bpryor

My Feedback: (45)

Aerobear,

You're right about the looks similarity. I think what's making them look similar, besides the new head looking very similar to the MVVS 45 and 58, is you'll notice very large transfer port castings on each end of the lower part of the cylinder just like the MVVS's. This is one of the keys to getting big power out of two-strokes. What I am surprised at is there is no "third" port, or booster port, which is basically a third transfer port that most two-stroke racing engines have. Dick, do you know, or have any theories on why they aren't using a third port? Have huge transfer ports eliminated the need for a third port?

rmh

Frankly -I was really surprised at the entire layout-unlike any others I had seen.
After a loooong hard look -I did come up with a few thoughts as to " why did they do that?"
First - when it comes to flow thru ports -- what you see can be very misleading .
The shape means more than the size . (that's what they all say)
Way back when dinasaurs ruled the earth- I studied fluidic valves as a possible system to use for compact control circuits on a new machine I was doing.
These work by having NO moving parts --simply the way that air flows thru them -allows the different paths to start or stop flow- a tiny pulse of air woll flip flow from one passage to another and it stays there !
Moving on to engines - I studied best flow in intake ports for Chevs -
Again the shape of the port -far more important than the size. (second biggest lie)
The hot ticket was to change total angle of passage such that the "corner " the air turned from port thru open valve , was lessened.
Ideally - the air stayed together as it flowed around the valve head--and made a nice neat "tulip" shaped flow .
As a comparison --watch water flow thru a hole in bottom of a pan.
if the hole is not radiused - the water will flow into a smaller stream - but --if the hole is radiused -properly-not enlarged -- the flow rate is straight thru the hole - no decrease in stream size.
In both examples above -- the fluid (air is a fluid) attached itself to the passage and this affected flow.
It is a tricky business -trying to guess what really works best .
ditto on the exhaust ports.
The new 80 port is VERY different .
Bottom line -it all works very well -on mufflers too (I used different JMBcans)
On tuned pipes this thing is unreal.
Whomever the cat was who did the concept work -he really had his ---- together.

aerobear

My Feedback: (4)

I think that price includes the very steep European sales taxes. Stuff sold to those outside of the EU gets gets about 15%? off. So around $725 plus shipping, maybe. I would wait a few days to let RC Showcase get up to speed before sending orders off across the ocean.

rmh

I think, VAT is always dropped on export sales
Ja?

RCSHOWCASE

Yes the new ZDZ SUPER 80 is here!

The RC Showcase webmaster should be putting up the announcement very soon!

We should have our first shipment of these great , totally new, engines by next week.



The new Super 80 (ZDZ 80 RV-J) is priced at $825.00 and includes the new ZDZ safety ignition switch. Orders may be placed on our on-line ordering system , NOW!


David Garrison
RC Showcase.com

J roc

Can I still use the 80 bisson muffler for this engine? (Pitts). What do you suggest? Its going in a H9 sukhoi. My zdz 80 totally rocks my h9 cap. Very smooth running engine. Do I need a fibre optic kill switch with this engine? What is the safety switch? thanks.

rmh

Well - I really don't think your Bisson will fit the Super 80. The bolt spacing on mine was different -compared with my current 80.
Having said that -- the new engine was designed to be more tolerant of restrictive exhaust systems but honestly, I never tried any in cowl mufflers . Having flown a couple of models with 80's and in cowl -the sound level was just too much for me .
The new switch is described on ZDZ site -but to recap :
it is a charge switch--with a pin which is placed in the OFF port or the ON port or - ON is with no pin . It also fits the new tachometers from them which is a direct read in numbers or a graph- I really like this feature . it is terrific for engine setup. any switch will work -Until I added these to my 80 and 50 airplanes, I used the JR chargeswitch

J roc

What do suggest I use for an exhaust without having to do too many mods to the suk?

bpryor

My Feedback: (45)

You're right, that was the price with VAT. The actual price without VAT, at current exchange rates, is $723 plus shipping.....but since David has said that they will have them at RCShowcase next week, it probably isn't worth the $80 difference to forgo the customer service and warranty coverage you get when you buy it from RCShowcase.

vatechguy3

My Feedback: (11)

so dick, now that rcshowcase has them for sale, how about sharing those rpm numbers and prop choices?!?!?!?

tony

rmh

J roc-- your question is a good one .The Super 80 was designed to be more forgiving of restrictive exhausts
However, one can never expect to get full performance with in cowl mufflers
For example --The DA mufflers from DA are very open -that's how they keep their power.
ZDZ does not furnish mufflers, simply because the European market uses silencers to keep noise at a required level.
The aftermarket in cowl mufflers that muffle-really hit the power .
I do know that there are people trying to make in cowl stuff that is the best of the situation but it is a compromise.
The Supersonic is a good one - RCShowcase -when I asked about this - is giving them the info for fitting to the new engine . The only in cowl ones I likedhad short headers and a large single baffled can mounted crosswise behind the engine -still these take some work to get right and still allow airflow over entire cylinder head and jug. As you might guess - I simply go for a short header into a large can (JMB) which I fitup into fuselage -by hook or by crook.

vatechguy3

My Feedback: (11)

what prop bolt pattern does the new engine use?? will my props drilled for a da 100 fit??

thanks
tony

Forgues Research

My Feedback: (7)

That is so cool , this new engine, just what the doctor ordered, I need one of those,

Roger
Are you prepared

Antique

My Feedback: (4)

I wonder if the new 80 would compete with the GT80 ? We're turning a 19-18 carbon prop about 11,500 rpm, with about 20% nitro in the glow fuel....Rotary valve VS piston port...Maybe the new huge ports would do the trick, we've about reached the limit on the GT80...
We're clocking about 185 mph.....The ZDZ could be a new secret weapon

rmh

Might work -but at lower revs - the GT80 has a stroke of 31mm I think and the Super 80 (they stroked it -a lot) is 46mm -33% longer than the GT80!
So really a different breed of cat .
If each were turning 11,500rpm-the ZDZ would have a piston speed equal to turning the Zenoah at over 15000!
a bit over the top--
When we played with small block Chevs - the same situation existed - my 283 would easily turn over 8000 but my longer stroke 350 was a 6000 rpm setup-
So far, I have never tried an alky setup in any of my ZDZ's- maybe on alky /nitro and lots of oil-it would not mind running up that fast - the piston speed is the only factor I would be leery of
bearings crank/rod all should be ok.
The new bore/stroke ratio should really stuff the crankcase better- It was the first thing I noticed - the case has a increased center diameter of 1/4" -compared to the current RV.
The Super 80 example I ran/flew - turned Mejzlic 26x10 at 7300 right out of the box on a quick run up -using the AMT pipe .
We stuffed this setup into a a WH35% Extra and stuck a MenzS26x10 on it It would go vertical instantly - unloading as it went -right from take off.
I switched it over to a big muffler can the largest JMB 30mm inlet one on a 5" header and put it in a H9 Edge.
This was setup for IMAC- .The new ZM 26x12 carbon fiber prop was later added and this setup running flat out was too fast in level flight for maneuvering.
The tattle tale tach said it was running 7400 doing this.
On the ground that setup ran 6450- was very quiet in the air -no rip sound but the revs were evident.
The factory says 26x12 to 28x10 props -and based on the 26x12 performance -I would suspect aMejzlic 28x10 would be very similar -here is a pic of the 26x12 prop -it is very thick at hub with a rather straight edge
These props are not cheap but really work!
Note the pictures show the new engine in blue - This was initial color - I returned mine for factory inspection after my running and flogging.
Now I get to wait for the black version (the power of the schwartz)

Antique

My Feedback: (4)

We can use any prop, so if it would pull more pitch the piston speed would be way less..Would be interesting, kinda like Rare Bear with that big paddle prop....

sillyness

My Feedback: (25)

So the mounting bolt pattern is prolly different too then.

How does the compression ratio compare to the older one?

How do the temps compare to the older one... as prone to overheating? (I couldn't find anyone running the engine that had it running cool... even guys that said they loved it were on their 3rd heads)

I assume with the longer stroke that this engine is running even smoother than the older 80?

Scoubidou

My Feedback: (17)

Dick, have you tried the AMT pipe on the ZDZ-80-RV? It would be interresting to see the RPM difference between black and blue head[8D]
Daniel

rmh

yes between 300-400rpm 26x10 Mejzlic
This was also aprox what the factory said -
Ifyou swap into different prop sizes this varies
all in all -total differences with different props/mufflers I tried the difference between the two was over 300 rpm to just under 500.
On this size engine -that is quite a bit.
Said another way - the output is closer to 100 cc engines than the 80 sizers.
I ran these tests first.
In the air the difference was even more noticable-
We have flown/and setup a number of H9 Cap/Extra/ Edge with 80's/100's both ZDZ and DA.
This setup in the air seemed the strongest .
Hard to put a number on that . as it was lighter than the others by 1-2 pounds (22.25 lbs)

Scoubidou

My Feedback: (17)

God, I just received a brand new ZDZ-80 blue head 3 weeks ago.
825$-695$=130$ for 300 more RPMs and 1 pound lighter than a DA-100.

who's looking for NIB ZDZ-80-RV, please sent me a PM!!

davewallace

My Feedback: (29)

Hi,
Just from looking at the picture I can see changes and improvements. The first thing is the square bore/stroke ratio means lower rpm with a bigger prop. This also allows for a larger diameter rotary valve with a relocated carb position. It appears that the piston is ported for transfer port flow which helps cool the piston from the inside while improving breathing. The large dual channel transfers promote better scaveging and breathing. All of these things along with deeper, black cooling fins improve cooling. It will be nice when demand goes down and supply goes up. Price should come down then. This would be a good canidate for a bigger bore and say 100cc.

Dave

SVM

I have a 80-RV with a AMT pipe Got 6450 With a 26x10 Bolly wood, on new engen.

aerobear

My Feedback: (4)

Don't hold your breath.

flyinrazrback

My Feedback: (69)

FYI, the new 3W 80i is $675, price is right. Would like to compare to the zdz.

vatechguy3

My Feedback: (11)

does anyone sell a wrap around header for the zdz-80 so that you can mount the engine straight down instead of a weird angle, and still get the can to be on the plane's centerline??

or maybe is there a way to make the 80 be a rear exhaust motor??

thanks
tony