avi8er

If you are going to run two edf 55's on 11.1 make sure they have the 300 size motors. I ran that setup in the A-10 with the 150's and they melted. It flew great right up till that point though. Got less then one hour out of the motors.[&o]

LDM

My Feedback: (15)

Thanks AV8 , I do have the 300 , the A10 flew great , just like it was on raisl . got about 3 months out of her .Then one day here in Pa , it was sunny and the winds were coming in from the Hurracane down south . I should not have flown it but I felt like it and on a low pass i lost control (pilot error ) . I just do not have enought speed with the crosswind to pull up and she dowe hard and fast .
So the engines still work so I am going to use them in this plane

davbow

My Feedback: (6)

Hey guys, where is the cg on this thing. I can;t find it in the manual!!!!!!
here is mine. i added a hatch so i could get to the electronics

jwalsh1

Thanks for the info, LDM and avi8tor. Yea, Id like to make it an e-flight ducted fan. Ill use the same setup you are. I ordered 2 kits because Im just so damn impressed by this guy. I decided to build one for the guy that taught me to fly because Ive been trying to find a good way to say thanks for that, and the other one Ill do for myself with the ducted fan setup.

vicman

My Feedback: (10)

Forget DF! Look under the wing. Do you smell what the Vicman is cookin?[sm=bananahead.gif]

LDM

My Feedback: (15)

Nice job Vicman , mine is still in the box , thinking of going brusless D -fan

vicman

My Feedback: (10)

Go fan if you like but build one NOW and just get it airborne. You will have a blast and have all the old guys drooling! I flew mine twice this weekend and am not sure weather I liked the OHHS and AHHAS or the blinding fast rolls better. Get it built and fly NOWWW!!!

LDM

My Feedback: (15)

Vic , nice job , especaiily like the skull and crossbones , go fast !!!!

vicman

My Feedback: (10)

Sorry about the non-scale scheme. Just one more reason not to be drinking near an open paint bottle and blank canvas[sm=bananahead.gif]

LDM

My Feedback: (15)

Vic sometimes the best themes are the non scale -fun type like yours !!!!
The plane looks great , cant wait to build mine !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

vicman

My Feedback: (10)

This plane is a hoot to fly but watch out for the trees![sm=bananahead.gif] Both planes I built have been tree magnets. No big, I am going to try splicing in repairs if they don't work the plane is easy enough to make over.
Levi, have you tried using a small square of foam for the corner brace in leiw of balsa?

sledge4055

just finished mine

complete witn himax 2025-4600

wow!! this plane realy hauls the mail!! probably close to 60mph or faster with a 3 cell 2600mah poly quest pack and 10-8 apc prop and 4.4 to 1 gear ratio i had to add two wing spars to keep it to geather the first one i folded the wing in half on a fast decent.. i think this will go alot faster im thinking about going with a mega hacker or lener here soon

sledge4055

here it is i just figured out how to post a picture..

jwalsh1

Anyone heard from 3dfoamy lately?

vicman

My Feedback: (10)

Sledge, you look great! What did you use for paint? I have been putting off the paint cause it looks like this thing will drink all I can put on it.[X(]

sledge4055

walmart brand apple barrel paint thined with water..or anti feeze till it was able to work with my airbrush not sure te ratio of water to paint ..

ultraviper

Hi guys, I just discovered this tread and I downloaded the plans. I'll go get some depron this afternoon. Are there any "problems" I should watch out for when building beauty ?

vicman

My Feedback: (10)

The biggest problem I noticed was I was stealing time from my family and employer to get out an fly it! You will love this plane!

hypersoniq

How is the performance for those who went with EDF?

Interesting when you look at the f-15 and f-18 plans side-by-side, similar design features... wonder how hard it would be to adapt this method to an edf f-22 (without lockheed noticing)...

I think I'll hold off on that raptor until after I try my hand at a "Bluecor Angel"...

one quick question... does the stabilator's presence have any adverse effect on using edf's?

PilotSmith

My Feedback: (1)

Hey Hyper,

I've heard that a couple people have tried to mod the Foamy F18 to EDF with poor results but don't know the specifics. I'm in the process of making an EDF Foamy F18 now. I'll post how it goes here:

http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/3D%2...2717471/tm.htm

If anyone has specifics on what went wrong with the Foamy EDF planes I'd like to know. Thanks!

PilotSmith

My Feedback: (1)

Ah, the tree magnet phenomena. I had the same thing happen to my Slow Stick. After extensive research I discovered the cause of the crash was due to electrostatic foam pull. When air rushes past Depron or Blue Core it accumulates static electricity, much like when you rub a balloon against the wall and the balloon sticks to the wall. When atmospheric conditions are just right (usually dry weather) the large static charge accumulated on the aircraft will pull strongly toward a grounded object such as a tree if you get close to it. This in turn leads to a crash into the tree. To the untrained observer they think you dumb sticked the plane into the tree. But we all know better. Yes, electrostatic foam pull can be quite wicked. Same thing happened a couple weeks ago to my foam F22. Static pull was so great it got sucked nose first straight into the ground on a low altitude high speed pass I was making. [sm=spinnyeyes.gif]

vicman

My Feedback: (10)

That makes me feel so much better! I knew I didn't tell it to go there![sm=bananahead.gif]

hypersoniq

has anyone tried a pair of gws edf55-300's? I'm looking to go the budget route since I just toasted my already limited "R/C budget" on a 9caps Tx

PilotSmith

My Feedback: (1)

I saw this data posted below on the EDF-55. So it looks like 6.38oz is the max at 10.8v which may (will) burn out the 300 motor. Couldn't find EDF-55 fan data to use in MotoCalc to see what it says. For comparison I ran the smaller fan units that are in Motocalc and copied below some limited MotoCalc data. Hope this helps. Data on the F18 is a guestimate but constant on all the systems below for comparison. I ran all the brushed tests using a 3 cell LiPo which likely is too high of voltage for the 300 motor. So the figures are going to be worse than listed unless willing to fry some motors. MotoCalc was told that there were 2 motors in parallel so I take it that also means it calculates 2 fans as well. The last entry is what I will be using on my F18. Overall I think all the data from MotoCalc is on the optimistic side. My F18 setup per MotoCalc has about a 1:1 thrust to weight ratio but I know that is not the case as I just finished the plane and it falls pointed up at max throttle. I seems closer to 0.8:1 ratio.

GW/EDF-55(EP2245X6) MOTOR : EM300H
ROTOR Volts (v) Amps (A) Thrust Power (w) Efficiency
(g) (oz) (g/w) (oz/kw)
EP2245X6 3.6 1.9 37 1.30 6.84 5.41 191
4.8 2.6 58 2.05 12.48 4.65 164
6 3.3 77 2.72 19.80 3.89 137
7.2 4.3 107 3.77 30.96 3.46 122
8.4 5.3 129 4.55 44.52 2.90 102
9.6 6.1 158 5.57 58.56 2.70 95
10.8 7.1 181 6.38 76.68 2.36 83


Motor: GWS EM300H; 3310rpm/V; 0.75A no-load; 0.356 Ohms.
Battery: Thunder Power TP2100; 3 cells; 2100mAh @ 3.7V; 0.022 Ohms/cell.
Speed Control: Castle Creations Sprite 25; 0.0025 Ohms; High rate.

Drive System: Pro-Scale EDF 300 (Peter Shepherd); 2 motors (parallel); 1.9x2.6 (1.1in hub); (Pcoeff=0.82; Tcoeff=0.96). (1.9" fan)
Airframe: F18 3D Foam; 275sq.in; 27.1oz; 14.2oz/sq.ft; Cd=0.041; Cl=0.08; Clopt=0.33; Clmax=0.66.
Stats: 59 W/lb in; 40 W/lb out; 24mph stall; 34mph opt @ 97% (16:24, 132°F); 71mph level; 47ft/min @ 0.9°; -540ft/min @ -10.4°.
Max Speed: 40mph Max Amp: 9.6 Flight Time: 16min

With a wing loading of 14.2oz/sq.ft, a model of this size will have flying characteristics suited to the intermediate pilot, for use in calm to moderate wind conditions.
The static thrust (9.4oz) to weight (27.1oz) ratio is 0.35:1, which will result in medium length take-off runs, and no difficulty taking off from grass surfaces (assuming sufficiently large wheels).
At the best lift-to-drag ratio airspeed, the excess-thrust (2.1oz) to weight (27.1oz) ratio is 0.08:1, which will give very slow climbs and poor acceleration. Careful piloting will be required to maintain altitude.


Drive System: Graupner 1380; 2 motors (parallel); 2.3x3.36 (1.2in hub); (Pcoeff=1.015; Tcoeff=0.95). (2.3" fan)
Airframe: F18 3D Foam; 275sq.in; 27.1oz; 14.2oz/sq.ft; Cd=0.041; Cl=0.08; Clopt=0.33; Clmax=0.66.
Stats: 96 W/lb in; 48 W/lb out; 24mph stall; 34mph opt @ 84% (12:10, 172°F); 71mph level; 161ft/min @ 3.1°; -540ft/min @ -10.4°.
Max Speed: 44mph Max Amp: 16.3 Flight Time: 9min

With a wing loading of 14.2oz/sq.ft, a model of this size will have flying characteristics suited to the intermediate pilot, for use in calm to moderate wind conditions.
The static thrust (10.6oz) to weight (27.1oz) ratio is 0.39:1, which will result in medium length take-off runs, and no difficulty taking off from grass surfaces (assuming sufficiently large wheels).
At the best lift-to-drag ratio airspeed, the excess-thrust (3.1oz) to weight (27.1oz) ratio is 0.11:1, which will give slow climbs and low acceleration. Some piloting experience would be beneficial.


Drive System: Wattage Powerfan 400; 2 motors (parallel); 2.5x2.5 (0.5in hub); (Pcoeff=1.125; Tcoeff=0.995). (2.5" fan)
Airframe: F18 3D Foam; 275sq.in; 27.1oz; 14.2oz/sq.ft; Cd=0.041; Cl=0.08; Clopt=0.33; Clmax=0.66.
Stats: 89 W/lb in; 50 W/lb out; 24mph stall; 34mph opt @ 87% (13:48, 151°F); 71mph level; 173ft/min @ 3.3°; -540ft/min @ -10.4°.
Max Speed: 43mph Max Amp: 15 Flight Time: 11min

With a wing loading of 14.2oz/sq.ft, a model of this size will have flying characteristics suited to the intermediate pilot, for use in calm to moderate wind conditions.
The static thrust (12.3oz) to weight (27.1oz) ratio is 0.45:1, which will result in medium length take-off runs, and no difficulty taking off from grass surfaces (assuming sufficiently large wheels).
At the best lift-to-drag ratio airspeed, the excess-thrust (3.2oz) to weight (27.1oz) ratio is 0.12:1, which will give slow climbs and low acceleration. Some piloting experience would be beneficial.

-- 3 Turn Brushless --

Motor: Typhoon 3 Turn; 2950rpm/V; 1.7A no-load; 0.027 Ohms.
Battery: Thunder Power TP2100; 4 cells; 2100mAh @ 3.7V; 0.022 Ohms/cell.
Speed Control: Castle Creations Phoenix 25; 0.0065 Ohms; High rate.
Drive System: WeMoTec Mini Fan 480; 2.7x3.66 (1.3in hub); (Pcoeff=0.506; Tcoeff=0.807).
Ducting: 2.8in D x 10in L (-0.3° taper) intake; 2.5in D x 9in L (0.6° taper) exhaust.
Airframe: F18 3D Foam; 275sq.in; 27.9oz; 14.6oz/sq.ft; Cd=0.041; Cl=0.08; Clopt=0.33; Clmax=0.66.
Stats: 173 W/lb in; 151 W/lb out; 25mph stall; 34mph opt @ 54% (29:43, 95°F); 72mph level; 1939ft/min @ 39.7°; -547ft/min @ -10.4°.
Max Speed: 70mph Max Amp: 24 Flight Time: 7min

With a wing loading of 14.6oz/sq.ft, a model of this size will have flying characteristics suited to the intermediate pilot, for use in calm to moderate wind conditions.
The static thrust (28.7oz) to weight (27.9oz) ratio is 1.03:1, which will result in very short take-off runs, no difficulty taking off from grass surfaces (assuming sufficiently large wheels), and steep climb-outs.
At the best lift-to-drag ratio airspeed, the excess-thrust (17.5oz) to weight (27.9oz) ratio is 0.63:1, which will give steep climbs and excellent acceleration. This model should be able to do consecutive loops, and has sufficient in-flight thrust for almost any aerobatic maneuver.

hypersoniq

there are also some larger (yet still dirt cheap) gws units containing speed 400's.
GWS EDF-75 (4 or 6 blade rotors)

GW/EDF75X4A

With Duct

(v) (A) Thrust Power Efficiency
(g) (oz) (g/w) (oz/w)
7.2 6.6 147 5.19 55.44 2.65 0.09
8.4 7.9 170 6.00 75.84 2.24 0.08
9.6 9.3 210 7.41 100.44 2.09 0.07
10.8 11.2 246 8.68 134.40 1.83 0.07
12.0 12.5 281 9.91 165.00 1.70 0.06


With Duct and Intake Ring

(v) (A) Thrust Power Efficiency
(g) (oz) (g/w) (oz/w)
7.2 6.2 182 6.42 52.08 3.49 0.12
8.4 7.9 224 7.90 75.84 2.95 0.10
9.6 9.7 279 9.84 104.76 2.66 0.09
10.8 11.4 302 10.65 136.80 2.21 0.08
12.0 13.1 324 11.43 172.92 1.87 0.07