isn't recommended. At least it isn't if the operator is persistant and smart enough that he'll end up any good at it.

IMO such an approach to scale is far more likely to result in finished model rather than getting bogged down,, disheartened and disinterested seeing it ultimately shelved in the project to to be completed "when I have the time" category.

As for finding a (profile) scale kit these days. Now there's a contradiction in terms and a quest akin to a search for the Holy Grail, especailly for one suited to a .15. Plans abound though, and if dad's helping, scratchbuilding profile is easy-peasy.

My advice would be to find a subject which arouses a particular enthusiasm, interest and excitement in the builder. Though I'd built a thousand plastic model kits in my youth and still have an avid interest in history and as such ipso facto scale, I admit to being a rank amateur with next to no interest in building scale in either C/L or R/C. As a fairly proficient painter though, the real key is in the colour scheme and quality of the finish which catches and excites the viewers eye, so get the compressor and airbrush out. Here we go with multi-skilling again.

PS: Rant mode on, so tune out now if you're easily offended or have an affinity with political corrrectness.

"What's wrong with 'kids' today?" I so often hear. This is not a put down, but for a 'spoonfed' generation which prides on hearing constant approbation of being "so much smarter" than their forebears, they sure lack good old fashioned "gumption" that my 'boomer' and preceding generations had in their youth. Reflection confirmed by observation makes apparent that there's a certain social value and personal growth advantage in making 'kids' do things for themselves that 'hard' way. Rant mode off.[sm=pirate.gif]

On the idea of desiging your own I have a suggestion.

If you don't mind a biplane then the Boeing F4b would make a great profile with fine color scheme and some potential for aerobatics of that mild sort I described earlier.

Or if a monoplane sounds better some of the late prewar or early wartime birds had HUGE wings compared to the fuselage size. Here again some mild aerobatics could be supported.

Just trying to be helpful....

BM There are some magic looking profile 'scale' subjects around. I've seen a P-38 Lightning suited to a pair of .15's which really looks the part in the air. Free plan from the former APS and not all that difficult to build either. Although for larger than a .15, Midwest's now out of production profile P-39 Airacobra looked and more importantly flew great. Looked the part when dressed up.

For a plane she could build herself, and also be strong enough to survive for several seasons you might consider the SIG Goodyear racers. They make a Buster and a Shoestring. I don't know how true to scale they are but the outline is close at first look.

They have solid sheet wings with an airfoil sanded in, and look good with the scale paint job. As a bonus she could also race them.

Just a thought,

There are lots of choices, here are my comments:

find a set of plans (full bodied, or profile, RC or CL) and enlarge or reduce in size to get the size you want. Then build the fuselage profile style or build from scratch by enlarging 3-views.

What ever you do make sure you have throttle on the plane, you can use electronic controls (I have a book on this subject if want a copy..e-mail at [email protected]...$25 plus $4 shipping) or use the 3-line controls.

I have two articles in Bob Banka's latest catelog on how to enlarge 3-views for scale models

www.bobsairdoc.com

He also has 3-views and photo packs for the documentation.

This is one of the profile scale models I have flown over the years..that is bill young's electronic control handle for 5 channels, throttle, flaps....all with two flying lines.


Good luck,
Fred Cronenwett

<<corrected URL>>

Another aproach would be to ask her what plane or type of plane she is interested in. I would suggest a colorful single engine monoplane for starters. Then locate a kit (if available) or plans. If building from plans, select a full fuselage plan, scale to appropriate size, and use as an outline for a profile fuselage. After the plane is built and she is flying it, she can research details of the real plane and include the full scale details in another plane built with full-fuselage from the same plans.
Learning throttle on a profile is less impact on the wallet.
Good luck with the project.

George

Howdy, Fred.

It's good to see a post from you again. I don't recall having seen your name on any of the CL Forums since Iskandar had to shut his down. I have have really enjoyed and, in fact, have worn out the video you sent to me several years ago about the CL ROW flying at the NW Regionals. You guys were having too much fun and it was contagious.

When did you move to Wichita? Do they have a float plane/amphibian circle there?

Paul

For those of you who tried to copy and paste Fred's referenced web site to your browser's address bar to access the site and the address failed, as it did for me, try the link below. Fred accidentally put a space between the "www." and the "bobsairdoc.com" and the address came up bad. Try:

http://www.bobsairdoc.com/

Looks like a good site and a nice catalog.

Paul

I moved to Kansas this past July...There are flying circles here, but no water pond. So far I haven't seen anyone on the circles on a normal weekend.

Also another idea on the profile fuselage. My Sea Fury was built from 3-views that I enlarged and it was scratch built.

But the fuselage is 1/16 balsa sides with 3/4" x 1/2" sticks built inside for structure then another 1/16" balsa on the other side. Much stiffer than a normal 1/2" thick piece of balsa that has flex to it. In fact the Sea Fury does not have any plywood in the nose section like most typical profile fuselages have.

Land softly,
Fred Cronenwett