RE: Complete new CDI - website open
 

Hello Atam. I have never used either of those rs-232 interfaces you show in your posted message. Why not try the USB powered version on the website?I use the USB powered version and it works perfectly. Easy to build and it's reliable. John

RE: Complete new CDI - website open
 

Atam... I'll try to transfer the pictures here..
Note the polarity of first and last capacitor on the layout!!! Reversed from the middle 3 capacitors.. and only 3 wires going to the DB-9 connector to the serial port of the computer... Also, it needs a usb port power connection to the computer usb port..not from the serial port !!!

John

RE: Complete new CDI - website open
 

Atam, the control software is only for the newest timer board with the external oscillator. It will not work with the older timer board that was designed without the external crystal oscillator or resonator.
They are two totally different timer boards!

John

RE: Complete new CDI - website open
 

ATam,

say in your langage exact what you want to say and I will translate for you , It is a bit hard to make up the meaning,

Aceasta versiune de soft este pentru noua versiune de "timing boards" cu oscilator extern, fapt pentru care nu functioneaza cu versiunea veche de timing boards ce a fost conceputa fara cristal or rezonator extern. Acestea sunt doua sisteme total diferite.

Traducerea exacta a lui John


Just helping/assiting to may best ability.

Adrian Ciulei

RE: Complete new CDI - website open
 

Ok guys, based on PM that I got from Atam, he made a CDi from a French site and is for a Suzuki engine, says that it has 3 tables of advance curves and has real hard time to optimize it. Now with Ignition control soft from here will be ideal for him totry to find the best curve by creating his own.He made the timing board ( but I do not know if is the old or new timing board, did not mentioned that) and has trouble comunicating with the programer to get it in program mode. Says that is geting in program mode if he shorts the TX-RX on the PIC, if he works the SW from the CDI schematic does not work. He is asking if is a HEX issue.

This is all I got so far, I do not know much about this and I can not assist...all I can do....translate.


Adrian

RE: Complete new CDI - website open
 

The difference between the two boards is design software.
The old timer is designed for only in circuit programming of the hex after compiling the C source code with the advance map imbedded into it.
The new timer gets the basic hex file programmed into it first with a pic programmer board. Then there is the bootloader program which will contain the settings made with the control software program with the easy start, timing advance table, and delays for the timing settings. This software also runs the on screen rpm monitor, visible degrees of advance and a graph showing both. Monitor mode selected by pulling off the jumper and switching the program to watch your results with the timer and cdi running your engine.

The old timer does none of this and is not compatible with the control software for the new timer board.

The French designed CV-2 is also a design with it's own control programming software. Not compatible with other timer board pic chips. I have also built that one and it works fine. You may be getting confused between all of the available timers and cdi boards.

I hope this clears up some of the misunderstanding I have seen taking place.


John

RE: Complete new CDI - website open
 

The French CV-2 board is a TCI...Not a cdi and must have a 4 ohm or greater coil for correct operation!
I have one operating and using their software, you can edit things quite easily and it then produces a valid hex file which you must program into the pic chip with a pic programmer board.
I prefer Rob's old timer board using Nyemi's pic hex file and his Excel sheet to make the curves. Very reliable and small size board.

John

RE: Complete new CDI - website open
 

John,
Wouldn't happen to have a web address for the CV-2...??

RE: Complete new CDI - website open
 

john,

which board are you currently building? when you refer to the website, are refering to gompy's current pages? which chip are you currently useing? there has been too many digressions to 12v systems with multiple curves and between cdi and tci.

still working on winding a sparkcoil utilizing the transformer from a wallwart power supply. hope to make it work this weekend.

RE: Complete new CDI - website open
 

The complete project is on Rob's website. Go back to forum page 15 for his website address.

John

RE: Complete new CDI - website open
 

I am still building the timer boards like I sent to you chuck.
The pic chip I am currently using on that board is a 16f628A. The 16f628 will also work.
Since the program is setup for a 4mhz internal frequency, either chip works fine in it.
Gompy's site has all you need to build one of those I think.
If you need something I didn't post on here, just ask.

John

RE: Complete new CDI - website open
 

Nyemi has posted a new ASM file which I am about to program a chip and test. Hope it's a good one for the old timer board.
It could be what we were all waiting for. There's a new Excel worksheet also to make curves. Have to try this also. I'll post the results soon as I can.

John

RE: Complete new CDI - website open
 

Hi Chuck..
Did your furnace ignitor coil work with the cdi I sent? Any sparks??

John

RE: Complete new CDI - website open
 

john,

the ignitor coil has not produced a spark yet. i may have the primary hooked up wrong.

will the 3000 rpm tester work on both boards you sent? when i test for voltage to the coil with a cheap VOM, i only get 200 to 300 volts. i am assuming that is because the meter cannot react fast enough to catch the peak voltage. i dont want to fry my good meter. i use the harbor freight cheapies for most things.

is the board with the timing circuit, the one on gompys site?

RE: Complete new CDI - website open
 

I'll post a hookup diagram for your style ignitor coil.
The timer board was on the old website. It has 2chips on it,which means it is the older timer without problems.
The tester will work on both systems I sent to you.
200 to 300 volts at the coil output of the cdi board is correct.

John

RE: Complete new CDI - website open
 

Hi Adrian,
Where did you go am waiting for something from you.
Was able to get more of the three wire coils.Am healing fairly well from last surgery .Have titanium holding my ribs and sternum togeather.
Been flying a lot can hand crank gas engines now.Was cleared to lift over eight pounds.
I am still closed and will remain so. Still doing a little UAV work with high output CDI.
Hope all is OK with you.
BCCHI(AMA 2500).

RE: Complete new CDI - website open
 

Atam, the ASM code is not for the newest timer board but for the one before it.
I'll post a picture of it if I can. This is the schematic and board positive & layout for the old timer board Nyemi's code works on.

John

RE: Complete new CDI - website open
 

First of all THANKS for great igniton :)
I mounted it on my 125ccm 4T tuned up Zhonsen engine (154 series) gokart for competitions and get great results - onliest thing I had to do - change magnet hold down place - to get signal at 75deg BTDC in this case I can get spark at 60deg BTDC @8000RPM and great results it spins up to 13000 (still in third gear) and then I set limiter - 1deg BTDC:)
But I found few "mistakes" at CDI for scooters http://www.electronics.gompy.net/cdiscoot/index.html
1. Com-TTL with com power doesn't works on few of my computers (not positive sigal from PC)
2. problems with R11 5k/1w - i put 4,7k/2w and it is still too less - 5w required @13000
3. in start I got spark @75deg btdc (moment of sensor) - I had to remove R6, D2 but it still starting good by kickstart with compression of 18Bar
4. I also get multispark (2 sparks) but then I put diode 1N4148 in line of Pickupcoil anode to resistor.
Now it works fine:)
For next competition I am planning to rebuild CDI to battery powered to remove rotating mass (aprox 1kg) - flywheel - and place there hall sensor with lightweight plate
P.S. Gompy I found tacho also in your homepage - can you help me to rebuild it to more rpms? (up to 15000?) to use together with your CDI sinal from PIC pin6 Maybe there you can add LED for shiftlight? and make it as one nearly perfect DIY system

RE: Complete new CDI - website open
 

I also am getting multiple sparks on the programable timer board. I am going to add a 1n4148 diode inline with the hall input to try and eliminate this problem. It shows up on the monitoring screen so if it works, I'll have a visual indication of success.
The multiple sparks seem to affect the pic's monitoring of the engine rpm for the advance feature in the program. Hope this cures the problem.

John

RE: Complete new CDI - website open
 

send me oscillogramm from pin 6 - directly @ chip
chek SCR, send oscillogrammfrom gate, it also make multispark
set SCR time to 8us for bt151 even 4us shold work
temporally remove R6 D2
for testing purposes use electric drill to turn engine without spark plug - good simulator :)

RE: Complete new CDI - website open
 

Hi all. About what timer board and program you are tolking?

RE: Complete new CDI - website open
 

The new timer board.

John

RE: Complete new CDI - website open
 

Sorry, I don't have a scope to get any info from the board. I use the monitoring software to visually see what is happening.
What I see is it is self triggering as soon as power is applied and fires at around 17,000 rpm. This is without a hv board connected so I am assuming it is an internal problem in the pic software. I have built at least 12 of these boards and all do the same thing. Any ideas why the chip is acting like this?

John

RE: Complete new CDI - website open
 

John,
Other micros I have worked with insist on an 0.1 cap right on the power supply pins of the chip and I notice there is none on the circuit just shown. Maybe it will help. Also, just wondered if you have tried "holding off" the power to the chip or the hall effect until the input regulator has settled?? I don't know, it may be something along those lines. I know that working with 555's you can get false triggering at startup and I use a simple "hold-off" on the reset there that works.

RE: Complete new CDI - website open
 

I've tried the 1n4148 diode but it didn't work at all.. If anything it made it even worse. Ready to toss this set of boards..

John

RE: Complete new CDI - website open
 

Not only I am working CDI.
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JL2lBqP1YlE[/youtube]



<span lang="en" id="result_box" class="short_text"><span title="Kattintson m&aacute;s ford&iacute;t&aacute;sokhoz" class="hps">I</span><span title="Kattintson m&aacute;s ford&iacute;t&aacute;sokhoz">'m proud</span> <span title="Kattintson m&aacute;s ford&iacute;t&aacute;sokhoz" class="hps">that he</span> <span title="Kattintson m&aacute;s ford&iacute;t&aacute;sokhoz" class="hps">is</span> <span title="Kattintson m&aacute;s ford&iacute;t&aacute;sokhoz" class="hps">Hungarian.</span></span>http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/js/f...ngue_smile.gif
<span lang="en" class="short_text" id="result_box"><span class="hps" title="Kattintson m&aacute;s ford&iacute;t&aacute;sokhoz">Way to go</span><span title="Kattintson m&aacute;s ford&iacute;t&aacute;sokhoz">,</span> <span class="hps" title="Kattintson m&aacute;s ford&iacute;t&aacute;sokhoz">cheesee86</span><span title="Kattintson m&aacute;s ford&iacute;t&aacute;sokhoz">.</span></span>http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/js/f.../thumbs_up.gif

RE: Complete new CDI - website open
 

Hi Nyemi..
Nice video!
I see you have the new cdi and timer working for your bike. Have you made any changes to it to get it working?

John

RE: Complete new CDI - website open
 

Thanks nyemi!:)

Yes I made my own version...The hardware is the same as gompy made, but I rewrote the whole software. i made it because it wasn't working perfect with my scooter(and also for graduate work in the university)...I made also my own features(use of E85, LCD, temp sensor).
But I get the same error...It is some kind of hardware error, I get a double input pulse when rpm &gt;3000, and because of this i get the output at wrong time...i only have scope in the laboratory, so i cant measure what happens on the scooter...

So i dont know what can be the problem...maybe the input signal is messy because of the alternator...i have to measure somehow...
Or anybody an idea?

Thanks!
And also thank for Gompy, and the programmer, who helped me to construct this:)

RE: Complete new CDI - website open
 

Hello all!
To CheeseE: can you share the hardware scheme and ASM code you use in your CDI?

RE: Complete new CDI - website open
 

Previous versions of the timer board used a pull-up resistor on MCLR pin but above diagram does not have it. I have read that this pin should be tied high. Could this be why some are having problems?? Also doesn't appear to be decoupling cap on the chip(maybe missed it)

RE: Complete new CDI - website open
 

I think the MCLR pin is disabled so there is no resistor needed.

RE: Complete new CDI - website open
 

can you translate to English ?

RE: Complete new CDI - website open
 

<div> My Gompy's type scooter cdi works great using extra diode - I am using it on gokart for racing purposes (125ccm chinese zhonseng/Lifan engine with inductive pickup spins up to 13000RPM). End of my last competiton was broken front sprocket (broken external teeth) I now it sometimes have twin spark in very short time but this is no problem. After 12000 PC tacho jumps up to 20000RPM why? </div>

RE: Complete new CDI - website open
 

Just found these if anyone is interested. Might make building the CDI section a little easier for some.
Chip is a speciality capacitor charger and then there is the transformer, apparently like a matched pair.
About $20.00 total.

LT3750 charger chip....10pin

GA3460-BL transformer......about 26 mm square..surface mount

http://www.coilcraft.com/pn/GA3460-BL.htm

RE: Complete new CDI - website open
 

This is the bug I am still having also but at a lower rpm. Most of my testing points to the software in the pic chip.
If this could be addressed, it would be a perfect system. We have a new timer that works perfectly with half of the components. Very simple and very small. Boards available soon.

John

RE: Complete new CDI - website open
 

Those items would do the job just fine, but are too large for
for model usage.

John

RE: Complete new CDI - website open
 

How big are your torroids...???
How much problem are you having getting just the right match for torroid versus capacitor charge...??
How many people can get access to the torroid cores you mention here.??

RE: Complete new CDI - website open
 

The torroid I use measures .5" od .3 Id .187 high. It's a standard size.
My ignitions all work perfectly. In my parts listing for constructing my ignition, there is a Ferroxcube partnumber that I use. If not available, I use anything close to the size with great results.
Been building the same ignitions fo over 25 years with no problems in my original design.

John

RE: Complete new CDI - website open
 

OK...thanks John
When you refer to your ignition......is it derived from the postings here ?? It's just that there are 22 pages of discussion with many problems and another thread with over 57 pages, trying, for what I can see, to perfect the system. I realise it can be a mamoth task sometimes but I am a bit confused when you say you have a system that works perfectly for 25 years. Is this just the power section you are referring to..?? If so, ok, I understand.

RE: Complete new CDI - website open
 

Hi Bluejets,
Yes I am referring to my actual cdi board, the high voltage board. It's in the posts here on the forum. Not sure how far back, too many pages to read thru, I agree!
We are in the process of releasing a perfected timer board to mate with my cdi design. It's very small, low parts count, and easy to construct. I have been testing it on my conversion on my plane and it works very reliable with no known bugs.
Pictures and parts list coming soon. Uses a low cost 12f683 pic chip. Be patient, good things take time. I know everyone will like it.

John