hey guys... any twin 50's out there? something like mt 70 twin... but only 50cc so I can fit it into 30cc plane...

I have two, 1 NIB, from LS Pro Enginges. I think they where GR Pro motors. I've had good luck with mine, it starts easy, runs smooth, and makes good power.

I have a sample GF55II from CRRCpro NIB, but no time to test all new engines i have.
Next week-en i will test it and report results. If you have any question about this engine , ask me by p.m.

Regards

3w-56.

anything not as expensive as 3W?? im no rich man...

The CRRCpro 55 twin looks fine.
You can see the info, specs and a draw with its size here:
http://www.crrcpro.com/product_show.asp?id=232

Maybe CRRC pro dealers can get the engine. [8D]
Here in my country is now available.

The cowl in my last picture is from a GoldWing Sbach 342 50c c
I think a 50cc twin will no fit inside a 30cc airplane cowl ...

Regards

At this point in time, if you want power, longevity, and reliability in a twin cylinder engine you pay the price for those attributes. Currently the only "budget" brand that has reasonable quality standards is DLE. It would only require a day of research and reading to learn why not going for the cheap makers would end up saving a lot of money and distress in the long run. So you have a choice: Buy cheap but get it now, or save your money until you can buy it once.

Low price should never be the pinnacle point to base a qualified decision on. A great many people have learned that the hard way. Currently the available selection of 50cc twins is severely limited. D&B might still make one. You might still find and old 3w-48 or small BME twin around on the used market. For the moment there are not any Chinese twins in this size I would buy regardlss of how inexpensive they were. I prefer to buy it and fly it instead of fussing for months trying to fix it, if it could be fixed.

Do you know how much cost this engine or have you seen the engine inside , components of this twin engine or does DLE have a twin 50cc on their offer ?
I'm working with both CRRCpro and DLE as tech service, and i agree with you about power reliability and longevity of DLE engines.
But your sentence about 'the only' ... Maybe the only you know, and i think nobody knows all. Of course on any manufacturer line-up there are engines better than others , and maybe bad engines, but ..... who knows.

Regards

Regards

I do not "know" the CRRC engine you refer to. I do know the CRRC track recod, and to date it is rather dismal. I prefer not to use the consuming public as the product testing grounds. It is not right to have the public buy a product and be used as consumer guinea pigs for product performance testing, which is something commonly done with a great many Chinese engine producers. A list of those makes is quite long, and CRRC is one of them. If and when CRRC completes extensive pruduct testing, and substantially improves on their current level of QA, it could become a viable product for the consuming market. Do you KNOW how long the engine will last, it's true output, or explored failure potential? Have you or CRRC performed life cycle and destructive failure analysis? Have you mapped cylinder porting and performed fuel maps on 10 or more engines to establish consistency? I'm prone to think not. There's been an ocean of grief generated by the number of new engines that "looked good" and priced right but failed to perform for any length of time.

Because you sell and service a product line does not make the product a good one. It only means you make money from your efforts. Not a bad thing but not proof of quality. Prove the validity of your statements, and in doing so you would start generating some sales. Looks fine and seeing a spec sheet tells people nothing. You could probably name all the other engines that provided the same"data" to excite people to buy on price and looks alone.

My original point remains the same. Buy what one knows will work, and work all the time, or be prepared to deal with issues that have no resolution. Be prepared to accept the responsibility for your actions and not blame others when you make a bad call.

Sorry T.O.M. but youre wrong in many observations.
First of all I DON'T SELL engines.
Second I have my job as computer consultant , and I DON'T MAKE MONEY repairing and sharing all my knowledge, i don't NEED to make money with engines or giving lessons to others. I finished the college 40 years ago , and i don't want for the others that i don't want for me.
Also you don't know ANYTHING about my knowledge, test, reports, life cycle or destructing test i've done. Maybe you need to post all your experience in this area. Not me.
I will do when people ask first.
About the CRRC 55, you prone too much. I also can prone about your experience and the result will be wrong , because i don't know nothing about you. Like you don't know NOTHING about me. In both cases, talk about others will result in wrong appreciations, like you've wrote about me.

As you've posted , the only way to test quality, performance, reliability and consistence on a model engine is to make a lot of analysis. Maybe you're the only one around the world to do this job and judge engines.

Regards

Talk's cheap. Send me one.

I can't comment on your propulsion bona fides since you provided nothing that relates to gas engines. Some of mine include in excess of 40 years modeling and rc experience, uav operator and repair technician, propulsion specialist for an aerospace company, specializing in fault detection and performance enhancements with rc sized gas two strokes, and over 10 years hands on dedicated to small gas two strokes.

I won't fly it but be assured it will be run through rigorous post production style test cycles. I'll post all the numbers that are obtained from the pre and post run and tear down checks.

CRRC can easily find me if they feel up to the task. I don't do computers, I only work with them. I do engines, and only engines.

I'm currently playing with the idea to fit a twin 50 cc or so in my new katana t30. I have only 280mm cowl width en don't like to make holes in it for the plug cap, also would like it to hydromount it, so this hole would have to be quite large.
Yes, there is the story of us, wetern industrial people being so thourogh and precise testing everything , maintaining tight and presice tolerances. Maybe that's true, or maybe it was true in the past when Tired Old Man was an enthousiast young man ( sorry a joke).
Personally I observe quality in the western world is mainly a bla bla, nice gentlemen with shirt and ty carrying ISO900x files with the wright revision stamp.
For a couple of decades now I observe a constant reduction of quality in our products due to price pressure, marketing analysis of "how bad can it be before profits reduce". What is the optimum quality reduction compared to price reduction and hence turnover increase? Testing is expensive and time consuming. While you are testing, you don't sell the product and you run the risk of competition being first on the market.
Additionally, here in Belgium it's tradition to fire older experienced employees or put them on a pension once they 're 55 and replace them by enthousiast youngsters with academic diplomas and zero experience.
However, some products such as cars and electronic consumer hardware certainly have maintained a very high quality standard based on their own system.

Frankly I wouldn't be supprised that we have come to the point of offering quite some western products offer lesser quality at a higher price than their Chinese opponents .

I think it's clear that the DLx engines compared to their western alikes are a striking example of this.
I'm indeed a bit reluctant to order a GF55ii for the moment because CRRC Pro was the pioneer Chinese engine manufacturer and got the whole load of unexperience and learning **** all over them resulting in becoming the underdog of Chinese modell engine manufacturers.
But I'm convinced that they've learned but still I'm cautious and awayting some more testing results.
I have a GF45 (5 years now)with some issues (loosening front bearing and throwaway exhaust)but with excellent high grade key components. From tests I've read the descendants are much better made.

Now you have something to discuss.

You're observations are interesting indeed. Unfortunately much of the Western manufacturing was moved offshore a long time ago. Much of what you see as produced in the west was actually produced elsewhere, assembled here, and relabeled. We really don't make much of anything in the U.S. anymore. I do tend to agree with you about the ISO 9000 stuff. Way too much attention to the paperwork, sacrificing the intended end product in the process.

In the larger scope of things model engines are really not all that well made, regardless of the manufacturer. They could all be a lot better. Higher desired profits are part of the reason, but in truth, only a small part of it. The cost differential between a manufactured engine and its final selling price puts them on a par with photography equipment for true profit margins. Most of the eastern manufacturers make more on an engine sale than their distributors. At least with photography you can obtain a larger difference in quality for a smaller increase in price. There is a lot of room for product improvements without an associated increase in cost.

Mpascual does not need not to sendanyone a engine, for he can determine how good a engine is just as good as anybody on this forum. I have talked with him on my own email several times. He has is a very modest guy for the things he has done right from a eary age.


As far as good twin engines...a Zenoah G80 is very well built. Capt,n

But it's not a twin 50....

One item that appears to have been overlooked by those that desire a twin 50 for a 30 sized plane is the additional weight they would be carrying in the nose. That might not work out well when combined with a limited wing area.

Yes I know a G80 Twinis not a 50cc Twin....but if the G80 could be worked into a very nice airplane& would last longer than us!!! Hey, maybe Antique could tell us how to make a lite version. I am sure they use the G80 in the all out Pylon Races. If a person has never been to a Pylon Nats Race...you owe it to yourself to get to at least one race. Man them racers are fast!. Capt,n

The plane in my avatar was first flown with a GT80 on CH ignition. It hovered and harrier pretty good, but I posted a video on RCU and several said it looked like a flying brick. To each his own I guess. I liked the way it flew the extra.

Wow....Very nice airplane in a neat setting! What size is it? Thanks Capt,n

That is an excellent photo !!! [sm=thumbup.gif]

Fox makes a 4.8 twin that is reliable as any engine out there. I'm not sure on the cap to cap dimention is, but I'm sure its on their website.

Check this out....It looks like fun flying off a cliff into a giant pit!!! Capt,n<hr />http://www.youtube.com/watch?gl=GB&amp;h...;v=FAJUqa3wW5I

The CRRC twin is 2 Zenoah G26 CLONED cylinders on a twin case with the intake ports blocked off and a reed valve..It SHOULD run good.

one of modeller in here are running this twin with 22-10 hawk prop. 5650rpm . but very humid day. think 22-8 are better for this motor

How about a photo of the crankshaft...kinda wondering what the guts are like. Thanks Capt,n

One of the first run H9 33% Extra 330S arfs. It started out with a GT80 on ignition swinging a 24x10 bolly cf. The engine in the avatar was a 3W80xi. It was a good airframe for the single 80's because it held up from the vibration.

That's my flying field in the mountains of north carolina. The field is located on a tree farm. A reliable engine is a most, because if you miss on a deadstick, you are flying into 8' to 12' pine trees/fruit trees/etc.