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Diesel Fuel Powered?

Old 03-29-2009, 07:06 AM
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JonnyLightening
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Default Diesel Fuel Powered?

Not sure if this question was asked, but is there a way to convert a 4 stroke nitro engine to run off Diesel you get at the pumps? If so is it hard to do?
Old 03-29-2009, 07:50 AM
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Default RE: Diesel Fuel Powered?


ORIGINAL: JonnyLightening

Not sure if this question was asked, but is there a way to convert a 4 stroke nitro engine to run off Diesel you get at the pumps? If so is it hard to do?
Read this whole history about 4 stroke diesel engine: http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_900816/tm.htm

Pure diesel from the pump? Answer are no. The fuel need ether as a ignitor to ignite in low compression temperature.
Old 03-30-2009, 10:27 PM
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lildiesel
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Default RE: Diesel Fuel Powered?

Somewhere in this forum there have been several discussions of running glow engines on model diesel fuel without any modifications. Just light the plug and start the engine with model diesel fuel. The engine can continue to run as a "diesel" when the glow starter is removed. Also check the threads about model diesel fuel mixes, which combine ether, lamp oil or another fuel component, castor oil, and a diesel ignition improver. I've tried mixing batches of fuel with pump diesel as the fuel component and it does work, but I prefer buying ultra pure smokeless lamp oil for my smaller engines.


ORIGINAL: JonnyLightening

Not sure if this question was asked, but is there a way to convert a 4 stroke nitro engine to run off Diesel you get at the pumps? If so is it hard to do?
Old 03-30-2009, 10:53 PM
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Default RE: Diesel Fuel Powered?

I think this guy was asking whether it was possible to run glows on commercial FULL SIZE diesel engine fuel-ie motor vehicle diesel. The short answer of course, is No, No, and No.

ffkiwi
Old 09-22-2009, 03:33 PM
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Default RE: Diesel Fuel Powered?

Why can't it be done. Iunderstand a r/c "diesel"is really just a compression ignition engine and doesn't operate like a true diesel. However with some modification wouldnt it be possible to create one that could run on pure pump gas diesel? Off the top of my head Iwould think that you would need to increase the compression ratio to about at least14:1, and change how the fuel flow is injected into the engine.
Old 09-22-2009, 07:26 PM
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Default RE: Diesel Fuel Powered?

I have run four strokes engines as diesel on kerosene and oil, without ether. A few others also had success with two stroke engines. The next step is of course pump diesel, but kerosene is so similar that there is little distinction.

Is it possible?

Yes.

Is it practical, not really.
Old 09-22-2009, 08:14 PM
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Jim Thomerson
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Default RE: Diesel Fuel Powered?

What if you keep the glow plug lit?
Old 09-23-2009, 08:31 AM
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Default RE: Diesel Fuel Powered?

JIM kero or diesel or gasoline will not keep a glow plug lit as soon as power is removed from the plug it will go out a catalytic action between methanol is need to keep it glowing
keeping it on all the time course might work but do not think you would have a good running engine throttle response etc


martin
Old 09-23-2009, 10:28 AM
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Default RE: Diesel Fuel Powered?


ORIGINAL: gkamysz
... The next step is of course pump diesel, but kerosene is so similar that there is little distinction.
For some reason I thought that pump diesel was #2 fuel oil with added road tax (in the USA). I understand that kerosene would be equivalent the #1 weight...a bit lighter.

Then again, I believe many farmers run tractors on kerosene.

Anyone know the facts?

George
Old 09-23-2009, 11:36 AM
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Default RE: Diesel Fuel Powered?

Yes, the difference now that we have ultra low sulfur diesel is small. Yes kerosene is basically No.1 diesel, but I've never seen it here. We have No.2. Autoignition temperature and flash point of No.2 is ~25°C higher than kerosene or No.1.
Old 09-23-2009, 07:00 PM
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Default RE: Diesel Fuel Powered?

Are lamp oil and kerosene the same, apart from the colour of the dye, and the scent added to lamp oil?

I have been thinking of trying it in my diesel fuel, but do not want to waste my time as it is more expensive, especially if it does not perform as well as kerosene.
Old 09-23-2009, 09:40 PM
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Default RE: Diesel Fuel Powered?

I have looked at several specs for lamp oils available in the US. Some are quite a bit heavier than kerosene, but in general they all have significantly higher flash points. I must have kept only datasheets for the more suitable ones as I don't have any for the heavier lamp oils. Look up the MSDS. If the lamp oil has an autoignition temperature above 240°C (kerosene is 205-210°C) I wouldn't bother with it. Lamp oil is intended to be safer than kerosene so it has higher flash points, and sometimes autoignition and boiling points. There was a pretty big thread over at the British forum. I have seen datasheets for Kerosene quoting autoignition figures in the range that is typically seen for No.2 diesel. So you can only trust these things so far. Jet fuel would probably be the most consistent world wide, but even so F2C racers have had trouble with Jet-A performing consistently. I only used K-1 for flying. I have experimented with quite a few other fuels.
Old 09-23-2009, 11:19 PM
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Default RE: Diesel Fuel Powered?


ORIGINAL: fiery

Are lamp oil and kerosene the same, apart from the colour of the dye, and the scent added to lamp oil?

I have been thinking of trying it in my diesel fuel, but do not want to waste my time as it is more expensive, especially if it does not perform as well as kerosene.

The best performing kerosene known for model diesels available right now in Australia is the light blue stuff sold in one and four litre containers at "Super Cheap Auto" branches. You probably have one locally. The local team racers are all using it.

Much of the other stuff including the lamp oil, performs poorly.

Ray
Old 09-24-2009, 12:13 AM
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Default RE: Diesel Fuel Powered?

Just 5 minutes from my workplace Ray ... The staff are quite familiar with me (I live in a small town).

And, like most things at Super Cheap Auto, it will be at a good price.

I'll stock up on some. Thanks for the tip. I have some reagent grade ether ... and good castor .... so I am right to make a new batch of fuel I'd say.

I also have access to JetA1, but ... if there is no practical benefit to using it ... I'll stick to good old regular SCA kero. The Team Race boys tend to know the know [8D] when it comes to getting the most from their engines.
Old 09-24-2009, 08:53 AM
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Default RE: Diesel Fuel Powered?

http://controlline.org.uk/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=2701

This is the thread I was thinking about. Looks like Ray was in on that one.
Old 09-24-2009, 05:06 PM
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Default RE: Diesel Fuel Powered?

Great reading. Thanks Greg.

http://dkd.net/clmodels/acln/acln73.pdf

The above is a link to a very technical article concerning team race fuels.
Old 10-02-2009, 11:05 AM
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Default RE: Diesel Fuel Powered?

I attempted to run my FS-48 on No.2 pump diesel (DF2) the other day. This engine runs on etherless kerosene without issue(I posted a video of this on youtube the other day). I could only get a few pops out of it after warming up on normal fuel. It would not run hot enough to run well on DF2. I added an arbitrary amount of ether to the mix and did get the engine running, but there was a lot of white smoke and unburned DF2. After running the engine on kerosene, I think with just a little more compression it would run on DF2. The problem is that there is no simple way to increase compression further due to the design of the engine. It will need a new piston.
Old 10-09-2009, 02:11 PM
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Default RE: Diesel Fuel Powered?


ORIGINAL: gcb


ORIGINAL: gkamysz
... The next step is of course pump diesel, but kerosene is so similar that there is little distinction.
For some reason I thought that pump diesel was #2 fuel oil with added road tax (in the USA). I understand that kerosene would be equivalent the #1 weight...a bit lighter.

Then again, I believe many farmers run tractors on kerosene.

Anyone know the facts?

George


I used to work for a man that owned a combo machine shop/foundry. His furnaces in the foundry burned #2 home heating oil, as did his VW Diesel powered station wagon. We used to fill up the VW station wagon's fuel tank every morning from the foundry's oil tank. He ran a couple of water filters in the VW and never had a problem burning the #2 home heating oil.


Ed Cregger

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