(Something Fast?) Delta Build Thread
06-22-2008, 06:44 AM
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RE: (Something Fast?) Delta Build Thread
ORIGINAL: gooseF22
A small prop on this one is ok because it has little drag. I was using a proven system. I ran the power system 6S 2500Kv on the nitrocat before just to test it. it was delivering around 800 watts consistently when warm and midrange on batteries. with the higer voltage, it unloads superbly, but that airframe is draggy. It would scoot about 90mph. You could tell the static thrust just wasnt quite what was needed but it would still climb straight up. If I were gonna try to make a total screamer, then up the motor to a 1600 or 1900 kv motor and go 8S, but I dont know how you would get 8 btts in there, but the power difference between the two is pretty big, and wires get hot fast above 1000 watts.
A small prop on this one is ok because it has little drag. I was using a proven system. I ran the power system 6S 2500Kv on the nitrocat before just to test it. it was delivering around 800 watts consistently when warm and midrange on batteries. with the higer voltage, it unloads superbly, but that airframe is draggy. It would scoot about 90mph. You could tell the static thrust just wasnt quite what was needed but it would still climb straight up. If I were gonna try to make a total screamer, then up the motor to a 1600 or 1900 kv motor and go 8S, but I dont know how you would get 8 btts in there, but the power difference between the two is pretty big, and wires get hot fast above 1000 watts.
Hi Goose,
I was thinking of going along the same lines.... I have a Kontronik Fun 600-18 (kv=1800). I was thinking of using a 8S A123 battery. This would unload to 40,000rpm in the air with a 5.5x4.3 prop. My guess is that the system can take it but the prop seems waaaay too small to produce any usable thrust.
Do you have any suggestions as to what battery and prop could work with a plane like this and the Kontronik?
erazz
06-23-2008, 08:29 PM
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RE: (Something Fast?) Delta Build Thread
ok got it covered 
check it out looks fast sitn here and balanced out with a one oz of lead
bet this is going to haul *****!!!!!! yea baby!![img][/img]
check it out looks fast sitn here and balanced out with a one oz of lead
bet this is going to haul *****!!!!!! yea baby!![img][/img]
06-23-2008, 11:51 PM
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RE: (Something Fast?) Delta Build Thread
Well Mike, I actually broke out my Demon plans and cut my ribs out tonight. I need to order a couple of spars but I believe I have most of the other wood in my pile-o-wood collection. I had fired up my K&B 6.5 rear exhaust not long ago and it sounds great. I may need to trim my header to tune and I plan on cowling the head in for added streamlining. As soon as I have something interesting to show I'll post pics.
06-24-2008, 09:35 AM
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RE: (Something Fast?) Delta Build Thread
ORIGINAL: FASTCRASHER
ok got it covered
check it out looks fast sitn here and balanced out with a one oz of lead
bet this is going to haul *****!!!!!! yea baby!![img][/img]
ok got it covered
check it out looks fast sitn here and balanced out with a one oz of lead
bet this is going to haul *****!!!!!! yea baby!![img][/img]
Troy - RCU
I use Beman Venture 340 arrow shafts that you may find locally. Post pics when you get to that point. There are three scratch build Demons flying that I know of.
06-24-2008, 11:04 PM
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RE: (Something Fast?) Delta Build Thread
I am now in the head scratching mode with a potential issue. If you look at this pic you'll see the straight rear exhaust manifold and an 8oz tank behind the motor. This is everything lined up on center with the rib. What are my options for a lower profile tank than this one? I can't go lower with the tank or I'll be bulging out the bottom of the wing too much. As it is, there will likely be a bump there to accommodate the tank and provide a hand grip area. Should I be looking at one of the bladder tanks or will a standard clunk style be cool for now? Is there an available manifold that will re-route the pipe connection higher?
Note too that this motor has a throttled carb fitted to the old venturi intake. You would be surprised how well this thing idles and transitions to full throttle. I may be taking a small hit on top RPM but this will be a 'sport' plane and I want to have throttle control. I have to move the motor forward a hair to make room for the carb.
Note too that this motor has a throttled carb fitted to the old venturi intake. You would be surprised how well this thing idles and transitions to full throttle. I may be taking a small hit on top RPM but this will be a 'sport' plane and I want to have throttle control. I have to move the motor forward a hair to make room for the carb.
06-24-2008, 11:45 PM
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RE: (Something Fast?) Delta Build Thread
ChuckL ran a Jett 60LX with a straight pipe like yours on his. He dropped the bottom down rather then raise the top so the pipe would not hit the tank. I would probably drop the bottom down a little plus raise the top some so the pipe would clear. Since you are scratch building you could make the engine mount a little longer for the rear intake.
06-24-2008, 11:45 PM
#433
RE: (Something Fast?) Delta Build Thread
ORIGINAL: Troy-RCU
Is there an available manifold that will re-route the pipe connection higher?
Is there an available manifold that will re-route the pipe connection higher?
#3452 should do the trick.
Mark
06-25-2008, 12:19 PM
#434
RE: (Something Fast?) Delta Build Thread
ORIGINAL: erazz
Hi Goose,
I was thinking of going along the same lines.... I have a Kontronik Fun 600-18 (kv=1800). I was thinking of using a 8S A123 battery. This would unload to 40,000rpm in the air with a 5.5x4.3 prop. My guess is that the system can take it but the prop seems waaaay too small to produce any usable thrust.
Do you have any suggestions as to what battery and prop could work with a plane like this and the Kontronik?
erazz
ORIGINAL: gooseF22
A small prop on this one is ok because it has little drag. I was using a proven system. I ran the power system 6S 2500Kv on the nitrocat before just to test it. it was delivering around 800 watts consistently when warm and midrange on batteries. with the higer voltage, it unloads superbly, but that airframe is draggy. It would scoot about 90mph. You could tell the static thrust just wasnt quite what was needed but it would still climb straight up. If I were gonna try to make a total screamer, then up the motor to a 1600 or 1900 kv motor and go 8S, but I dont know how you would get 8 btts in there, but the power difference between the two is pretty big, and wires get hot fast above 1000 watts.
A small prop on this one is ok because it has little drag. I was using a proven system. I ran the power system 6S 2500Kv on the nitrocat before just to test it. it was delivering around 800 watts consistently when warm and midrange on batteries. with the higer voltage, it unloads superbly, but that airframe is draggy. It would scoot about 90mph. You could tell the static thrust just wasnt quite what was needed but it would still climb straight up. If I were gonna try to make a total screamer, then up the motor to a 1600 or 1900 kv motor and go 8S, but I dont know how you would get 8 btts in there, but the power difference between the two is pretty big, and wires get hot fast above 1000 watts.
Hi Goose,
I was thinking of going along the same lines.... I have a Kontronik Fun 600-18 (kv=1800). I was thinking of using a 8S A123 battery. This would unload to 40,000rpm in the air with a 5.5x4.3 prop. My guess is that the system can take it but the prop seems waaaay too small to produce any usable thrust.
Do you have any suggestions as to what battery and prop could work with a plane like this and the Kontronik?
erazz
that prop is too small.
with 1800 and 8S, find a Cam prop, 6x6, or very gently cut down a 7x6 cam series.
I am now running a cam 7x6 on my 1600 8S nitro cat and it hauls the mail but doesn't overload the batts.
8S may be too much for this setup. A 6S with 1800 and you could run a 8x6 apc and haul the mail. my 2500 is running a 6x5.5 and I will trim it by sanding the tips. we got 10 mph out of the cam prop for less load than the apc or MA.
best guess is 120mph now, so with that wattage on the deamon, it should go 130 plus or so, its easlily 1/2 the weight and 1/2 the drag. When A123's unload, they unload big because the voltage depresses so much under high load, when it unloads, it really picks up speed. You can really hear it accelerating on the down line. Loaded the 8S dprepesses to about 18.5 to 19 volts from over 28, so as it unloades the battery amperage at speed just a bit, the motor really picks up rpm. by dropping to a 7 inch prop, I really picked up rpm. I was worried about static but it took off in 50 feet versus before it was about 40. no big deal. It still climbs like a rocket.
Sorry guys Im in the middle of Jet season, so the deamon is waiting. I will get to it soon.
06-26-2008, 11:01 PM
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RE: (Something Fast?) Delta Build Thread
ORIGINAL: mmattockx
http://www.macspro.com/headers_rear.asp
#3452 should do the trick.
Mark
ORIGINAL: Troy-RCU
Is there an available manifold that will re-route the pipe connection higher?
Is there an available manifold that will re-route the pipe connection higher?
#3452 should do the trick.
Mark
06-27-2008, 07:59 PM
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RE: (Something Fast?) Delta Build Thread
hey mike im going to fly her tomorrow if the weather will let me
i stared it today and man this baby wants to go!!!! had a hard time holding it at half throttle...Awsome!!
WELL ITS WINDY AND RAINY HERE IN INDIANA
[:'(]
SO SOON AS I CAN!
i stared it today and man this baby wants to go!!!! had a hard time holding it at half throttle...Awsome!!
WELL ITS WINDY AND RAINY HERE IN INDIANA
[:'(]SO SOON AS I CAN!
06-29-2008, 01:37 PM
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RE: (Something Fast?) Delta Build Thread
ORIGINAL: gooseF22
Ya,
that prop is too small.
with 1800 and 8S, find a Cam prop, 6x6, or very gently cut down a 7x6 cam series.
I am now running a cam 7x6 on my 1600 8S nitro cat and it hauls the mail but doesn't overload the batts.
8S may be too much for this setup. A 6S with 1800 and you could run a 8x6 apc and haul the mail. my 2500 is running a 6x5.5 and I will trim it by sanding the tips. we got 10 mph out of the cam prop for less load than the apc or MA.
best guess is 120mph now, so with that wattage on the deamon, it should go 130 plus or so, its easlily 1/2 the weight and 1/2 the drag. When A123's unload, they unload big because the voltage depresses so much under high load, when it unloads, it really picks up speed. You can really hear it accelerating on the down line. Loaded the 8S dprepesses to about 18.5 to 19 volts from over 28, so as it unloades the battery amperage at speed just a bit, the motor really picks up rpm. by dropping to a 7 inch prop, I really picked up rpm. I was worried about static but it took off in 50 feet versus before it was about 40. no big deal. It still climbs like a rocket.
Sorry guys Im in the middle of Jet season, so the deamon is waiting. I will get to it soon.
Ya,
that prop is too small.
with 1800 and 8S, find a Cam prop, 6x6, or very gently cut down a 7x6 cam series.
I am now running a cam 7x6 on my 1600 8S nitro cat and it hauls the mail but doesn't overload the batts.
8S may be too much for this setup. A 6S with 1800 and you could run a 8x6 apc and haul the mail. my 2500 is running a 6x5.5 and I will trim it by sanding the tips. we got 10 mph out of the cam prop for less load than the apc or MA.
best guess is 120mph now, so with that wattage on the deamon, it should go 130 plus or so, its easlily 1/2 the weight and 1/2 the drag. When A123's unload, they unload big because the voltage depresses so much under high load, when it unloads, it really picks up speed. You can really hear it accelerating on the down line. Loaded the 8S dprepesses to about 18.5 to 19 volts from over 28, so as it unloades the battery amperage at speed just a bit, the motor really picks up rpm. by dropping to a 7 inch prop, I really picked up rpm. I was worried about static but it took off in 50 feet versus before it was about 40. no big deal. It still climbs like a rocket.
Sorry guys Im in the middle of Jet season, so the deamon is waiting. I will get to it soon.
But I guess that hard experience is better than Motocalc at any rate. I think I'll start with 7S and a 6x6 prop (same as 8S and 1600kv motor). If it works for you it'll probably work for me too
I know what you mean by jet season.... So many planes and so little time
All the best!
06-29-2008, 10:55 PM
#438
RE: (Something Fast?) Delta Build Thread
dont forget to check out the graupner Cam series props. they are awesome at high speeds. I picked up 10 mph and use 9 amps less going from an 8x6 apc to a 7x6 cam, so I guess I was over static loading it.
07-01-2008, 12:33 PM
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RE: (Something Fast?) Delta Build Thread
WOOOOOOOOOOOOOW!!!!!!!!!!!
I FLEW HER TODAY!! AND RIGHT NOW I CAN ONLY FLY HER AT UNDER HALF THROTTLE AND DANG IT WAS A HAND FULL!![sm=tongue_smile.gif] I HAVE NO EXPO ON MY RADIO SO THE TURNING WAS VERY ERADIC, EVEN AFTER SETING MY D/R TO 20%
BUT I HAVE VERY SMALL HORNS ON THE ELAVONS AND GOING TO PUT FULL SIZE HORNS ON IT AND USE THE TOP HOLE TO HELP SLOW IT DOWN A BIT.
BUT WOW MAN IS THIS THING FAST !!!! MY NEES ARE STILL SHAKEN
THIS IS WHAT I FLEW TODAY[img][/img]
I FLEW HER TODAY!! AND RIGHT NOW I CAN ONLY FLY HER AT UNDER HALF THROTTLE AND DANG IT WAS A HAND FULL!![sm=tongue_smile.gif] I HAVE NO EXPO ON MY RADIO SO THE TURNING WAS VERY ERADIC, EVEN AFTER SETING MY D/R TO 20%
BUT I HAVE VERY SMALL HORNS ON THE ELAVONS AND GOING TO PUT FULL SIZE HORNS ON IT AND USE THE TOP HOLE TO HELP SLOW IT DOWN A BIT.
BUT WOW MAN IS THIS THING FAST !!!! MY NEES ARE STILL SHAKEN
THIS IS WHAT I FLEW TODAY[img][/img]
07-01-2008, 02:56 PM
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RE: (Something Fast?) Delta Build Thread
ORIGINAL: FASTCRASHER
...NO EXPO ON MY RADIO...
...NO EXPO ON MY RADIO...
My first delta (a Dust) did not have expo and it was a handful at first but after a few flights things were fine. I would set the control throws to 3/8" for elevator and ailerons on high rates and 1/4" on low rates. if you have plenty of elevator for landing you might remove that ounce of lead out of the tail to move the CG forward a bit.
07-02-2008, 06:48 AM
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RE: (Something Fast?) Delta Build Thread
thanks mike !!... this is a awsome plane scarry fast but awsome!!
on takeoff i only had her just under half thr. and she went straight up so i slowed her down to around 1/4 thr. and straightened her out...by that time she was past the end of the field so i touched left aileron and lol it spun all the way around to were it was flying upside down[X(] so i worked it back around the field rockin the wings from side to side trying to get her level and by the time i did it was time to turn again ...lol so i did five or six of these runs by the field b4 i tryed to land her so i got her lined up with the field and killed the eng. and she smoothed out and glided in 5 feet from my feet!!
my second flite went a lot better becouse the first flight my D/R (ailerons) was set at 40% so i cut that down to 20% it was still twichy but was able to handle it alot better so now im going to add the reg size horns and put my controls on the top hole and that should help me a lot![8D]
thanks again mike!!!!
on takeoff i only had her just under half thr. and she went straight up so i slowed her down to around 1/4 thr. and straightened her out...by that time she was past the end of the field so i touched left aileron and lol it spun all the way around to were it was flying upside down[X(] so i worked it back around the field rockin the wings from side to side trying to get her level and by the time i did it was time to turn again ...lol so i did five or six of these runs by the field b4 i tryed to land her so i got her lined up with the field and killed the eng. and she smoothed out and glided in 5 feet from my feet!!
my second flite went a lot better becouse the first flight my D/R (ailerons) was set at 40% so i cut that down to 20% it was still twichy but was able to handle it alot better so now im going to add the reg size horns and put my controls on the top hole and that should help me a lot![8D]
thanks again mike!!!!
07-12-2008, 10:46 PM
#442
RE: (Something Fast?) Delta Build Thread
Got the tails on, started sanding and glassing, and making progress. I crashed my nitrocat yesterday, so I guess I better get going on this bird now. Sorry it has taken so long.
07-13-2008, 08:38 AM
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RE: (Something Fast?) Delta Build Thread
ORIGINAL: FASTCRASHER
my second flite went a lot better becouse the first flight my D/R (ailerons) was set at 40% so i cut that down to 20% it was still twichy but was able to handle it alot better so now im going to add the reg size horns and put my controls on the top hole and that should help me a lot![8D]
my second flite went a lot better becouse the first flight my D/R (ailerons) was set at 40% so i cut that down to 20% it was still twichy but was able to handle it alot better so now im going to add the reg size horns and put my controls on the top hole and that should help me a lot![8D]
07-16-2008, 12:21 AM
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RE: (Something Fast?) Delta Build Thread
I am gaining progress on my build. It's going fast now that the sheeting is started. Figuring out the tank compartment and future aerodynamic cowlings took some head scratching time. I will be mounting the servos in the outboard wing bays. I also had to customize the motor mount due to the long 6.5 with carb. I will fly without an aero cowl at first and then add when time allows. Can't wait to start covering!
07-16-2008, 12:36 AM
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RE: (Something Fast?) Delta Build Thread
ORIGINAL: freakingfast
Are you running any expo?
Are you running any expo?
Troy,
Looking good. The vertical fins look small but I believe I remember you saying they would be extended out the bottom for landing skids. It should move right along.
07-16-2008, 09:31 PM
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RE: (Something Fast?) Delta Build Thread
I was wondering if anyone would notice those tiny winglets. I was just day-dreaming with with one of the winglets off of my recently dusted Beach Bumm flying wing. I will be laying up some carbon winglets properly sized this week.
I plan to finish all the sheeting and start figuring out the servo mounts since I will be covering before I know it. My goal is to fly by Saturday even if it means staying up all night Friday. The tough part is deciding what I want to do at the front behind the spinner so I can add a cowl over the whole mess later....
I plan to finish all the sheeting and start figuring out the servo mounts since I will be covering before I know it. My goal is to fly by Saturday even if it means staying up all night Friday. The tough part is deciding what I want to do at the front behind the spinner so I can add a cowl over the whole mess later....
07-16-2008, 10:47 PM
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RE: (Something Fast?) Delta Build Thread
ORIGINAL: Troy-RCU
The tough part is deciding what I want to do at the front behind the spinner so I can add a cowl over the whole mess later....
The tough part is deciding what I want to do at the front behind the spinner so I can add a cowl over the whole mess later....
How about a tapered ring that the cowl will butt up against when it it installed.
Something that will blend the spinner into the cowl is what I am thinking would look nice, as well as provide a bit of cleaner airflow prior to the install of the cowl.
Hmm,
A ram air intake for the carb. intake?? (upside down F-16 intake that is part of the above mentioned ring, only on the top of the ring, below where the head/cyl. inlet would be)....
I like the direction you are looking at with the fins above and below the wing I can see why you were day-dreaming....
07-17-2008, 12:13 AM
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RE: (Something Fast?) Delta Build Thread
I plan to smooth out the area behind the spinner and blend it back into the airframe. I will likely cut a ply ring and then build off of that.