Slayer_988

Hey,
Just got my kit in yesterday and have started the build. If anyone wants to follow just know that I tend to go a little slow and I dont have all of the parts at the moment. So for now im just going to build the jet. Anyway here are some pics.
This kit can be found at www.hobby-lobby.com
From Left to Right: Ailerons, Canopy, Elevators, Nose
Exhaust, Tail

Slayer_988

I now have the wings installed but no ailerons yet, Nose is in place, and next I will be working on the Tail and the Elevators. I havent decided whether to make the whole elevator move like elevons or just to have part move. Ideas anyone?

Pics are of: Box, Decals, Nose attached, Wing bracer, and wings attached.

dhpilot

Hey, Started mine tonight too! dont know what fan to use... have 2 to choose from, and multiple motors... not sure of the best combination. I have a wattage fan with a mini ac 12 turn or a himax 2015/ 4200 or 2025/4200...OR ... a vasa mini fan with an astroflite 020 installed... small fan... and also concerned about amp draw... thinking of using 1320/11.1 tp or 1500/11.1 kokam... cheater holes???... ducting??? so many questions... CAN anyone help?? If any of you motor calc phenoms have any suggestions.... well... PLEASE help!!! also cant decide on full flying tailerons or hinges... DOH!! cf reinforcement?????

420Geo

Hey guys.... dug mine out of the loft last night too.... gonna start to build her, again.
I'm putting elevons on mine. Servos at the back with horn let into balsa facing for the elevator.
Hlep me too with the fan and motor / esc choice.
Looking Goooood Slayer!
BR
Geo.

Maudib

My Feedback: (51)

This is great... I bougth one of the F-16's in the Belgian Tiger scheme when they were on sale a while back... been sitting there for some time...

Such a SWEET looking jet.

I've done a little research and it seems the Wemotech Microfan is the ticket, but still haven't found the "optimal motor" for it yet. Some have used the Astroflight setup because it draws less than 10 amps and can be setup light... Others opt for a hotter motor and go to 25 amp esc/packs...

I guess the cheater hole is a UST beause there is insufficient air inlet to let the fan wind out. Also something about an inlet fan ring around the motor will optimize the power.

I wouldn't go the full flying elevons... hard that it was hard to keep accurate and they were very touchy.

I was considering 4 servos... two ailerons and two elevators... then setting it up with ailervators and elevator to flap mix with one of the new 7 channel Bergs when they come out...

Also I understand that this egg carton foam is very fragile and that some form of belly protection is required or it will wear out quickly from the belly landings. Some light, clear packing tape should do the trick...

dhpilot

Hey all, I'm thinking of setting it up with coupled ailerons and tailerons like the Icarus shock flyers... almost the same effect as mixing as you can fine tune each individually... But with half the weight in servos... 4 is just too many for this light airframe in my opinion... Decided to go with the wattage fan and the AXI mini-ac 12 turn fan motor with an E-flite 40 amp esc... probably use the kokam 1500 in the nose...Think I'll also use a small thin strip of CF from the inlet to the tail inside with some extra reinforcement around the cheater hole... Still haven't glued anything so if anyone has better suggestions speak up please!! Thanks, Dean

dhpilot

Hey Slayer, Just looking at your pics and noticed the ailerons cut out are actually the flaps... do you think the outboard panels would be more effective??? want your opinion before I cut mine out...would have to go with torque rods to use the outboard cutouts... D

Maudib

My Feedback: (51)

dhpilot,

The Shocky Jets use elevons... in their case dual elevons... And they would indeed give most of the functionality of a 4 servo setup...

Not sure how easy you could cut the outnboard ailerons out and get a pushrod to them... aileron torque rods I guess... but I don't care for them.

I'll probably cut mine all the way across (flaps and ailerons as one alieron).

dhpilot

Yeah that should give you exellent roll authority!!! What fan, motor, esc, and battery are you considering? I'm still concerned about precise layout with regard to cg... really wanna nail it the first time ...dont like to rebuild! The wings and spar do take alot of fine tuning to fit properly and there is a discrepancy in the instructions that I have ( though limited as they are), they show the spar being inserted in the fuselage upside down... which induces alot of dihedral... dont think thats corrrect as all the photos I see are reversed from that... also reinforcing the spar with 4mm CF strip... just in case !! The recommended CG by all consensus is 74mm or 2 7/8 " instead of the factory rec. 85 mm 3 3/4" I think I'll take my chances at 74mm and work from there... Absolutely nothing worse than a tail heavy jet except whats left after you attempt to fly it...!!! And this jet is one of those that you maiden well and enjoy for months or .... not.

Maudib

My Feedback: (51)

I haven't settled on a motor... wished I could get my hands on a Razor 2500 (I think that's the noe people talked about).

I will be using a Wemotech Microfan and a CC 25 (or 10 if possible) and perhaps the FMA Cellpro packs or TP packs... Not sure which size dependin on amp draw... Either 1200-2100 I suspect...


Those that used the Astroflight 010 (I tink that's the designation) are under 10 amps... so I have some 3 cell 900's that would work great...

I want decent speed because a puttering around, floating jet just doesn't look right... [>:]

Slayer_988

I actually intended to cut all the way across but then decided on small ailerons and dont want to use a torque rod. For me its cool with the flaps as the ailerons, it really doesnt matter that much to me.
Im going with a 3 servo setup, 2 elevator and 1 aileron servo. Also havent decided on a fan or motor, my budget for this plane is small as I have a few other things I need to deal with at the moment.
Why isnt anyone liking the VASA fan?

Maudib

My Feedback: (51)

I did a lot of searching online... and some guys are using the VASA... but it's a goob bit more money... (about $50 more) and fragile.

Most guys are really enamoured with the Wemotech Mocrofan...

I just ordered mine from:

http://www.dynamoelectrics.com/

$22.95 plus $6 shipping

I have a Piccolo Pro brushless set that's a high Kv rating... I'll try it first before looking at something else...

It's rated at 150 watts and 12 amp max continuous draw... I'm hoping to keep it light and use a 3 cell 900 or 1320...

Another place that has them for $26.90 is New Creations:
http://www.newcreations-rc.com/Produ...number=WMC0012

Maudib

My Feedback: (51)

If it doesn't do well, I might try the Astroflight 010...
http://www.nesail.com/detail.php?productID=2507

THey sell a combo for $150 with fan/motor and a special version of the CC10 ESC... guess it doesn't have some programming options like cell count..

Looks like they have the motor and fan for $70... if it's the microfan, that's a good deal too...

But I'll get the momo only as I'll have both the others already...

dhpilot

Hey All, just soldered everything together and pulled some tests, Peak at 312 WATTS !!! Max 28 to 30 amps.. just about pulled the fan out of my hand!! This fan is 6 bladed and I'm thinking of pulling every other blade... to reduce the strain on the batteries... think I'll use the kokam 1500... It can take it. Real workhorse... pics soon... anyone know the weight of the recommended 8 cell batteries? just wondering how much polymer I can pack in this cockpit...

dhpilot

Hey Slayer, you might research the GWS fan with the 300 motor... EDF 55, dont know anything about specifics but have seen them at the LHS very inexspensive like 17 dollars fan and motor,that and a esc 400 might do the trick. check it out ... Dean

Maudib

My Feedback: (51)

Dean,

I missed what fan you were running? A Vasa? and what motor? What pack did you do your tests with the 1500?

Slayer_988

I realize I didnt give much info but I dont really mean my budget is about $150 every two weeks I have laying around. What I mean is I dont want to spend alot of money on this bird, I want it to fly good at a low cost. Is the Wemo Micro fan a good option? What experience do people have with this.
These cheaper fans leave more cash for a better brushless so thats what im looking towards.

Maudib

My Feedback: (51)

The Wemotech is considered a better fan than the GWS...

Some are using a Himax 2025-4200 in it with 4 cells (but that's hard on the motor) and a fella was telling me that they were modding it slightly to accept the Mega 16-7-XX series... and that's where they getting some phenominal performance.

I should have mine on Saturday or Monday...

dhpilot

Hey Slayer... I had a fan out of a wattage F-86 ... used the AXI mini ac 12 turn motor and a bunch of different packs... a TP 2100 and 1320 and a kokam 1500 Cant decide which to use probably the kokam. As far as your fan, I have 2 of wemotek 's 480 fans in the HET jets F-18 and the sniper and they work great... only suggested the GWS because they are readily available and cheap... I've used the edf 50 with fiagao brushless in an a -10 and they worked fine... Truthfully if I hadn't of had this fan I would buy the EDF 55 at the LHS and use the himax 2015/4100.. wemotek is great but I'd have to order it...let me know what you decide.. Dean

dhpilot

Hey Maudib, What motor did you decide to use? Do you think this jet will carry a 2100?? Thats why I wondered how much the recommended 8 cell pack weighs... just to compare... I'm on the verge of blowing out a pack with this continuous amp draw at full power with the 1500 and 1320. The power curve levels off at around 270 watts at 23 amps after 45 seconds or so.... hopefully it will all work!!!

Maudib

My Feedback: (51)

I think I mentioned it earlier... I have a brushless 3D Powerset for a Piccolo Pro... I got it to review in the Ikarus SU27-XXL here on RCU...

Don't have much data for it other than it's 22mm wide, 37mm long... and was told it's a 150 watt motor... Of course it's highly geared in the heli, and on the SU27-XXL it spun a Wingo prop pretty well without getting hot on 3 cell 1500's...

My goal is to try a TP1320 ProLite and get 15-17 amps and 150-170 watts.

If this doesn't do the trick, I'll switch over to something more like 25 amps/250 watts... and an 1800-2100 pack.

Will the airframe do it? Well I've read it will... but it seems so light to weigh it up like that...

I want to be able to hand launch not HOPE launch...

Maudib

My Feedback: (51)

OH SQUEEL!!!!

I did some sleuthing and found that this motor is actually a Lehner 1020! Supposedly a really nice motor... But I have some e-mails out to find out which wind it is...

Once I know that I can cross reference the resistance/No Load current to plug into Motocalc.

Hopefull I got lucky and have a good motor for the Microfan... It's definitely a fairly high kV... 4000+ hopefully.

It weighs 60 grams or 2.12 oz and is supposed to be similar to the Razor 2500 but capable of more amps...

Well, we'll see anyhow...

dhpilot

Maudib, I'm at a loss for weights... no scale. I'm thinking that my mini-ac is approx. the same weight as the 280 BB. fan is close too... My big question is the weight comparison between the TP 2100 and the recommended 8 cell pack...I really want the output of the 2100 you know... I dont plan to run full bore all the time but.... well? who am I kidding ... Yes I do!! Your motor combo sounds like it will be hot. I have some heat to be concerned about on the bench... at least more than I'd like. What do you think about the every other blade removal trick? maybe reduce some resistance?? but what about thrust loss? any thoughts?

Maudib

My Feedback: (51)

The recommended 8 cell 1100 mah Nimh packs weighs 6 oz... the 3 cell TP2100 is about 5... so an oz less. Your motor is about 1.7 oz (about 1/4 oz lighter than a 280bb)

HL doesn't list a 12 turn MiniAC anymore... but it looks like it ws designed for 8 cell (or 2 lipos) # lipos is just too much power. I thnik it'll burn up if you weren't careful with throttle...

I wouldn't touch the fan blades as at BEST you'll reduce thrust by 50%... I'd rather lose 33% power/thrust by dropping to 2 cell and also lose a bit of weight.

I really don't know what mine will end up being for sure... we'll see my fan shipped today so I'll have it monday...

dhpilot

Finally some photos! All the electronics ready to install in the completed airframe...After everything is in I'll get the hairdryer out and true up the flight surfaces as the molds and construction are slightly askew from the factory. notice the pushrods, decided to put the servos foward and can move them up to 4 inches to achieve correct C. G. as needed. Also used them to strengthen the fuse as well. After the fan is in, a very thin strip of CF( the same used on the wing spar) will be installed the length of the bottom fuse to meet a vertical cf 2 mm rod from the bulkhead in the cockpit through to the intake about an inch from the opening... Will strengthen and true up the intake that was crooked out of the box. I dont think I'm adding too much weight but the end result should be very strong. Also going to use the supplied plastic sheet to outline the intake hole in the bottom of the plane. Should reduce wear on the foam... NOW lets hope it flys for more than 10 seconds!!