edh13

My Feedback: (9)

You guys have probably seen the crash footage, but this is the first time I've seen this angle. Had to be taken from the tower. The photographer just got lucky he couldn't have known what was happening when he shot. The Air Force did confirm pilot error recently. I can't believe a F-16 pilot has to worry about setting field elevation.

SkyDude

Jeez, I'd be just a tad nervous if I was the photographer. There's an unpiloted F-16 coming right at him! I haven't seen this before, any video or additional picture links? Was anyone hurt?

Isaiah 40:31

I respectuflly question the validity of the photo-image.

edh13

My Feedback: (9)

That is about the most polite way you can call somebody a... LIAR! Yea, I can accept your skepticism over this too good to be true shot. But if your familiar with the Thunderbird accident at Mountain Home Idaho and have seen all the different video (including a bich'n view of the pilot from a dash cam) you'll come to the conclusion that this is very much real. The resolution of the copy I got was outstanding, 2.4mb. I can zoom in and see all the detail. I can see if I still have the video's on my PC and email them. Or just Google "Thunderbird crash Idaho" and see what you come up with.

Eric

P-51B

My Feedback: (5)

Once you see the video you'll understand why the cameraman probably wasn't overly worried. While the 16 is looking at him, it was traveling very much downward at this point.

Here's a sight that has a video.

http://www.ktvb.com/cgi-bin/bi/video...?title=5101714

LearjetMech

I really respectfully question the validity that gives you the right to question the validity of that picture. Before conclusions should be made, do a little more research next time. This picture is real, as I posted it in the full scale forum. There are multiple videos from different angles. If you look closely, all the flight control surfaces point to why this guy ejected. Two seconds later and that plane you see was a smokin hole in the ground! The Thunderbirds are always filmed by the ground crew with in cockpit cameras looking both at the pilot and over the pilots head, not to mention the umpteen billion spectators filming them each year! Most likely this photo was taken from far away with a nice zoom lens! Sure I bet it was a lucky photo, it might even be an image taken from a digital video recorder! Damn I hate that. Enjoy the pic!!!!

Jim C.

21/2004 - LANGLEY AIR FORCE BASE, Va. (AFPN) -- Pilot error caused a U.S. Air Force Thunderbirds F-16 aircraft to crash shortly after takeoff at an airshow Sept. 14 at Mountain Home Air Force Base, Idaho. The pilot ejected just before the aircraft hit the ground.

According to the accident investigation board report released Jan. 21, the pilot misinterpreted the altitude required to complete the "Split S" maneuver. He made his calculation with an incorrect airfield altitude. The pilot incorrectly climbed to 1,670 feet above ground level instead of 2,500 feet before initiating the pull down to the Split S maneuver.

When he realized something was wrong, the pilot used maximum back stick pressure and rolled slightly left to ensure the aircraft would hit away from the crowd should he have to eject. He ejected when the aircraft was 140 feet above ground -- just eight-tenths of a second before impact. He sustained only minor injuries from the ejection. The aircraft, valued at about $20.4 million, was destroyed. There was no other damage to military or civilian property.

Also, the board determined other factors substantially contributed to creating the opportunity for the error including the requirement for demonstration pilots to convert mean sea level and above ground level altitudes, and performing a maneuver with a limited margin of error. (Courtesy of Air Combat Command News Service)



straight from the horses mouth. the Air Force Investigators

McLeodAviation

My Feedback: (70)

Awsome picture. Im glad the pilot ejected safely and nobody was hurt.

3D-kid330

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He is pointing up! Why did it hit the ground?

3D-kid330

Isaiah 40:31

3D-Kid, I was wondering the same thing. However, it is more than possible in a high sink rate (ie. dive) maneuver (such as the split-s) that a descent persists for a time beyond the change in attitude of the aircraft. I have seen this myself with my own r adio control aircraft, and with video of full size aircraft, where when the aircraft hit, it actually touched tail first. This would be exacerbated by there being an aerodynamic stall of the wings or tail surfaces. I am not sure if the F-16 fly-by-wire system permits a stall of any surfaces, however.

GraupnerFan, it would be great to have a link to that news site. I have chosen not to comment regarding those who question my intent to discern the veracity of a thing.

RichD

went to atleast 5 diff sites listed in the google search........

http://www.google.com/search?sourcei...rd+crash+Idaho

Jim C.

http://www.af.mil/stories/story.asp?storyID=123006413

the fly by wire does not permit departure from controlled flight.. you can stall it if you really really push the issue. he hit the ground do to the altitude ,and sink rate. came out of the split S and was pulling full back but the sink rate was too great and the time to recover was too short.. so in otherwords, he pancaked it..

edh13

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http://www.authphoto.com/maatbirds/indextb.htm

More copyrighted stills.

Eric

antslake

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Look at the vapor on the wings, that should tell you which way the plane was actually moving.
It was coming straight down at that point, like a harrier. The plane was stalled.

Jim C.

vapor trail??? all i see is the ejection process and by products entering the airstream. its all the rocket exhaust.

LearjetMech

From what I hear the F16's computers will not let it stall. Supposedly they perform that manuever "on the AOA limiter", and play with the throttle to apex the bottom. Since he entered the manuever 1000 ft low, he had no chance. At the point of that picture, he is in full burner. He screwed up, but his training payed off as he got out in time! The in cockpit video shows his hand dancing from throttle to ejection handle 3 times on the down side.

P-51B

My Feedback: (5)

Because the AMA limited his thrust to weight ration to less than 1!

LVsRCSA

GraupnerFan hit the nail on the head. It's that whole weight, gravity, and aerodynamics thing. He was hardly pointing straight up, he barely got it leveled out before he pulled the "D" rings. As you can see in the pic, he was trying real hard to pull that thing up, but it did pancake. Next time you're out flying, pull a few loops and see how your plane reacts at the bottom of the loop and you can see how he wouldn't be able to make it out of the manuever.

3D-kid330

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Oh, I get it now. Like being in a harrier with full spoilerons on. Must have been sinking fast.

3D-kid330

antslake

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Exactly, watch the video and you will understand.
I did not say vapor trail Graupner, I said vapor on the wings. It was a result of the vacum being created from pulling up so dam hard. The plane smacked flat on to the ground.
And the plane was stalled at the time if the picture, because it was not flying anymore and was heading straight down in a horizontal position.

Lord

I would assume he is not a Thunderbird anymore? 1,000 ft is a big error in that business!

Bill

[link=http://www.rob.com/matt/videos/Thunderbird.mpg]In cockpit video[/link]

runover1

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Did you read that this was his first air show with the TBs? He was number 6. If you can watch the cockpit cam, it shows the evidence of full deflection of the control sufaces and the ever so slight roll to the left. He was a great pilot, but like someone else said, 1000' error is too much, it would have only taken 100' or less to have a catastrophic accident when in formation or heading towards eachother. I would assume the airshow stopped suddenly, right?

Spadinator

They stop the shows immediately!!!! I was present at a TB crash at Hill AFB when a T-38 stalled and crashed into a barn killing the pilot. The show was over.....very sad for the pilot and his family.[]

edh13

My Feedback: (9)

Talk about a sad day… I was at Nellis for Red Flag 82-1, we were there with our F-4’s from Ramstein AB. Watched the T-birds take off for there routine run out to Indian Springs. About an hour later tower called “Four T-38’s down at Indian Springs, Four soles on board.” We all knew instantly that if all 4 hit the ground, they followed each other in and nobody was going to be coming home. I think the solos landed at Indian Springs because I don’t remember them coming back either.

rcpro-123

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hey the video link dont work is there another one?