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Airplane Decision - Down to 2
So... if you were buying a plane today, what would you buy?
An Extremeflight 87" YAK w/ DA-50 and KS pipe = great precision, 3d, and MAD POWER or A Wildhare 35% Extra w/ DA-100 = BIG BIG BIG but not quite the power or 3D capabilities. Any voters??? |
RE: Airplane Decision - Down to 2
I like the 35% airplane. I don't understand why you wouldn't think that a DA 100 wouldn't do just about anything you'd want with this plane. The right engine prop combo, and I think you would be pleasantly surprised. If you'tre really gutsy and feel that the new battery technology is as great as they say, put one Li-Po in it for power (reciever) to keep the weight down, and one for the ignition. Just my opinion. Your mileage may vary.
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RE: Airplane Decision - Down to 2
Go for the extra, like Dan said this airplane and engine combo is perfect for 3D it will do everythingI had one with the same combo loved it till a friend made me an offer I couldnt refuse.
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RE: Airplane Decision - Down to 2
I third the 35% Extra. The DA-100 will yank it around no problem. I know the Yak is supposed to be awesome but this remains to be seen.
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RE: Airplane Decision - Down to 2
Well... despite your input, I think I'm going to try the YAK. I haven't even competed yet and I think I want to get myself through at least one season of competition before I invest in a larger airplane (money is a concern since we are trying to have a kid). Plus, I REALLY like the Yak design... it spins flatter than any others out there, knife edges better, and I love the way it looks in rolling harriers. Maybe by next year EF will have their 100cc version out (that should come with carbon tubes, double truss horns, etc etc... PLUS, I already have a brand new DA-50, a KS pipe, a Fromeco power system, and 5 8611's sitting here.
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RE: Airplane Decision - Down to 2
Geez....why ask?......:D
I have a boss at work who pulls the same stunt. Asks for everyone's opinion and pretends he listens, but the decision was made before he ate lunch 3 weeks ago. |
RE: Airplane Decision - Down to 2
Well for one thing your question is invalid...there IS NO Extreem Yak 87 availible for you to buy.
Ergo, it leaves you only one choice....as others have recomended...but you already made up your mind to buy the plane that isn't even sold yet. |
RE: Airplane Decision - Down to 2
Why don't you wait a few months and see what may be out.. flying season is about over and you can get a plane at the first of the year and have it finished in no time at all.. I did see the EF yak fly at Joe Nall and it looks really nice. Quique is going to have a 85" yak out here in a few months . so I would wait to see what happens. dewey
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RE: Airplane Decision - Down to 2
Sillyness is a perfect name for you. It spins better? Knife edges better? How do you know? THE FRIGGEN THING ISN"T EVEN AVAILABLE YET! But you are right there with many other IMAC Basic pilots who want a big plane to fly BASIC. There are plenty of less expensive planes without pipes that would work excellent for Basic. I have a friend who just got schooled at an IMAC meet with his brand new CA3.2, who ever beat him must have loved that.
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RE: Airplane Decision - Down to 2
Im going Yak with the DA-50 when it gets here because it is lighter (i know it is by actual weight, but if you enlarged it to the same size as extra, still lighter) has more wing area, so it seems like it would 3D a little better, so you could have more fun when you aren't competing. Plus, look at that awesome scheme and them damn nice looks.
I will either use the KS canister, or the standard DA50 muffler Hope you make the right choice, Scott |
RE: Airplane Decision - Down to 2
I would definately recommend the Extra/DA100 combo. Wingloading calculations are good when analyzing planes of similar size but when you compare a wingloading of a 50cc class plane to a 100cc plane, equal wingloading doesn't mean the same. There's an aerodynamic term for it but I can't recall it at this time but in a nutshell, the larger the plane, the larger the wingloading can go (oz/sq inch) and the plane will still fly very light. A good example of this is a foamy that falls in at about 5-6.5 oz loading and a 40% plane that will fly EXTREMELY light at 30-33oz.
So to recap, if you can swing the $$ sillyness, then go bigger if not the Yak will be a terrific plane for you. ..........Mark |
RE: Airplane Decision - Down to 2
I think the term you are looking for is Reynolds number and you are right, bigger flies better. He did say in his second post that money is an issue but than again he said that he made up his mind to get an EF Yak because of the flight characteristics yet except for the prototype the plane does not exist so how does he know?
I think this is just another thread comparing IMAC planes and we are advising someone who doesn't have any experiance. Based on that I still stand by my recommendations in the other thread similar to this one. |
RE: Airplane Decision - Down to 2
ORIGINAL: BasinBum I think the term you are looking for is Reynolds number |
RE: Airplane Decision - Down to 2
Well... if anyone cares, I've ordered my plane. I went with neither of the above... I got a Hanger 9 Edge 540 with a ZDZ-80 after I heard some flight reports and saw they were coming out in the 21 pound range. Less money than the Extra and a lot more plane than the Yak (and a lot sooner). The Extra with the DA-100 was about $600 too much engine for my wallet and peace of mind... I wasn't thining straight with the original post. Thanks for your "comments".
Oh, and I do have experience... I understand Reynolds numbers and interia and wing-loading... they're pretty crucial to my career. Unfortunately Uncle Sam and my wife don't provide the monetary backing to have "experienced" hundreds of different GS planes. Sorry if I remind you of your boss. (So much for my mind already being made up:)) |
RE: Airplane Decision - Down to 2
Edges tend to be good planes for learning IMAC and Hangar 9 is a proven manufacturer, good choice.
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RE: Airplane Decision - Down to 2
ORIGINAL: sillyness ... I got a Hanger 9 Edge 540 with a ZDZ-80 after I heard some flight reports and saw they were coming out in the 21 pound range. Oh, and I do have experience... I understand Reynolds numbers and interia and wing-loading... The reference to the Reynolds numbers was in response to Scott's post not yours. Either way I better see Scott out here at some Imac contests next year (flying ...not observing this time):D Best of luck to both of you with your winter GS projects and welcome to the wonderful world of presicion aerobatics. ...........Mark |
RE: Airplane Decision - Down to 2
Wildhare is coming out with a 97" Extra 300 that is designed around 75-80cc engines but will hold 100-110cc engines. Check out the Wildhare forum under "doubledge bipe" and "Wildhare Extra 330LX". If you read the threads, you can find more details and a few pics of the prototype.....
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RE: Airplane Decision - Down to 2
Scott,
What, you again? You definitely give great advice on things you don't have experience with. Give it a rest.:eek: |
RE: Airplane Decision - Down to 2
ORIGINAL: Aerohead Scott, What, you again? You definitely give great advice on things you don't have experience with. Give it a rest.:eek: ??? Not sure what you mean. What did he do? |
RE: Airplane Decision - Down to 2
Edge,
I have nothing personal against Scott. I think he is a good kid and a good flyer. It's just at this stage of the game he would be alot better off listening alot more and giving less advice. He has a very limited real world experience in RC, and is all over the RC forum dispensing advice about planes that he has no real experience with. Ask him how many of the giant scale planes he is talking about in these forums does he actually own, or even have any first-hand experience with. I just feel that anyone giving advice on such a widely read forum should be speaking from experience, not a compilation of what he has read or heard other people talk about. He is certainly not the only one. There are a couple others that I know about on this site that do exactly the same, and no telling how many others I don't know about. I have been flying for about twenty-five years, but there are alot of areas of the hobby I don't have any experiece with, but when I post to these forums it is about facets of the hobby that I have experience with, and when I am giving my opinion about something here, I make sure that people know it is my opinion, not an undisputed fact. But I feel that I get much more out of the forums by reading, listening and learning than I do by trying to teach what I don't know. |
RE: Airplane Decision - Down to 2
Where's Shortman? I bet he has an opinion on that. Oh yes, over in the Comp Arf forum giving advice.
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RE: Airplane Decision - Down to 2
It sure looks like most of the purchasing decisions are strongly influenced by:
1. Color or color scheme. 2. What is a hopefully impressive decision 3. Which "hero of the hour" , is flying one. This all makes sense as these factors are used in determining the advertising for the products. Developing your skills based on purchasing a plane acquired by following the above influences - makes little sense to me. Tho it ain't impressive - what really matters for developing good flying skills is a far less expensive approach: buy the most power to weight setup with the lowest wing loading - -even if you have to ( choke) actually do some building/ rebuilding work on it. Size does not really matter all that much at his point. |
RE: Airplane Decision - Down to 2
Boy Dick did you hit the nail on the head.I have been flying RC for about 10 years.A few of those years on Giant scale,i.e. 40% aerobatic type.But in the last year my eye to hand,overall control skills have improved big time because of small fomie electrics.And the reason is simply that I fly them more.No matter what you fly getting out and doing it will make one a better pilot.
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RE: Airplane Decision - Down to 2
Yeah... I love to fly the smaller stuff too... I of course have a shock-flier, and I also have a WH Extra Special I love to fly the sequences with. In fact, I will probably do some contests with the extra... it flies very well, and will be a little better if I can get myself to stop having fun and complete the flight trimming.
I picked the Edge because I was ready to move up one more step and I want a SOLID GS 3D performer; I'm very happy with my decision. I looked at the 97" Extra Special, but I think the Edge will come out lighter based on the construction techniques. The lighter weight will give me the most ooomph out of the ZDZ-80. The Edge will also be available sooner. Plus... I've always wanted an Edge!!! |
RE: Airplane Decision - Down to 2
You will have a great time with the Edge.As you can see my nickname is edgeman as I have aeroworks 40% and 31% Edge's.Both fly great and make me look good doing Imac work.I am waiting on the Extreme 87" Yak as I flew my buddies 68" and it was awsome.It will be my 3D big plane.So enjoy the Edge.
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RE: Airplane Decision - Down to 2
Something different??? (Bigger is usually better though!!)
http://www.aero-model.com/ProductDet...?productID=428 |
RE: Airplane Decision - Down to 2
You guys may find this weird coming from a manufacturer, but when it comes down to it, its all about who burns the most fuel. Any of the airframes mentioned above will get the job done. The question becomes, are you willing to put in the time and effort to get the aircraft properly set-up and trimmed? Are you willing to put in the time to master your sequence as well as working on various combinations of rolls, snaps, rollers, etc. that you may encounter in the unknowns? The airplane will not do this for you.
I remember a few years back in the SE district, a fellow from Florida was competing in Unlimited with an old, heavy Lanier 1/3rd scale Laser, against everyone else who had the latest greatest. He was well practiced and prepared and kicked some butt. Time spent behind the sticks is what really counts. |
RE: Airplane Decision - Down to 2
Man are you right Chris,Now lets get that 87" Yak here so I can burn some fuel.I got to fly my friends 68" again this weekend and it is un-real! Snaps and tumbles were a blur on 3D rates,just made me want the 87" that much more.
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RE: Airplane Decision - Down to 2
I remember a few years back in the SE district, a fellow from Florida was competing in Unlimited with an old, heavy Lanier 1/3rd scale Laser, against everyone else who had the latest greatest. He was well practiced and prepared and kicked some butt. Time spent behind the sticks is what really counts. BTW-- I am surprised that nobody has mentioned Composite ARF (2.3M) since we are talking IMAC. |
RE: Airplane Decision - Down to 2
From what I read, the CA2.3's are coming out pretty heavy....too heavy for 3D at 20 lbs w/DA~50's
If your only considering IMAC the CA is doable, but why limit yourself? I'm waiting on the 87' Yak...and am also working on a deal for the 81'Velox |
RE: Airplane Decision - Down to 2
From what I read, the CA2.3's are coming out pretty heavy....too heavy for 3D at 20 lbs w/DA~50's |
RE: Airplane Decision - Down to 2
So would you mind posting the all up weight of yours?
ORIGINAL: AJF--2 From what I read, the CA2.3's are coming out pretty heavy....too heavy for 3D at 20 lbs w/DA~50's |
RE: Airplane Decision - Down to 2
im goin with the Yak, i like the looks more, and you (not you in particular, just in general) you can have more fun when you aren't competing
you see the vid? http://www.sirs.cc/video/ExtremeFlightRCYak.WMV the Yak has alot less wing loading then the extra, so it's a better floater, i don't know, i just like it more, appeals more to me Good luck, Scott |
RE: Airplane Decision - Down to 2
Well, I had 3 flights today and all I can say is WOW--no wait--BIG WOW!!!! As for the weight
1---Don't know 2---Don't care (pardon my flipit remark, but when something is this perfect, numbers are of little value to me--Just my opinion of course) To say that this combo has unlimited verticial is one extreme understatment. The first tank through the Brison got 6800-6900 RPM with a Mejslic 23/8--after a brief roll out I just pointed it stright up and gradually opened the throttle and it climbed as far as I could see into a clear crisp Carolina blue sky. Keep in mind that I am no "hot dog IMAC or 3D pilot" but in my years of flying RC, I enjoyed a thrill today that is very hard to express. Point it in the direction you want and go from there. I have owned a DA 50 and they are superb engines, but I think Brison gets forgotten in all of the hype. Anyway, I was able to mount 2 5945s in the rear of the plane (rudder) for CG purposes and everything else balances out from there with a standard pitts muffler-batteries are abought 4 inches behind the wing tube--- I am running 2 battery (1400 MA NiMah) packs for redundancy and also to feed the power hungry 6-5945s and JR 811 on the throttle. I am sure there are people that will say my 2.3 is too heavy, but for me, it is in a class by itself. Next time at the field, I will try to get some weight numbers! (still waiting for the "buzz" to wear off) |
RE: Airplane Decision - Down to 2
Scott, please post a video of you flying the extreme yak and your AUW. It might be fun if this plane was available for purchase and not pre-hyped to death. Talk about buzz kill. Did you do your homework tonight?:)
AJF-2, I love my 2.3 too. I get those numbers with my engine setup as well. The thing is flawless in the air. It is way way more plane than I am a pilot. It will do everything I can think of and I am not a hot pilot at all. The brison my friend has runs really good and is smooth as heck. What muffler did you go with? Joe |
RE: Airplane Decision - Down to 2
What muffler did you go with? |
RE: Airplane Decision - Down to 2
Weight may be of little value to you, but is surely a consideration for me, oh, and a few others who hang out here.
Funny thing that, not very many CA 2.3 owners are willing to post their accurate weights... ORIGINAL: AJF--2 Well, I had 3 flights today and all I can say is WOW--no wait--BIG WOW!!!! As for the weight 1---Don't know 2---Don't care (pardon my flipit remark, but when something is this perfect, numbers are of little value to me--Just my opinion of course) To say that this combo has unlimited verticial is one extreme understatment. The first tank through the Brison got 6800-6900 RPM with a Mejslic 23/8--after a brief roll out I just pointed it stright up and gradually opened the throttle and it climbed as far as I could see into a clear crisp Carolina blue sky. Keep in mind that I am no "hot dog IMAC or 3D pilot" but in my years of flying RC, I enjoyed a thrill today that is very hard to express. Point it in the direction you want and go from there. I have owned a DA 50 and they are superb engines, but I think Brison gets forgotten in all of the hype. Anyway, I was able to mount 2 5945s in the rear of the plane (rudder) for CG purposes and everything else balances out from there with a standard pitts muffler-batteries are abought 4 inches behind the wing tube--- I am running 2 battery (1400 MA NiMah) packs for redundancy and also to feed the power hungry 6-5945s and JR 811 on the throttle. I am sure there are people that will say my 2.3 is too heavy, but for me, it is in a class by itself. Next time at the field, I will try to get some weight numbers! (still waiting for the "buzz" to wear off) |
RE: Airplane Decision - Down to 2
well comp arfs site lists the weight for the 2.3 at 20 to 22 pounds i bet that most built are nearer the 22 pounds so imho i would want the bigger engine not so much a da 5o now when da gets that 75 then the 2.3 guys will be performing many upgrades to there engine and i bet the 75 wont weigh to much more than the 50 and will prob see a 2.3 that flys just like the 2.6 da100 combo
these are my slightly educated opinions no actual real world exp with the ca planes what ide like to see is ca list there wing areas and all companys list all the info on there products |
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I think it all circles back to what a person wants out of a plane-- as the thread was started with that thought. Dangerboy (here on RCU) has the 2.6 with a DA 100 and I have flown it, and the 2.3 is very, very close IMHO. Of course your opinion may vary as all things are subjective to what the pilot likes. Mike, I will be happy to post some "honest":) numbers next time I catch somebody at the field with some scales.
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RE: Airplane Decision - Down to 2
Rube Goldberg would have you weight yourself on a bathroom scale without the plane...then while holding the plane. Even with a + or - accuracy of a few ounces it would be better than a guess or not knowing whatsoever.
I have done this and then went to UPS terminal to verify...found out my bathroom scale was more accurate than I thought..measured the same..rounded to the pound of course. Knowledge is power. |
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