cydonia

Hello all,

I'm looking to place a order for a GP Extra 300S 40 Kit and was wondering about the good and bad that GP has to offer. I'm leaning towards then because of price and for the short wingspan as the GP has 58". This will be my first kit and will be taking my time with it and will be willing to change some of the supplied parts if it can make this good little plane better. Now I know this will raise many red flags but it will also be my first R/C plan ei've flown but I will spend allot of time on simulators and I'm the type of person who picks up things relitively fast. I need a new past time and want to get a nice plane that I can enjoy building and know that I will need to give it allot of respect if I want to keep it in the air. I've done about 60 hours of searching about different models and specs and recommended configurations but I'd love to hear what some of you have to say. I will be placing my order from http://www.greathobbies.com/frame_index.html which has the best kit prices i've found around (CAD funds). Thank guy's

Dan

BarracudaHockey

My Feedback: (11)

You really don't want to use that as a trainer. Do yourself a favor and get a NexStar or something similar.

WacoNut

I hate to be the one to tell ya but a simulator will not keep you from destroying the plane in 5 seconds, Go ahead and build the plane but by all means get a trainer. Shortcuts always cost you in the long run. I would suggest getting at least 50 flights under your belt on a trainer before trying to fly the extra, just my .02 worth.
Good Luck!!
Anthony

cydonia

Oh God, I know you guy's are sooo right, but it's so hard not to get that beautifull plane and give it a try, mabey i'll be that 1% who get's to pull it off. I'll consider your advice and will try to fight my temptations. I'm sure you guy's know what your talking about. And I take it that planes like the Nexstar can still be fun. I'll try to find some video's on that one. Thanks for the advice

/D

ckangaroo70

My Feedback: (51)

The .40 size Great Planes Extra 300 is a great kit, and a great Plane. Mine flies great, and was a fun Plane to build. If you are looking for a neat Plane to build then I highly recommend it. However, it is by no means a beginner Plane and all the Sim time in the world won't prevent you from crashing this Plane if this is to be your first. If you are just wanting a Model to hang from your Garage and look good, then I would say go for it. If you are wanting to fly it, I sincerely suggest you start with a Trainer or an Ugly Stick style Plane. Here is a photo of my GP 300s .40. I built it from a kit in the fall of 2004, and have about 25 flights on it. It flies great, but I would consider it a good 3rd or 4th Plane after you master a Trainer, and one or two good stable low wingers like a 4 star, or a Super Sportster. Good Luck!

cydonia

That is a nice 300S indeed. I'm looking for something to fly as well definitly a kit build. I havn't found anyone saying the opposite of what your saying just thought i'd get some human advice instead or relying on the magazine's advice.. Things are clear now i'd be over my head.. The only problem is so far all the trainers are how can I say Not Nice. I don't really feel like having rubber bands holding my wings together.. Anyone know of a clean line trainer out there i've done the big names and seems like low model=low quality.

ckangaroo70

My Feedback: (51)

How about building a nice .40 size Piper Cub?

cydonia

Well it's a good suggestion there is the Piper J-3 Cub from Herr that still looks very nice and has that short wingspan of 48". I don't know how you guy's travel thoses big planes, guess it's a trick i'll learn on the way. See when I was younger I had built a cesna with my friend and his dad it's stayed with me until now i'm 27 and just can't stop thinking this is one hell of a cool hobby to take up. Thanks for the good coaching Ray, So did Piper can fly as a first plane if I put allot of attention in it.

RCKen

My Feedback: (9)

Been flying for 9 years now, and have flown a 40 size Cub and can tell you that it definately NOT a trainer. Just because it's a high wing doesn't mean a trainer. Cydonia, it's not 1% that can get away with training on an extra but more like .0001% that can do it. There are reasons why a trainer has rubber bands on the wing, it's to try and make it a little more forgiving for a beginning flyer. I would recommend that you buy yourself an RTF trainer so you can start learning, but there isn't any reason why you can't start building an Extra now. But you gotta walk before you can run.

FlyingPilgrim

My Feedback: (26)

Your first plane should indeed be a trainer. Consider it disposable, as it serves one purpose: to teach you how to fly. GP Extra 300s is a beautiful plane, with no bad habits, but not to learn with as a new pilot. Great 3rd plane after trainer, then low wing taildragger like a 4*, Tiger, or even a Super Sportster. Build your extra, but hang it up to look at until you hone your skills.

Pilgrim

cydonia

Guy's you must have your faire share of giving advice to young eager's and I really appreciate your advice. So Ken your saying that learning with a Piper cub is not something I should be doing. It's definitly a nice plan and seems ready to serve even the experienced pilot but Herr describes it as a good trainning plane also.

Scar

My Feedback: (3)

It's refreshing to see you're listening to the advice. Good for you!

That Extra is, as said earlier, a fine plane. The neat thing about the extra (besides the looks) is that it's unstable. That's good - if you want it to snaproll, or change attitude in the wink of an eye. Not so good when you're not intimately familiar with the procedure to recover from that snaproll or Hi-Gee maneuver.

The reason everyone is recommending that trainer is because it will fly in a stable fashion, giving you time to decide what to do next. The good trainers also have some aerobatic capability.

I actually recommend that my students get a good trainer, like the LT-40, or Solo Sport, or Hobbico's trainers, or one of the others, and stick with it for a season or two, really wring it out. There's nothing wrong with building that Extra while you're learning. I like it when a student's plane lasts long beyond the training and solo efforts.

I hope your building and training efforts are pleasant experiences.
Dave Olson

cydonia

Well this site sure gave a wack on my decision making, probably better to have it now then when the Extra meets the dirt. Any last words on the Herr Piper J-3 Cub This may well be the trainer i'll have to make or break. See I need the short wing span because I have a Civic to travel my plane once it's done probably mid-late summer. I'll give myself another week before I order to see what else might come up. All great suggestions today. thanks allot.

RCKen

My Feedback: (9)

Cydonia,
No, a Cub is not a good plane to use to learn to fly. They may say that it's easy to fly, but that doesn't mean that it makes a good trainer. You can get one if want, and you can justify it by saying you need to it to fit in your car but it still doesn't change the fact that it's not a good trainer. Most all of the trainers out there today can be disassembled and transported in just about any vehicle.

I'm an instructor at our field and I have seen more than my share of the planes that people bring out to "learn" to fly on. If you came to me with the Cub I would politely tell you that you really need to get a real "trainer" to learn to fly. Trying to learn on other planes usually results in students getting frustrated and quitting the hobby. I've seen this happen too.

Hope this helps

cydonia

Yes Ken it does, can't deny what your saying since your a instructor and all. I guess i'll start my research again and pay more attention to thoses trainers as it seems there is no way around this learning curve. I'm out for today, reading your other post seems your going flying so have fun out there and thanks again. Anyone else willing to give suggestions on a good Trainer KIT will be greatly appreciated. I'm looking to build what i'll be flying seems more right this way so no ARF just yet.

prossa

Build the Extra but Fly a Trainer.

THE CUB IS NOT A TRAINER.

Nextar is a good trainer. Avistar will also work.

Super Sportster or 4*40 is are good 2nd planes.

After them, then you can go fly the extra. If you fly it sooner, before you are ready, be prepared to invest in a new extra kit cause you'll be building from sticks again.

The Cub is squirly on take-off and requires the use of rudder in turns which is something you don't need in a first plane right away. Building a cub for a trainer is a waste of time because that one will end up in the dirt.

I learned on a trainer, flew the simulator a lot, then graduated to a supersportster, then Edge 540, next was a Fokker DVII, and am working on a P51 and a Superskybolt. I've done all this in a year but I can fly all the time because I live in Arizona. The Edge was a big step up from the Supersportster and still makes me pay a great deal of attention in the air because it is snappy and very, very fast.

Take your time, don't rush, and you'll enjoy the hobby so much more!!!

Fly safely,
Prossa

av8r1

If you're looking for something more than a basic trainer to fly immediately while you're building your Extra, I would highly recommend the Hobbico Avistar Select RTF advanced trainer. I too want an Extra and will probably have one soon but I don't think I'll ever get bored with the Avistar. I've put over 170 flights on it in less than 11 months. I'm afraid it will be hard to find a better flying plane, but that won't stop me from trying.

The Avistar can fly slow and stable for a beginner, but can also be pretty fast and quite aerobatic too. It flew very well with the stock OS .40LA that came with it but I have since replaced that with an OS .46LA for a bit more power. It's not quite as big as some other trainers either with a wingspan about the same as the GP Extra 300S 40.

I was not exactly a beginner when I got the Avistar, having flown small electrics in my backyard before that, so I don't have a real beginner's perspective of it, but I believe it is a very good advanced trainer.

Of course, your second plane should be a low wing trainer as others recommend, but after you become proficient with the Avistar, you can make that decision better.

But don't take my word for it, do a search here. That's what convinced me to get one.

Pilot Chad

My Feedback: (4)

If i were you, I would go with the LT-25, It will be good for you, because it is a taildragger, and pretty much all planes are from the second on out dpending on what route you go. I have soloed, and would be VERY scared to fly an extra, I think you should go to your field and ask to fly a trainer, you would be amazed out how hard it is.

ckangaroo70

My Feedback: (51)

I agree about the Cub not being the best choice as a Trainer. It was just the next best thing that came to mind if someone was absolutely deadset on not buying a Trainer. I have the 1/4 Scale Sig Cub that I am still building, but I have flown a .40 size, and they Fly very easy, but the ground handling really takes some skill. Ugly sticks also fly very well, but they are a go where you point them kind of Plane, and not nearly as forgiving as a Trainer. I have owned several Trainers like the Nexstar, Pt-20 and Pt-40, Sig LT-40, Alpha 40, Tower Trainer 40, and the old Great Planes Trainer 40. Any of these would serve the purpose of learning. Personally I do feel that my Nexstar RTF is a little bit of overkill for what is basically needed for a Trainer. I just bought it for the novelty of it, and it sees very little flight time. My advice would be to go cheap, so your investment is smaller, and you will have extra funds to use to towards your next project! You can get an Alpha RTF 40 for around $280, and the Tower .40 combo for about the same. My only advise on the Tower Combo is to build your own combo, and get a different engine than the Tower Hobbies Engine that comes in that Combo. I would substitute it for a more reliable O.S or Thunder Tiger. If it is a kit you want, then I would highly recommend the Sig LT 40. I built the Kit just because I actually liked the looks of the Plane, and not because I needed another Trainer. This Kit builds very easy, and with its extra large size it easy to see, and handles like a dream. IMO STAY AWAY FROM ANYTHING FROM VMAR( I own 2) if you are going to search for a trainer. Basically just about any other manufacturers Trainer besides Vmar will serve its purpose for you. Below I have included a few pictures from my collection of Trainer Planes. One is the Tower Trainer .40. One is the Sig Lt-40. One is the Great Planes Trainer .40. One is the Hobbico Nexstar. In my next post I will post some photos of Planes from my collection that make good second Planes after a Trainer has been mastered.

ckangaroo70

My Feedback: (51)

These next Photos are Planes that I own that would make good second Planes. One photo is my Great Planes Super Sportster MKII .40 ARF, and one Photo contains my Vmar Aero Subaru, and Vmar Stick .60 which both make good second Planes, but just not from this particular Manufacturer. The Great Planes or Hangar 9 sticks would be better, and a World Models T-34 would be a good alternative to the Aero Subaru. The other photo is my Great Planes Super Sportster 120 built from kit which has been discontinued. A Sig 4 star would also make a good second Plane from all that I have seen and read, but I have never personally flown a four star.

ckangaroo70

My Feedback: (51)

These next photos from my Plane collection are Planes that I believe would make acceptable 3rd Planes after a Trainer has been mastered, and a good amount of time has been spent flying a good low wing like pictured in the above post. One photo is my Great Planes Extra 300 .40 Kit, and the other is my Phoenix Models Sukhoi .46 ARF.

WMB

My Feedback: (1)

I second the LT-25 for a first, it has the smaller wing and may fit in your car. I started on a Sig Senior and moved on to a 4*40. First flight on the 4*40 had my knees knockong bad. It was so fast compared to the Senior. I have had many bad landings since, but it is still flying. Now it seems a little slow. If you pull the throttle back it does fly fairly slow. Build the Extra and fly a trainer. Have fun, Mike

ckangaroo70

My Feedback: (51)

These next Photos from my collection of Planes are good 3rd or 4th Planes when you are feeling pretty good about your flying abilities. One of the Planes pictured is my VectorFlight Edge 540, and the other is my Great Planes Cap 232 built from kit. Both these Planes are pretty touchy and require some experience. There are also other Planes that I do not own like the Funtana, or UCANDO that would be suitable at this stage if you really want to get wild!

ckangaroo70

My Feedback: (51)

I would never encourage trying to learn without an instructor, but if you want to learn some of the concepts of flight that even a Sim can not really teach you fully then might I suggest something like a GWS Pico Tiger Moth Electric. Find you some tall grass and a calm day, and you will learn to fly. It may not impress you as much as a big gas Plane, but as stated earlier in this post, "you have to learn how to walk before you can run". You would have to try fairly hard to destroy this Plane if you were flying on a calm day over very tall grass. If you have an instructor willing to teach you then a Gas Trainer would be ideal, but always be prepared to potentially lose a Plane even while learning with an instructor. Your odds are very good with a good instructor, but even the best lose a Plane every now and again.

kiswa

My Feedback: (4)

I'd like to recommend a trainer for you. I think this plane looks great, so it might be what you want. It's also huge, which makes it very easy to see, and it's a kit so you can get some practice building.

Take a look here: http://www.mosquitobiteplanes.com/trex.html

They're also based in Canada, so you'd be able to get it easily I'd think (no border crossing postage crud).