I glanced up at the total engine posts glow over 72,000 diesel 599 that makes us 8/10ths of
1% and there is maybe only about 2 dozen of us using this site,and we wonder why so few
diesels are manufactured?? Its sort of hard to believe that many RCers don't see the
advantages. Smell and cleaning airplanes cannot be the whole answer

Well,
as electric indoor flyer in Sweden, and very recently got my first diesel (for outdoors flying), my impression is that diesels have a bad reputation. Among all things, for instance they give nasty kickbacks (due to small prop. diameter), they never start (due to wrong technique), the fuel is not very healthy to inhale (Kerosene is well known to soften the brain tissue, and ether will get you asleep), and also that unstabilized ether kept under wrong conditions for long time will start producing peroxides, the engines give less power compared to a glow engine with the same weight, the fuel is difficult to get (anyway in Sweden), and so on and so on.

That's my opinion...... but I have only been in to model aircraft for 3,5 years. But my own experiences with glow engines are negative. And my little PAW .09 also did not run well after I had bought it. But after consulting the dealer (Thomas Natansson) who had sold it to me, I went to him, got 3-minute lesson and after that a swore not to look in the users manual again. The little PAW has now got several hours of breaking in, and it is very predictable.

Last week I could lay my hands upon Eric Cluttons diary. My first diesel will certainly not be the last.

Cheers / Ingvar

I am proud to be a member of a small, stinky elite.

Jim

Ingvar, a soft brain and sleepiness are things I had when I was born.

thank you Jim I almost used elite in the post but did not want to be accused of having a swelled
head. Did you folks know there is a line of designer wear by "diesel" I bet the jeans are the price of a good engine. Also was going thru my spares area to find a carb for one of my
irvine 40 diesels and found a whole irvine 40 diesel
thought I only had 3

I have a friend who has been into RC for about 22 years. He's never tried a diesel. I put a Davis head on my 46 and we got it all set to go. He is quite impressed with the whole thing. He likes the smell! I think it lingers too long and must admit that I prefer glow fuel smell more.

My thought as to why people don't get into it, even if they've seen the benefits are 1) why change? 2) have to get all the extra stuff for it like different fuel line, a different type of fuel to store, different pump/bulb... and 3) no one else around to show them the ropes/get advise from.

JS

My theory is that most people don't have the patience and skill to even tune a glow engine correctly. Throw in another variable (compression screw) and it scares the bejesus out of them. Fuel availability is the biggest problem as you have to make it yourself or send away for it. I've never seen it in a hobby shop, so this is one more obstacle.

I like the smell and if you use scented lamp oil instead of the kerosene component your wife may even like it. Use citronella and you can keep mosquitoes away as an added bonus!

Max

I've run maybe a dozen gallons of diesel fuel. I think they have changed the formulation as it doesn't have much smell anymore.

Jim

Soft brain? That's good for me 'cause everyone says I have a hard head.

I think all the reasons for resistance to diesels are listed her ein the various posts except 1. I don't know about you guys but for me, being a motor head, I just plain like to run diesels. I love the smell all acrid and nasty. I really am always amazed at the grunt of these engines. Now for years I flew glow and still do as a major power source, though the truth is I'm a rubber flyer. Sparkers fascinate me too am I've done some glow to spark converts just for the fun of it. I must say though that my interest is more in the engine itself then the utility of it. I love the old LLLOOONNNGGG strokers like the AHC diesel I just finished. I love tiny ones like the Bambi and I'm getting ready to built and ED Baby as soon as the casting shows up. I fly some CL and FF on diesel, but none throttled.

I guess for me I'm more interested in the engines themselves than their advantages vs disadvantages.

I fly a GP Cub ARF on floats w/ST90 and TF Spitfire with MVVS 91, 3 bladed Graupner 15/8 prop that looks almost scale size.

I like the scale sound, and how else could I get a 19 oz engine to swing a 3X 15/8 prop? And with the rear exhaust header, it doesn't even need a muffler!

yes, I also agree with most of these reasons...

For instance, I am the only guy in my club of 30 that runs diesels. There is one "experienced" member who has run glow engines for allmost 30 years that bought a diesel and never could run it. I mentioned I would help him but had allready given up. I think this fellow needs help even to set a glow engine IMO.... but yes, if you dont have a basic understanding for setting engines period it can be tricky.

I think there is a thrill in running something that few others have or can do. EVen in glow engines I try and look for stuff no one else in my club has.

AJC

Long strokes bring a few of my engines to mind. I have some replica Mills diesels. All seem to run well. Another is one of my all-time favorites, a David Anderson twin stack .15 from the 1950's.
I don't have the tools nor knowledge to make my own engines...but that does not lessen my enjoyment of running them. Two diesels that appeared in model airplane mags with building instructions that I remember are the "MAN .09" (from Model Airplane News, mid/late 50's) and I think the other one was a "Dragon" which was a high school shop project - don't remember which mag.

George

I have a couple Mills replicas too, the Indian versions and they do run very nicely. One of them however didn't run when I received it and I found pin holes in the rear cover. I sent it back and it was replaced and that one had the same problem. I carefully identified the holes, removed the cover and lightly center punched them (there were 2). Reassembled and it's run sweet ever since.

The Little Dragon is probably my first exposure to engine building. I stood for hours watching my Dad labor over one of them on a miserable little Craftsman lathe (I could just get me nose over the edge of the bench). This was not the Atlas, but the cheap one with plain bearings and zinc gears. What a thrill when it took off and ran. I should build one just for memory sake. I vaguely remember the article on the MAN .09, I'll have to look it up.

They are really fun engines and like Andrew said, running something the others don't know about is pretty neat too. Its the same with my old Indian motorcycle with a kick starter, foot clutch, left hand throttle and right hand (what??) spark advance. Not to mention the right hand shifter, I get all kinds on questions about that. I get a kick out of them all though, engines still hold such a fascination for me. I used to collect junk Clintons and Briggs engines and build runners out of them. I had an old REO that I'd drag outside and run just for the enjoyment of hearing it run. I remember seeing my Dad's dual needle Torp .19 and did the same thing whith a 2HP Clinton and bicycle horn. Never got the silly thing to do more then run out a prime, but I learned allot. The neighborhood kids thought I was weird between the machines and the model airplanes, but when they needed something fixed I wasn't too weird! I remember going to the ball diamond and they'd ask me if I wanted to play ball. "No, just waiting until you're done so I can fly my model".

Whoa! I'm getting carried away. Neat stuff these gooey machines!

ahc ? Im new ,but it sounds good.
I have a fox 78 rc motor, was going to rebuild it.
ahc?

[email protected]

I may be off base but I believe that America's Hobby Center commissioned to have these built so they could distribute them. The project was called off for some reason.
More accurate info?

George

Hey Bolts,

The AHC diesel is an engine that was never produced. It was to have been a name produce for America's Hobby Center, the "wish list" advertiser from the mid '40s well into the '60s. I'm guessing around 1946-47 there was at least one prototype made and a short run of crankcase castings, but the project never advanced past that. A member of a group of model engine builders called the Motor Boys International found the castings and through a seriers of efforts they produced drawings for the engine parts so they could be built.

My AHC diesel was built by me using the MBI drawings and a casting I bought off e***. Every now and then someone sells one of these basically one-off engines, but they're not readily available. So, you could wait an watch ,or like Andrew Coholic, others and myself, build one!

Hi George,

I don't know why and haven't heard anyone give a factual reason as to why this engine was not produced. I could be that in that era, glow was the coming (arrived actually) thing and they decided that a diesel just wasn't viable at the time. This makes the most sense to me, but I don't know the real answer. This little .12 engine is nice to start and run, but I suppose they just didn't see a market for it.

[] thanks guys,i was just dreaming.guess ill look to rebuild my 78 fox

I guess Ill try and order parts.

Thanks wayandbolts

In my case, I have never used diesels before because no one in my club uses one so I can't ask anyone for help. Of course, none of the local hobby shops carry the engines nor the fuel.
I have had great success with glow, so why change something with has worked great?

I am now buying a diesel because of a specific use, endurance, where diesels excel. If I have a good experience, I may continue using in for sport flying and some other members may try it also.

I am a relative newcomer to diesels having bought my first one this past summer. I am not at all surprised at the numbers. Diesels are a niche product and are not likely to become mainstream in the US any time soon. Modelers are not particularly resistant to change, in fact they are pretty receptive to new things that offer significant advantage. A case in point is the glow plug. When I begun flying powered models all engines were spark ignition. When Mr. Arden came out with his glow plug, it swept the field, and within just a few years spark ignition engines vanished from the hobby shop shelves. The key to the change was a significant improvement in operation.

Model diesels have been around for at least fifty years and were the predominant power plant in Europe for many years. If there were a really significant overall advantage to the diesel over the glow engines I believe modelers would have changed over by now. If the average sport modeler was too dense to understand it, certainly the serious competition fliers would have changed over and the winner’s circle would be dominated by diesels. There must be a reason that this has not happened.

Although diesels have some uncontested advantages over glow powered engines, there are some real drawbacks. I won’t try to list all the pros and cons here as any such list would be incomplete, and any particular item would be subject to further discussion. Those who have operated diesels for years have learned to deal with the idiosyncrasies and have no problems. If the performance gains were enough, this wouldn’t matter, but in the everyday world of R/C flying there is not enough advantage to justify the trouble for most people.

I must say that I have enjoyed my little PAW and have learned a lot about diesels by tinkering with it. I hope to have it in an airplane again soon, but I doubt if I will buy another.

Lou I cannot discount anything you stated . I got into the newer engines irvines mainly the 53s and 46 conversions and it just became a second nature (TO ME)
larger props fuel economy ) (yes had to pipe the exhaust out of the way)
Just crank and go at field no glow starters ( and yes the spray cleaner and towels)
A lot of folks find that a bother along with the "truck smell". my 4 stroke glows toss
a lot of oil also in the exhaust so cleaning one or the other same thing to me. I guess
my main reason is not having an in flight quit (unless out of fuel) I had a few flights
where maybe I had CRS that they were grossly mal-adjusted but they still ran got
them down and reset the needle compression or both and off again. Then again
my old irvine 40 glow has never let me down and very little clean up, Getting off
the subject a little the irvine 53 is one of the best I have seen great transitions
super no hassel carbs AS GLOW or DIESEL No I am not trying to setoff the OS
fanatics I got a better deal on irvine had it been OS price wise would have been
them (I do have and OS40 and 52 in the 4 strk barn)

One more thing on the fuel economy of diesel/vs glow . the Glow 4 strokers give better mileage than 2 strokers as we know so that is an alternative