. . .how easy is it to start? I'm asking this because I've got two plane engines (Enya 09 with 8x4 and Enya 19 with 9x6) which both are very, very difficult to start. The Enya 09 wouldn't start at all after 2 hours work and the 19 only just span for about 1/2 a second at most (it was kicking though). I've tried everything I can think of to make them start (re-priming, checking for flooding, mixture, tank location, glow starter, glow plug etc. etc.) and still neither will get going. The fuel is double yellow spot, which is the correct stuff to use (20% castor, 10% nitro) as reccomended by Enya UK, but neither wan't to get going. Both have good compression so I can't see what is wrong with them.
Basically, I'm wondering how easy a plane engine should be to start - how long / many flicks of the prop does it take for you to start yours?
Many thanks,

Rob:

Any of these engines can be a real bear to start until you finally learn "How to hold your mouth."

All of the engines I run, K&B, Magnum, MDS, OS, and even Norvel, start with little more than a touch of the starter.

But you have to learn how far to open the throttle, prime or not to prime, and so forth. Until you get the combination they can be a royal PTA.

Generally speaking, the methods are different for hand starting and electric. We are supposing you have already filled the tank.

Generic hand flip: At wide open throttle put your finger over the intake, flip until fuel reaches the carb, then two more flips still choking the engine. Then, still at WOT, flip it twice more. Close the throttle to 1/4 or a little less, connect the glow heat. Grab one blade of the prop in your fist and turn the engine through compression. You should feel a slight kick as you turn it through. If not disconnect the glow heat, give it a couple more flips and try again. If still no kick choke and flip some more. When you get the kick go back to the 1/4 throttle or so, it's ready to start.

Generic electric: At 1/4 throttle or a little less, connect the glow heat and while spinning the engine, block the exhaust with your finger. When you see fuel reach the carb take your finger off the exhaust, it should start immediately.

Bill.

I get the engine kicking (on the 19, then 09 doesn't seem to kick even when it started last time), but it still won't get going. I can't understand why. I can get both of my pullstart engines started within two pulls no problems, but these two Enya's are impossible.

Two of my enya .19s came with a perry carb. They don't draw fuel very well. Bills method for electric starting works quite well. My enya .19s with the aluminum carb draw fuel much better so they are better suited for flip starting. I have never flip started any of the seven I own. I use much less prop than you on the .19, perhaps 8x5-9x4. They run great and idle down well and start with a blip from the electric starter..

I'm bidding on an electric starter on Ebay at the moment, hopefully I'll win it and problem solved.

Rob:

Is an eBay starter a good idea? You can buy one new for $20 from several sources. Not the greatest, but they work.

Bill.

If you can get a real bargain... nothing's wrong with Ebay... for something like a (good) starter, bid 5 bucks, you never knoww when luck turns your way...
On the other hand... Bill's right... Ebay is not the right place to get stuff when you "need" it.... there is always good stuff on Ebay... but NEVER when you need it...lol... So don't bid too high.

Now about your engines... when you get the starter, be careful when you hit your tiny engine with that big starter... it is not very difficult to break or bend something in your engine... ask me how I know ...

Hand starting these tiny things can be a PITA... but it is not difficult... just hang in there you'll get the hang of it sooner or later.
Prime (but not too much), glow power on, test flip... see how it does... nothing yet? Try a little more prime, and give it a second try... it is just a matter of finding the right combination.

On small engines it can also help to wash the engine out with fresh fuel before trying to start it. Castor becomes a thick goo over time that will cause so much drag in the engine it will never start...

The starter is an Irvine starter - the bloke has a good rep and he's tested it. It's only at 99p at the moment, and here in the UK starters (that I've seen at least) are about £25 - about $45. If I can get one for under a fiver, I'll do that! He said the rubber cone has seen better days but my Enya 09 is a marine engine without a pull-start, and i need a starter for that anyway.
If this bid falls through, I'll probably buy a new one, but my hopes are high. I've not had any problems yet with Ebay.
Oh, you were saying about damaging the engine, how would I do that? I mean, if I don't flood it then how can it happen?

I have a couple of Sullivan starters I purchased on Ebay. Only because I expect my 23 year old one will fail one day. Both are like new and work great! I expect my sons will use them one day.

ZB

Hand starting takes a lot more trial and error than electric. If these engines are new to you, make sure that the needle value assemblies are clean if they've been sitting for a while.

Turn needle value all of the way closed. 2 to 2 1/4 turns open to start. Open full throttle, cover intake and turn until fuel is drawn through the line to the carb. Apply glow heat (make sure your amps are good for glow about 4amps) if you are using dry cells 1.2 to 1.5 volts (D-Cell in parallel should use 3 - 4). With the Carb covered, turn until you get a kick (all engines with good glow and fuel will produce a kick unless that have no compression - very warn).

One you have a kick, you should be able to flip (make sure prop is at 8 o'clock, 2 o'clock when compression stroke starts, best for hand start) a couple of times and get a start. If engine roars and stops turn needle valve 1/4 turn open. If flips produce puffs of smoke and no fire, too much fuel 1/4 turn closed.

It is very difficult to hand start an engine with marginal glow power so the glow plug and amps are very important.

P.S. I agree that you should probably be using a 8x6 or possibly a 9x4 on the .19

Rob:

Flooding IS the problem with electric starting.

Bill.

Don't forget that these engines have air bleed type carbs and are harder to prime from the tank. You must have the engine at full throttle to draw much fuel to the carb. If my .15 hasn't been run for a while I give it a little shot straight in the intake to get it going. I always hand start my bushing engines, but if the needle isn't set right I could see where you might resort to an electric starter to get it going the first time. Once dialed in correctly and you learn how much prime they like, they will surprise you at how easily they will start. Good luck.