Just installed solobosses modified flybar and was doing a light test flight when CLACK! my heli went down. I don't think i was flying it hard but when I took a close look to see what happened I noticed that my upper and lower blades hit each other. Did I do something wrong? I've never heard of the two blades clacking.

I don't know anything about soloboss flybar, but I do know clacking and it sucks.... I usually go outside with no wind.... many times its when the air takes it a little and you over compensate just enough that to two upper and lower, blades CLACK. I went thru 8 lower blades and 5 upper just this week.... I really need to get the main inner extension shaft so that the blades dont clack as easy.... also need to get xtreme blade grip and folding blades to really reduce the clacking. I tried the alum microheli but was not able to fit to cx2. Pending exchange or refund[] in the meantime went back to stock blades.[:@]


Good luck
Joe

Eat2muchrice,
Have you read through heli setup guide? http://www.heli-max.net/mediawiki/in..._and_CX2_Setup

There is a lot of information in there and I've covered the reason for the blade clack in some detail. It's caused by the lower blades working the way you command (via the right control stick / servo / swash / links / lower head). The servo bone's connected to the swash bone . . . you know the song.

Anyhow, take forward flight for example. You move the stick to full forward and the rear of the lower rotor rises and the front of the lower rotor drops. That drops the heli nose and away the heli goes. But - the upper rotor is doing exactly the opposite movements because the flybar is working as it is designed. It is fighting forward flight with all the power it can muster.
OK, if you suddenly reverse the right stick, the lower rotor reverses its angle - the front edge of the rotor rises to tilt the heli back so forward motion stops. And of course the upper rotor and flybar reverse also but far more violently when you transition from forward to backward than it did when you went from hover to forward. The air speed added from the forward flight really gets the aerodynamics of the blades in hyper mode.

IMPORTANT: The *LIFT OF THE LOWER FRONT ROTOR FRONT EDGE* and the *DROP OF THE UPPER ROTOR FRONT EDGE* causes a collision of the upper and lower rotor blades.
WHACK!
Whack is clack.
Clack is death.

With the heavy stock flybar the pitch of the upper rotor blade can actually be reversed! It can push DOWN when you force it to act at its maximum potential.
Moving the control links farther out on the servo horns makes it worse.
A lighter weight flybar has less fight so the clack is reduced. (that's the whole reason for the mod. It's lighter weight and has less ability to fight the lower rotor.)
Stiffer blades reduce clack. (upgrade blades and grips)
More gentle control input reduces clack. Remember that this is a trainer in stock form. We can reduce clack, but it won't be eliminated until you go with the full performance mods.

Fly more gently and learn to fly well - then either mod the CX2 or buy a performance heli and learn to fly all over again. But next time you'll have the basics burned into your brain. Which is why you got the CX in the first place.
The reason for the flybar mod is to make a very low cost mod to a stock CX / CX2. It will certainly improve the performance. And with that increased performance comes more problems as you learn to fly on the edge. And it's also more fun. And it never ends, as each improvement increases performance - and the potential for air disaster.

We've all been where you are and you will work through it in your own way. 1)Lightweight flybar, 2) longer inner shaft, 3) Xtreme upper head (I understand that the Xtreme upper head is taller and also restricts the movement of the flybar, which should greatly reduce blade clack) Each change listed costs a little more than the prior one and probably works a little better.
Note that as you read about the upgraded helis, you don't hear about blade clack. You hear about running into things at high speed and inverted landings and more expensive breakage. But it's all good. That's why we're here.
Soloboss

eflite blades are worse than crack! - gotta have em, gotta have em, gotta have em - withdrawal symptoms an all

yep, blade clack is da killa - listen to soloboss, for he is the master of the coaxial blade

i keep telling myself that i am the master of the fixed pitch, but i know i'm just not there yet


edge

When you master fixed pitch, you let us know. Man have I got some questions for you!
Yesterday I broke my flybar paddle off and I was asking at the LHS about the flybar length for my Falcon. Shorter length bar is softer control. Longer length bar is more responsive control. I've added that to my data base.
Soloboss

longer = more paddle leverage = faster response - shorter lever, less response but more load on servo - if you could find some smaller paddles you could achieve slower control with less servo load

for the falcon 40, you can replace the cf flybar stick with a piece of align tail servo wire and have a fixable metal flybar - adds a touch more weight so slower control - be sure to flatten the 4 areas that will be contacted by the screws or it will wander

had to do that on the tiny little walkera 4#3 as i kept snapping off the flybar up inside the brass holder and it was a bugger to get it out - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AOxKkOUjsCY


edge

Soloboss,
First off I owe you a huge THANKS! For your guide on cx helis. I'm new and have been only flying for 3 weeks and without your guide I'd probably be grounded by now.
I will be looking into buying some upgraded blades in the near future.
Could it also be the weight of my blades? My first set of blades where covered with so much tape/glue/expoxy that I was amazed that it could fly, but never had blade to blade clack. Right after I installed brand new balanced blades they went BANG!

You TAPE your blades?
And you GLUE you rbaldes?
And you EPOXY your blades?

Heh, heh, I bet I could draw you a sketch or just where the tape, glue and epoxy are located on your blades. Been there, done that, got the frustration to go with it.
I got tired of buying blades at a wallet flattening rate, so I repaired the blades as best I could. I could afford new blades but I was such a lousy pilot that I could hardly reward my lousy piloting skills with new blades. So I repaired them knowing that I'd get new blades when I got better at flying.
But the repaired blades cause the tracking to go bad. And that causes the upper head to shake. And that causes the flybar to work really badly. And that leads to more collisions with earth bound objects. And blade clack. It's a vicious circle, isn't it?
AARGGGGHHH the frustration. And that is what pushed me to look into these little helis and write the article about how they work - and why a really good design makes us NUTS!!!

The Eflight CX series is a wonder of engineering. The blades don't fit as well as they did a couple of years ago because the mold dies are wearing out, but a little sandpaper where the upper blade mount pinches the head when you screw it together will allow the upper blades to pivot easily. It's not so bad. The heli is still a wonderful trainer. I can't say it's the best because I haven't tried the rest, but it is VERY upgradeable when you are ready. Until then, just go easy. Learn tail in hover. Learn nose in hover - then side in - then the other side. My frustration is not nose in, it's the transition from nose in to tail in and back. As a pilot I still suck. Maybe it's my destiny. But I like the CX well enough to go the full Sport Racer route (with a few changes in the name of weight saving).
And my sim is paying for itself slowly as I crash and burn on-screen.

Go easy and good luck. And ENJOY! It's a hobby, not an occupation.
Soloboss

Solo my good buddy My Walkera #4 is coming and I need your guide for it now So when can we expect a guide on the Trex??? Just kidding. I sure would appreciate your thoughts on the Fixed Pitch though....I'm gonna need as much help as I can get on that thing.

If you think thats funny you should see the body. I've gone to the extent of even filling the tail up with expanding foam. There is so much expoxy that it looks like spidermans costume. but untill I have mastered this heli i'm not going to dump big money into it. I know parts are cheap but $5 here and $5 there it all starts adding up fast. Its also all a great learning experiance. "can't learn to walk without falling down"

You know if your heli is heavy from foam and glue and tape and what ever then the blades are going to be flexed more , working so hard to keep the heli in the air and blade clack will be easier to happen.

You gonna post photos? That has to be a riot!
If you are filling the tail with foam and epoxying the blades you are getting some interesting practice. You might find that when you restore the heli to stock you have become a pretty good pilot!
I agree that you can't learn to walk without falling down, but if you tie your shoelaces together, you're doomed to failure.

It's your budget and I'm not going to tell you how to spend it. And I've been through the frustrations that you are going through. Hmmm, that sounds like I'm not still going through those frustrations. Fact is, I am. I was just outside with a little breeze. I have a bunch of upgrades and I expected the heli to do really well. Flight is a fight, even with the good stuff, if there is a breeze. I don't have a straight line breeze, I'm working with what washes over the house so it's a breeze and downdraft situation. But it's still frustrating. Although not as bad as yesterday when I flew into the ceiling fan.

I have pictures up in the " CX2 *Pics*and Upgrades. " section. My heli flies great, but I still keep striving for perfect.....then i crash![:@] Back to the start! but the person i really feel bad for is my wife.

That's why we invented velcro.

Remember how we have all talked about the upgrade blade grips and how it seemed that they should run loose, but they didn't work that way? And then I made my own and I ran them really loose and they worked fine. And then others with the upgrade grips loosened them up and the heli flew fine with the grips loose - and we all wondered why? rmember all that?

Check this out. It is "common knowledge" that the Falcon and Walker #4 will not fly with loose grips. They shake and just can't seem to get the blades aligned.
So of course I had to try just one more time. I mean, if the little CX and those little tiny blades will swing straight, the falcon and those big ole blades just HAS to work.
Ya know what?
With the grips fully loose, it works just fine. I carried the heli to the garage by the tail and the blades were both pointed at the ground. I set the heli on the floor and moved the blades so they weren't both on the same side of the heli so it didn't tip over, but they were no where near aligned. I spun it up slowly, the blades aligned and it flew just fine. It handled pretty radical jinking and never folded a blade. On the ground I slowed the rotor gently and stopped it - then flew again. And landed in a most undignified manner, although still upright. I throttle up gently, the blades realigned and off she went better balanced than I usually get it by manually aligning the blades.

So what happened? My heli with one 7.4v 850 mah 15C - 20C pack weighs in at a 293g. The stock Falcon with NiMH pack is listed as 350g. I thought that it was my SUPER SKIDS because they add a good deal of weight and require a good deal more head speed. But that doesn't play in this tune. I'm under stock weight.
I'll try again with the super skids and stock battery. Don't go away.
It's fine. Solid as a rock. It takes a lot more oomph to get up and away, but there's no shake.
So what don't I know?
I'm copying a friend with an EF Sabre who will be as puzzled as I am. Like he, I was spend too much time aligning blades after each abript landing.
Anyhow, for those moving to single rotor, perhaps this post isn't entirely off topic.

Soloboss

Velcro was invented for your wife?
Hmmm. Tell her thank-you.
LOL

HA If my wife invented Velcro then I wouldn't be flying toy helicoters. I'd have my own fleet by now and you could be my mechanic. You could install your custom flybars on all the helis.