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Hacker XL Maintenance

Old 07-31-2009, 06:13 AM
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najary
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Default Hacker XL Maintenance

Hi all,

I have about 500 flights on my Hacker 13 XL, What are the common parts that had to be replaced, and normally after how many flights ?
I assum that it will not last for ever.

Regards,

Isaac Najary
Old 07-31-2009, 06:45 PM
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Default RE: Hacker XL Maintenance

Isaac: What is your maintenance schedule (e.g., relubrication of the gearbox) for your C50 and what type grease have you been using?

Mike Moritko
Old 08-01-2009, 12:04 PM
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Default RE: Hacker XL Maintenance


ORIGINAL: FLYERSG

Isaac: What is your maintenance schedule (e.g., relubrication of the gearbox) for your C50 and what type grease have you been using?

Mike Moritko
Hi Mike

I grease the gearbox every 70 flights with the Hacker grease.

My question was about replacing the magnets, bearings, cogwheels,
etc.

Best regards,

Isaac Najary

Old 08-01-2009, 01:27 PM
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Default RE: Hacker XL Maintenance

Isaac

The planet gear bearings are the most critical lube point in the Hacker gearbox. I've found that they will wear and develop excess clearance on the pins over time - probably on the order of 700+ flights or so even when properly lubed. These are Timken drawn cup roller bearings and the gear side of the load is carried by the bearings "cup", which is where the wear occurs. These bearings are available at bearing supply places and are low cost (about 3 USD ea.) Press the old bearing from the gear and the new in - keeping the bearing position in the gear the same.

If solvent is used to clean the gearbox it can dilute/remove lube from the rear "prop shaft" bearing. The bearing will feel rough when rotated as it's failing. A little heat (heat gun) on the gearbox and the bearing will drop out with a slight tap, simply drop a new one in (there are snap rings between the bearings to position them properly). These bearings are also readily available, just search the web for the bearing number.

I've had one slight rotor separation (C50-14 Comp) which created end force on the motor bearings. The front motor bearing became noisey and rotated in the front case - ruining the case. When I lube the gearbox, I now check for rotor end play - a slight bit indicates that the rotor hasn't separated. Other than this rotor separation, I've not had any indication of rotor demag or weakening basis current draw / temp / power in over 1000 flights.

I use Shell Stamina RLS-2 lube for the gearbox, relubing every 100 flights. A "trick" is to fill excess space around the planet carrier with grease - do this by putting a large filet of grease in the housing before installing the prop shaft / planet carrier, then remove the excess displaced by the carrier. This prevents the grease in the gears from being displaced to this space, it then remains where it belongs - circulating through the gears. Like I mention first - the planet gear bearings are lube critical - be sure to pack grease well into these.
Old 08-03-2009, 12:36 AM
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Default RE: Hacker XL Maintenance

Hi Earl

Thank you for your answer.

As a aircraft technician (F 4 phantom), I understand the mechanical failures.

I don't have enough electric knowledge.
I would like to know what are the theoretical electric failures that can appear in electric motors, and after how many flights it happens.
I heared that the motor's magnets theoreticaly gets weak during time, is that true? can it appear in a period of possible use of electric motor (2000 flights)?

Thanks in advance

Isaac Najary
Old 08-03-2009, 09:10 AM
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Default RE: Hacker XL Maintenance

Isaac

I don't have a definitive answer regarding the expected life of the rotor (magnet strength). I see no difference in current draw / rpm @ = volts / temp between Hacker motors with <300 flights and those with >1000. Here are a couple of links to info regarding temp related loss of strength in magnets: http://www.mceproducts.com/knowledge...-dtl.asp?id=23 http://www.coolmagnetman.com/magstren.htm It appears that general operation of our motors is well below the temp where "demag" is to be expected.

Old 08-03-2009, 10:15 AM
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Default RE: Hacker XL Maintenance


ORIGINAL: EHFAI

Isaac

I don't have a definitive answer regarding the expected life of the rotor (magnet strength). I see no difference in current draw / rpm @ = volts / temp between Hacker motors with <300 flights and those with >1000. Here are a couple of links to info regarding temp related loss of strength in magnets: http://www.mceproducts.com/knowledge...-dtl.asp?id=23 http://www.coolmagnetman.com/magstren.htm It appears that general operation of our motors is well below the temp where ''demag'' is to be expected.

Hi Earl

Thank you very much, that is exactly what I was looking for.

Regards,

Isaac Najary
Old 10-29-2009, 02:08 PM
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Default RE: Hacker XL Maintenance

For anyone still listening in here I was wondering if you can offer me some advice. I'm looking at buying a used plane with a C50 in it, but am concerned that the maintenance is a hassle and that there is a high risk of failure. Does someone have a set of photos that show the basic maintenance procedures? Can the motors be sent to Hacker for maintenance? What about failures? What typically happens if anything?


Thanks,


Joe
Old 10-29-2009, 03:07 PM
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Default RE: Hacker XL Maintenance

Hi Joe,
Flying a Synergy with a Hacker for two years now. 350 flights. Clean the gearbox every 70 flights. It takes less than one hour.
No issues in these two years.
Googled for a pdf of the instruction and found it.
http://morten.laugesen.nu/HackerC50.pdf
Regards,
Hans
Old 10-30-2009, 11:41 AM
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Default RE: Hacker XL Maintenance

Hi,

I have two 14XL, the oldest one have 300+ flights. This one needed bearing replacement ( motor -and gearbox shaft, totally 4 ) at 290 flights. Reason for this was the cooling fan started to loose pieces, probably caused by bearing wear. A fellow of mine had a total bearing failure between 300-400 flights.

This is too short time / too few motors to make an realible logistic, but personally i will change those 4 bearings at every 300 flights based on running time / rpm / lubricating type these bearing are exposed to.
Hacker germany do this , excellent service,and nice prices.

I lubricate the planetary gears every 100 flights using mobil 28. So far there are no signs of wear of these (3) bearings.

just my experience so far ..

Kjell Olav
Old 10-30-2009, 01:49 PM
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Default RE: Hacker XL Maintenance

Kjell

The front motor bearing (gearbox end) seems to wear the most. Usually noticeable by a change in sound before damage occurs - obvious by noise / roughness when spinning the motor with the gearbox removed. I tried a sealed / grease filled ceramic bearing (rated @ 50% higher rpm than original) and it became noisey around 60 flights. Now back to using the stock bearing and agree that your observation of 300 or so flights is about its life. The end opposite the gearbox seems to last much longer but, as they're relatively low cost (about $6 ea.) it's best to change both.

The propshaft bearings appear to last at least 3X the life of the motor bearings if they are not exposed to solvent when cleaning the gears.

The early fans didn't have the phenolic disc glued to the blades, newer ones have the disc which makes the fan more efficient. However, I've seen several of the discs disintegrate with imbalance / debris doing damage. I fly in high summer temps and find the fan without the disc to provide adequate cooling if attention is paid to airflow to the motor.
Old 10-31-2009, 05:56 AM
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Default RE: Hacker XL Maintenance

Earl,

Thanks for chime in.
Yes, i agree, seems that the motor bearings fail first ...

In the beginning, i thought the planetary gear-bearings (3) was the "weak" point, but it seems that these bearings hold up just fine ,even at extended lube interval using a high quality grease. For this reason i will continue extending the lube interval on the planetary gears to meet the total bearing replacement for the rest of the motor, due to the motor bearing limit.

My goal : lube every 150 - change all bearings (total 7) at 300. The total effort is lower, and the total cost is reasonable.
The cost is relatively low to change bearings,even at Hacker germany, and the extra cost to change all the bearings, included the fan is low .. As mentioned above; the motor-bearing is the limit, and the job has to be done anyway..

Well, just my personal maintenance program.

Kjell Olav


Old 11-01-2009, 07:42 AM
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Default RE: Hacker XL Maintenance

Thanks!


Thanks a bunch guys for all the great input. That was exactly what I was looking for, and I appreciate being able to learn from your experiences.

I tried to Google for directions as well, but I must not have had the correct search terms so I missed the great Hacker pdf.

Thanks again,




JP
Old 12-28-2009, 11:56 AM
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Default RE: Hacker XL Maintenance

Earl

I would like to order the bearings of one my C50 comp that is getting close to ~300 flights. Do you have a good source including the part numbers?

Thanks,

Vicente "Vince" bortone
Old 12-28-2009, 06:07 PM
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Default RE: Hacker XL Maintenance

Vince

I'm using motor bearings from Boca Bearing (#MR126-2GS) which are pre-lubed & sealed.

They also have propshaft bearings, I don't have a number but they're 22mm OD, 8mm ID, 7mm wide - again I'd choose a pre-lubed & sealed variety. BTW - these are available everywhere in a variety of quality as they're standard skateboard wheel bearings.

The drawn cup planet gear bearings are Torrington HK-0306 available from http://www.ebatmus.com/.

Old 12-28-2009, 06:10 PM
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Default RE: Hacker XL Maintenance

Earl,

You just make my day. Thank you and Happy New Year.

Vince
Old 12-28-2009, 06:16 PM
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Default RE: Hacker XL Maintenance

Earl,

This is the first time that I am taking apart the motor. I only have been greasing the gear box every 50 flights. I assume but not 100% sure that I need the following:

2 - motor bearings (#MR126-2GS)
1 - Propshaft bearing 22 OD, 8 mmID and 7 mm wide.
3 - Torrington HK-0306

Thanks,

Vince
Old 12-28-2009, 07:17 PM
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Default RE: Hacker XL Maintenance

Vince

With re-lube intervals of only 50 flights, I would expect no planet gear bearing wear issues at all in 300 flights. Re-lube intervals of 50 flights is probably about right if using the Hacker supplied grease, but way overkill with the Shell Stamina RLS-2 (or similar polyurea) heavier bodied grease. On the order of 100 - 150 flights seems about right with the latter.

The propshaft bearings should have a very long life unless solvent is used to clean the gearbox and also removes the lube from the rear bearing.

The gearbox end motor bearing is another matter, it's a pre-lubed bearing and seems to have a finite life and it can damage the end frame (or worse) when it fails. Regular replacement seems prudent.
Old 12-29-2009, 09:33 AM
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Default RE: Hacker XL Maintenance

Earl,

I am not using the Hacker grease. I think I am using the Shell Stamina you suggested but need to check. Is the quantity of bearings I showed in the post correct? Probably makes sense that I go ahead and replace all bearings to be in the safe side. I will follow you advice.

Thanks,

Vince
Old 12-29-2009, 08:39 PM
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Default RE: Hacker XL Maintenance

Vince, Let me know if you need a tube of the Shell Stamina RLS-2 grease. Just pay for the shipping. Regards_Everette
Old 12-30-2009, 08:21 PM
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Default RE: Hacker XL Maintenance

I checked and I got the same grease from a friend. I appreciate very much your offer.

Happy New Year,

Vince
Old 01-06-2010, 04:28 AM
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Default RE: Hacker XL Maintenance

Earl,

I searched the ebatmus web site. They don't list the Torrington brand but list other. Check here:

http://www.ebatmus.com/search.epl?Query=HK-0306

I wonder which one is correct.

Boca Bearing list this one:

http://www.bocabearings.com/main1.as...720&n=HK0306TN

I am not sure what TN means at the end,

Thanks,

Vince
Old 01-06-2010, 07:38 AM
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Default RE: Hacker XL Maintenance

Vince

I ordered the HK 0306 Timken brand from Atmus and they sent Torrington - no matter on brand if the number's the same. The Boca version is probably OK (2X $) also, it has a polyamid roller cage vs steel for the Torrington, hence the TN suffix.

Earl
Old 05-18-2011, 04:39 PM
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Default RE: Hacker XL Maintenance

Is anyone still using this motor?


Reviving an old thread to see if folks are still using this motor. I have two C50-13XL Acro Comp motors and two Hacker Master Spin 99 escs that I'd like to turn into some cash, but I wonder if they have any value at all. Anyways just wondering.



Thanks,

Joe







Old 05-19-2011, 04:24 PM
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Default RE: Hacker XL Maintenance

Joe, Depending on what kind of shape they are in, I would trade a Q80 with about 50 flights for one if you were interested. If I had the cash, I would just buy one.

Chris

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