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Control line engines

Old 03-07-2007, 06:44 AM
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Default Control line engines

Hi just thought I would ask everyone, which is your favorite control line engine in the .15-.35 range?

I have several FOX 35's, FOX 19, FOX 15 schnuerle ported, K&B 35, McCoy REDHEAD, 19, 29, 35, Enya 15III and several COX TD's, golden Bee, Baby bee..

One of my favorite is the ENYA. I had this in a RINGMASTER JR. as my first plane back in 1977. I remember my neighbor having brand new never run, Foresters, Johnsons, SuperTigers, ect.. Too bad I didn't try and buy them from him before he moved away. There were several..


Anyways I have been lurking on EBAY and have the itch to try and find one of these oldies. Just looking for some input from some of the old school guys from back in the day.

Thanks
Old 03-07-2007, 08:11 AM
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Default RE: Control line engines

I haven't done much with engines smaller than a .29 but in the range you've mentioned I don't think you could do much better than an Enya 35. They last forever and give good power for their size. The 35 is better than the 29 for general flying because the 29 was designed for somewhat higher power so not quite as useful. They come up regularly on the bay, in fact I picked one up not all that long ago so my other one wouldn't feel lonely . Another great engine is the Merco 35, especially the earliest versions, but they're a bit rarer.
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Old 03-07-2007, 09:03 AM
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Default RE: Control line engines

Without a doubt, the OS35Stunt was the favorite. I got no clue how many of them I've worn out.

Last I flew CL regularly, I had to use the 40FS/LA since the 35s were history.

The best engine I every had was a .35 Johnson Stunt Supreme. It put out more power than I'd ever seen at the time and had a two-to-four cycle break that matched the Fox35. I was always amazed that nobody else seemed able to get theirs to run, but I picked up a couple of cheap ones because of that. I think it all amounted to the way they were broken in. None of the used ran worth spit, but I managed to get a piston/sleeve and rebuild one. It ran excellent (and way better than before) after I broke it in. But I'd run into the OS35S by then and they were easy to find and parts were cheap and lots easier to get.

For combat, the Fox36x was my favorite.

For slow rat, the Super Tigres.
Old 03-07-2007, 12:19 PM
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Default RE: Control line engines

A few OPINIONS:

The McCoy red heads (front intake) can range from excelent to dogs, NIB. I have a couple of .35's that are excelent. Most of the engines you list should be good runners.

Most ENYA engines are good. I have from .09 to .40...all good.

The later Forster engines were under-rated IMHO. I have two .31's that run well.

Most of the ones you mention are iron/steel and should run 22%-25% all-castor lube fuel...especially if well used. The Fox .35 and possibly the McCoy .35 are exceptions in that they should run ~28% castor. The Fox is a "maxed out" size for that case and needs the cooling assistance that more lube provides. Some run with less lube, and some of those have the worn out engines to prove it. Ya takes yer chances...

Yes, you should have tried to buy those engines.

George
Old 03-07-2007, 02:37 PM
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Default RE: Control line engines

I used have had many but there was a OS .29 with a black head that I had on a Golberg Cosmic wind that was just phenominal. One flip and off you go! The 4/2 break was bang on and she flewthat plane with authority!! Wish I still had that engine. I DO have a couple of OS 35 stunts "new in the box" , a Tigre g21 .46 stunt that still runs great. Enys's in the 19, 29 and 35 size range. Several Fox 35's.

Cant seem to get rid of my childhood!!!!!



Old 03-08-2007, 03:42 PM
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Default RE: Control line engines

UKIE,

In your selection of engines, the Fox 35 and 15 Schneurle are probably the most practical to bash around now - parts are available.

They are also quite good for the purpose. The Fox 19 - I presume the 4-bolt backplate, baffle piston engine, is also a dandy, but, again, parts may be a mite scarce.

The 15 Schneurle weighs about as much as the Stunt 35, and if you insist on winding it up, it can give about as much power. BUT, at a whole different RPM range. The 15 Schneurle is a good engine for what we used to think of as smallish 29 size models - it is too much power and a bit heavy for what we once considered 1.5 - .19 models.

Fox engines work best on an oily fuel - the Stunt 35 on at least 25% castor; the 15 Sch possibly down to 22%-25% total oil, mostly castor.

C'mon home to CL. The friends are among the greatest modeling buddies you'll ever find.
Old 03-08-2007, 04:28 PM
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Default RE: Control line engines

My all time favourite C/L engine is the Rossi R15 F2A engine.
When it arrived on the FAI C/L speed scene in the early seventies it was a revolution.

/Red B
Old 03-13-2007, 08:53 PM
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Default RE: Control line engines

iam trying old combat whats the best engine for this
Old 03-14-2007, 03:30 PM
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Default RE: Control line engines

Great stuff guys. I have been running nitro trucks the past few years and have forgotten how much different the fuel mix is for planes vs. trucks/cars. Won't be using any of thatose fuels for my Fox's and such...

I just found an old Fox 35X? It has a square bodied carb and an aluminum insert. I believe it is a combat engine. Are there any other identifiers that would help me find out if this a Fox35X? I also notice the wedge on top of the piston looks pretty tall. It has a lot of compression.
Old 03-15-2007, 06:08 PM
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Default RE: Control line engines

For me its an Aerotiger .36. Hands down the best stunt motor ever developed in this size range. You don't even have to look or ask. When you hear a stunter in it there is nothing that gives as perfect a pure 2-4-2 stunt run. If its in the air you know it by the perfection. Its totally plug and play. No fooling around. Just gas and go. Takes all the motor work out of competative CL stunt in this size range. I gave up on stunt in this size years ago just cause I didn't care for big block planes and got tired of fooling around with everything else, even stuff done by very reputable engine folks.

Bob Branch
Old 03-15-2007, 10:50 PM
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Default RE: Control line engines

G'day Ukie,
If by old combat you mean the vintage variety mostly using 2.5 Diesels, I'd suggest you get a hold of one of Steve Rothwell's R250. A real gem of a motor, based on the Oliver Tiger. http://www.smrpl.com.au/_engines.htm
It's currently cleaning up in Vintage A team Racing.

A number of them were used at our nationals in Vintage Combat to good effect. ie strong enough to pull smallish 60's combat wing through very tight manouevers.

For a sport 15 I love my Thunder Tiger 15's on 10% nitro with an 8x4 prop, just nice!!

Old 03-15-2007, 11:06 PM
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Default RE: Control line engines

UKIE
If you're hunting ebaaaa for old engines and you like Enyas then keep an eye out for the model 6001 Enya 45. These are a fantastic stunt engine but obviously just as good for a bit of sport type flying. The later 6002 wasn't anywhere near as good for CL because it was timed for RC. OK, it's a bit bigger than the .15-.35 range but well worth looking for.
Old 03-16-2007, 05:19 AM
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Default RE: Control line engines

I am looking at a K&B Torpedo Green head. .19 and a .35 Can anyone give some info on these engines. Are they a stunt engine? Combat? Are they smooth running or rougher like a McCoy? What years were they produced?

Thanks all
Old 03-16-2007, 06:11 AM
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Default RE: Control line engines

Hi UKIE

K&B Green head torpedos are mid to late 50's vintage and with the exception of the 29S were basically F/F engines which means they rev which is not really what you want for C/L stunt. The 29S was the standard K&B 29 G/head with milder timing produced to take on the Fox 29 and as an alternative would be the best of the bunch for C/L use.

Ployd
Old 03-16-2007, 09:02 AM
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Default RE: Control line engines

The green heads were around in the 60s but weren't used by many people for stunt. They didn't handle well in a stunter. And they didn't put out the power right for the usual size stunter at the usual speed. And I can't remember seeing a one of them on any combat wing that made it past the first rounds against the ST35s or Fox36Xs.
Old 03-19-2007, 06:08 PM
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Default RE: Control line engines

I have found this engine. Super Tigre G-21 "V" .35 Brand new. Is this a stunt engine? I am very unfamiliar with Super Tigre engines and couldn't find a lot of info on them.

I also found a very nice K&B 29S Torpedo green head.

How about a Johnson .35? Again are they a good stunt engine?

Thanks for any info.
Old 03-22-2007, 12:00 PM
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Default RE: Control line engines

UKIE,

Most K&B green heads were good running engines in the early/mid nineteen fifties. Manufacturers started making specialized engines and most general purpose engines went away. Fox had their EXCELLENT stunt .35, then came out with the "Combat Special" which ruled the roost for awhile. OS Max had their day, and Supertigre made excellent combat engines (although some had crankshaft problems).

Supertigre had so many different engines back then that only a picture could really identify it. For instance, I have, I think, the first generation G21-35. It has a removable front and back. I believe that it was one of the ones noted for breaking crankshafts.

Fox kept making improvements to their "Combat Special" and flyers knew the different models by MK-1, MK-2, etc.

Johnson made a good combat engine but some were more for stunt. I do not have any, so perhaps someone else will explain the differences.

George
Old 03-22-2007, 12:18 PM
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Default RE: Control line engines

Thanks George. This is going to be a dumb question, but after looking at the green head engines I noticed the exhaust is on the right side when viewed from the front of engine. Does the engine get mounted on the inboard side of the plane? Never seen an engine like this before.

Here is the link to the Super Tigre. getting expensive now.
Thanks again


http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...2465&rd=1&rd=1
Old 03-22-2007, 02:46 PM
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Default RE: Control line engines

Talk about johnson engines i used used to fly CL and had a B52 with two .29 red head johnsons must have been late 59 or 60s was a fast engine to start and flew great on the plane miss them motors.
Old 03-22-2007, 04:38 PM
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Default RE: Control line engines

Many engines from the era of that green head had the exhaust on the opposite side to what we're used to seeing now. In theory it's supposed to be the better way to do it on the assumption that the crankshaft spinning around swirls the mixture in the direction leading into the transfer port. In practise it doesn't seem to make any difference. There's still arguments raging about whether the Dooling 29 originally came with a RH exhaust or LH (it can be assembled either way).

As to why all engines nowadays have the exhaust facing the way it does now, I think your question pretty much answers itself. When side mounting started to be used it's logical to put the cylinder to the outboard side as part of tip weight but then they'd have the exhaust blasting straight up into their face (no mufflers back then). Maybe it was a kind of Darwinian evolution, RH exhausts weren't as successful as LH exhausts .
Old 03-22-2007, 08:01 PM
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Default RE: Control line engines

I don't understand a theoretical advantage to a right hand exhaust. This has the crank turning away from the base of the bypass, which one would think was not a good idea. On the other hand, I've flown K&B 4011's in stunt a good bit with the exhaust mounted both ways and could see no difference in performance.

The Torp 19 came out in 1952, or perhaps a litle earlier. The Greenhead 35 was the Gonzo combat engine in the Mid-1950's, but gave way to Johnson, then Fox, ST, and OS engines.
Old 03-23-2007, 12:36 AM
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Default RE: Control line engines

Back before dirt, when I flew CL Stunt a lot, the Fox .35 was my favorite along with Fox Superfuel. Then I started using ST G-21 40s breathed on by George Aldrich which were excellent. Then I breathed on a couple of Fox .40 Stunt engines myself, and they were equal to the STs. One that was NOT worth a DA_N was the gray case McCoy 40 that cost me my only chance of ever qualifying in a NATs -- Glenview 1971. I got sucked into swapping out my ST for a pre-production McCoy GC 40 which was a ugly thing with K&B 4011 innards. Only had 4 flights when I went for the first official. Had a barn-burner going, I couldn't believe I could fly like that. Coming out of the last part of the 4-leaf clover that sucker went into rat-race lean for a 11 minute run. No landing or pattern points. Second flight was too rich and looked like a da_n first timer wobbling around the sky. Never got that thing to run for sour grapes. Yuck! RC took over after that. [sm=48_48.gif]

In RC I loved engines like the STs with bolt-on front cases where I could swap exhausts. This machine has two Como 61 with the turn-around engine some 500 RPM stronger than before and the other. Plane flies / flew excellent. Now waiting a rebuild after a glitch between the ears. Will do it again in not too distant future.
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Old 03-23-2007, 07:47 AM
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Default RE: Control line engines

ORIGINAL: Jim Thomerson
I don't understand a theoretical advantage to a right hand exhaust. This has the crank turning away from the base of the bypass, which one would think was not a good idea.
Aaaaarrrggghhhh.....Jim, you're quite correct. Can I blame it on brain fade? Old Timer's Disease? Latent dyslexic? What on Earth was I thinking....
Old 03-23-2007, 10:51 AM
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Default RE: Control line engines


ORIGINAL: downunder
There's still arguments raging about whether the Dooling 29 originally came with a RH exhaust or LH (it can be assembled either way).
I have a three view and parts list (PDF file) that shows a Dooling .29 with exhaust on the right side. My Dooling .29 is in parts, in a box, though.

UKIE,

On the K&B, before mufflers were used, it was nice when flying at dusk to see the warm glow (on an upright installation).

You mount them just like any other engine.

George
Old 03-23-2007, 05:52 PM
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Default RE: Control line engines

Thanks everyone for the information. That must be something having the exhaust pointing up like that. Yikes!

gcb, I can invision what it must have looked like at dusk...

Anyone happen to look at the ebay link I posted of the SuperTigre? I am curious to know if this is a good C/L engine and is it somewhat recent?

Thanks to all

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