gruntled

I have not been able to speak to Eric on the phone yet to get clarification of the liquid/gas question. I called him a couple times and he called my house the other day when I was at the field.

I built a non-regulated propane valve to use, but have not had the chance to test it yet. As mentioned above, it started fine off powermax though.

RCISFUN

My Feedback: (44)

Look at post #26 of this thread...you will never want to use a regulated valve or powermax again.

http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_63..._2/key_/tm.htm

If my engine doesn't off the first time with this set up I know either my battery need charged or my pressure is low

p.s. Eric is selling a version of this valve without the gauge.

gruntled

Thanks.

This is the one I made the other night. No guage - that is a nice touch.

It should work fine, but I just haven't had the chance to test it.

Steve

sailing1

My Feedback: (134)

Socomon,

What no JB Weld? NO POSSIBLE WAY IT COULD WORK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


Well OK, it looks pretty darned funcional.

gruntled

Interesting story there.

I bought parts to make two of these. One for me and one for my buddy. I did the one in the picture first. To my surprise, the threads fully engaged. Perfectly tight (two wrench tight). When I did the second one, the threads would not engage. So, now I am suspicious of this one, even though it seemed to be threaded perfect. I am planning to go back and JB weld it. My buddy already had some JB Weld on-hand, so it was no big deal for him to glue the other one up.

sailing1

My Feedback: (134)

well I was really only kidding about not using the JB weld. I had to but who knows on yours. The one you have pictured looks good. I think I would plug it into your system and turn it on with the propane solinod off and then leak test it with soapy water. It may have grabbed enough threads to work. If not, you can always back off and use the JB to make a better seal.

noahb

My Feedback: (67)

What I do is take the sput off from the valve (it's a **** to remove it, but it can be done). I then take some brass tubing that fits snug into the propane line. After that, I cut me a piece about 3 inches in length. I drill out the tiny little orfice (sp?) and knock out all that stuff in the spout. I solder the tube to the neck. I then attach the tube onto the brass tube, and then she is done. Works awesome everytime.

I will post pic when I get a chance.

Pete737

Matt, The LAST thing you want is liquid to the engine. That would be very bad, If your having great results gas must be reaching the engine. The Powermax cylinder has a clunk which is why some turn the can upside down (I never did). I have my doubts if pure liquid could make it back there anyway, It would vaporize as soon as a pressure change was available, Maybe after the restrictor, solonoid or after entering the engine..

Every once in a while I would get a heavy mist through the gas line on start up. The turbine responded by growling, short very intense blue flame and spike in EGT. Not good.

Pete

carcraze

Well last night I just could not help myself as my inquiring mind wanted to know as I have a clear tube to the solenoid and I could see I had full liquid to the soleenoid. Since I do not plan on using the onboard tank I took the bottom off and it does not have a dip tube so the system with on board is gas feed to the solenoid. Mind you my solenoid is right up front and I am pretty sure once the liquid is on the turbine side of the solenoid it would be changing to gas pretty quick as I doubt the restrictor can keep it under pressure to stop the propane from going to a gas state as Pete737 is saying. My next question will be does the same gas setting I have been running still start it with the propane vertical, that could explain why I went to such a low gas % for a smooth start up as at 10% it seemed like too much propane with a slight flame during start.

My turbine never growls and starts first time every time since I dialed in the start parameters , EGT temps look good but I don't have the experiance to know what the temp ramp should be.

When I get a chance I will try to see how much % it takes feeding gas to the soleniod for the same starts.

Mat

gruntled

I just tried to start it again with the unregulated propane head with the gas at settings of 40, 60, 80 & 100%.

No start.

So far the only successful starts have been on Powermax.

George

My Feedback: (57)

Try starting with a lower setting like 5 and working your way up. The engine also will not light if you have too much propane and that is easy to do with the unregulated valve. Did you check the flow of your new valve after you built it. I had a buddy make the same valve and some solder plugged the hole and he was getting nothing.

George

gruntled

I spoke to Eric on the phone and he gave me a few things to work through, which I am in the process of doing. He did mention the possibility of the gas being too high now as well. In the process of working though the steps Eric gave me, I did discover that the unregulated valve I made was leaking despite the threads having engaged, so I just JB welded it and will give that a chance to cure. That alone may account for the problem. I also moved the restrictor closer to the turbine and blew it out.

gruntled

One more try this morning with the propane valve JB welded - no leaks. Still no joy. I will have to discuss further with Eric after the holiday. He mentioned the possibility of an internal festo fitting being damaged.

Happy thanksgiving to all.

noahb

My Feedback: (67)

well, there should not be anything wrong with the turbine as it just came back from the factory and has not been started. Hopefully it's something simple.

gruntled

If I understood him right, he said some internal festo fitting could melt from too many bad starts, but I may have misunderstood.

noahb

My Feedback: (67)

would not melt if it never ignited!

gruntled

Yeah - I probably didn't quite follow what he was saying.

noahb

My Feedback: (67)

did you turn the gas all the way down to around 10 or 15? What type glow plug are you running?

gruntled

The plug is a Mcoy #9. I think 15 was the lowest I had the gas%.

Pete737

Forgive me if this has already been said but what kind of gas/tank are you using? Do you have control of the administering?

BluFox

My Feedback: (10)

Socomon:

What I shared with you was this:

If the start gas system (all components; gas line, Festo's etc.) is compromised in any way, a pressure leak may occur. This lets the combustion chamber heat (you ran turbine two times) due to loss of gas line pressure, travel back through the gas line system toward the solenoid. The heat and fire from the combustion chamber can and in most all cases, damage the 90 degree Festo fitting which is mounted under the front cover. This could happen if the gas line is not cut square, not inserted completely etc. at each connection from turbine back to and including the solenoid. Further, if the one way check valve is accidentally removed from the line to the solenoid, or is installed in reverse, this condition can occur.

As I said, check all lines and connections. Try PowerMax again. If it starts on PowerMax, I can only assume you have a stale can of Propane. I am available for calls Saturday during the day.

Regards,
Eric

Did you perform the glow plug test as I instructed while we were on the phone ? Results ?

Last, you can send the Bee, fuel pump, ECU, glow plug harness and gas solenoid to me here in Florida. I will bench run and set up to run on propane.

gruntled

Hi Eric:

Yup - I was not quite there on my understanding of the festo thing.

I did the glow plug test and it had a nice glow to it the whole way around the element.

I moved the restrictor to the turbine side as you instructed. Does the retsrictor have a proper direction? It looked like the two ends of it are different, one end is open and the other end is, well . . . restricted. I placed the restricted looking end toward the turbine.

I will start it up on Powermax again today or tomorrow and verify that it starts properly again.

phjoker

My Feedback: (4)

I just made the same thing. I was starting my Rhino for the first time today well second time sort of. I was using the valve from dreamworks and I was 100% gas and still could not get to fuel ramp. So ran down to the hardware store and picked up some fittings. I did have to drill the orfice on the torch tip 5/64" I believe. If I did not drill it out it would not start even wide open.

Once I had the new valve on I lowered my gas back to 15% and started the processs all over again. My gas is now 35% and goes to fuel ramp no problem...If I go lower it will not go. So I am happy with that setting for now.
I also have the ceramic plug and let me tell you what a difference it makes. The Rhino lit on 10% gas with no problem at all. I can not do that with my Falcon .I am using McCoy#9 on that for now. Over the winter I will get the plug for that.

This was the first time the rhino has been started since I got it from Eric in Oct.. OMG what a beast this engine is !!!!! Cant wait to fly it now. hahha

gruntled

Pete:

Interesting you (sort of) went through the same thing - though sounds like yours is dialed in now. I think I drilled the orafice just slightly larger (next bit up). I am going to try again tomorrow with the powermax as I am having zero luck on propane.

I would like to get the ceramic plug, but so far they don't seem to be back in stock.

gruntled

SUCCESS!!

After reading Pete's post, I figured I had to try one more time. I swapped to yet another propane bottle and this time I dialed the gas all the way down to 10%. It was also pointed into a bit of a headwind. This time it lit right off.

At this point I am not sure if it is the gas bottle or taking the gas down farther that made the difference. I will experiment a bit more tommorow.

Steve