dansdeals3489

I just checked out the Tom Pierce website, he sure knows what he is talking about! He makes it sound so easy!

Gray Beard

My Feedback: (-1)

It's A 65 inch Texas Twins kit, Extra 260 and it was given to me by A friend. I was the fourth owner of the kit and the wings had been started at some point. It took longer to make the corrections on the wings and clean them up then it did to frame up the rest of the plane. I used the SK .91 in it and that was about A perfect match unless you wanted to 3-D. I looked but couldn't get any information on Texas Twins or find any more of there kits. Nice plane, great kit, good fiberglass parts and the foam cutting was perfect. I would build another one if I could find A kit!!!

bigtim

My Feedback: (13)

using the water based poly is really easy,I used a new 2" paintbrush to apply the poly on the .56oz fiberglass the low odor and water clean up is a major bonus.

the worst part was applying the sealer, Deft satin brushing laquer, it stinks and should be done out doors or with a respirator, fortunitely its a small job to seal the wood and then the rest is low odor from there .

my choice for poly is Varathane Diamond finish,satin sheen it drys fast and can be recoated in aprox.1hour so the job can get done relatively quickly,I like the diamond because it drys very hard and sands easy, it powders with no balling up like many water based products can do.

thanks mesaflyer for the props,really alot of my building has come from years of modeling from when I was a youngster,but before 5years ago I had never glassed a model before,after having read T.Pierces thread I realized he was using many products that I have used for years being a painting contractor in Ca. helps with product knowledge.

something I will be trying on a sample of balsa sheeting is using the diamond finish directly on the sheeting to see if there is any of the swelling or warping,since its a fairly quick drying product I am not sure if it would induce the kind of warping associated with having water come in contact with the thin balsa if it doesn't then I may just use it on my next building project without the sealer.
if there is a problem because of the moisture, then I will just suffer through the sealing process it is a small part of the job.

at this point in my building, I have gone to using almost all water based paints/products,the main exeption would be CA glue, since my primary focus is WWII planes for finishing I have been using www.warbirdcolors.com paints, the low odor,nitro proof to 15%, and ease of use, is a huge bonus for me,since I am constantly around nasty stuff for work it just makes sense to reduce my exposure to additional toxics,mainly thinners,water clean up is a big deal since my shop is downstairs in my house, my wife appreciates the less smelly the better

dale691

Can you use normal dope to seal the balsa before glassing?

dhal22

probably but a sanding sealer works fine. i have used water and oild based sealers.

david

dale691

What is a sanding sealer? do you get it from fiber glass suppliers?

NM2K

My Feedback: (14)

The old formula for modeling sanding sealer was clear dope with talcum powder in it. I don't know what passes for sanding sealer today, but I do know that the old formula works well.

I've even thought about making up my own modern sanding sealer using clear water based poly with talcum powder. Should work okay. However, one of the reasons for using fiberglass and binder is to not have to fill the grain with heavy talcom powder.

I haven't had a problem with water based polyurethane causing the wood to warp, but I habitually spread on very, very thin coats. This is an old habit left over from the days when a single 2 oz. bottle of dope would have to fuel proof an entire control line profile model. Very, very, very thin coats. The habit is still with me today and it tends to work out very well for me.


Ed Cregger

dale691

Also Polycrylic is something I have never heard of. Is it a specialty thing from fiberglass suppliers?

NM2K

My Feedback: (14)

I "think" it is a brand name kind of thing used by MinWax? Not sure. Memory is bad.


Ed Cregger

Deadeye

Polycrylic is made by minwax. It comes in a blue can, or you can get it in spray as well. They have satin, gloss, and semi gloss, and I have used them all with no real difference.

bigtim

My Feedback: (13)

its taken from 2 words (poly) as in polyurathane resin,and (crilic ) from acrilic,acrilic resin is typically a component in water based polyurathane,Minwax and ,varathane are major brands Varathane is actually a division of Rust-O-leum

Varathane, http://www.rustoleum.com/product.asp...t_id=619&SBL=5

minwax, http://www.minwax.com/products/water...tive_finishes/

like I posted earlier I prefer the Varathane,since it sands well and I have used it for years,and is advertised to be alcohol resistant,which is a bonus since our glow fuel is alcohol based, but its really a personal choice.

hope the information clears up any confusion

dale691

Thanks for your help, I have been to my local fibreglass shop and all they have is epoxy resin, and the paint shop has a water based polyurathane.

Which one do I go for?

Also the cloth that im looking at using is 85gram cloth, is this right?

It probably seems like i'm making this harder than it needs to be! But the brand names that you guys are using arn't sold in Australia.

Thanks for you continued help

bigtim

My Feedback: (13)

the epoxy resin usually bought through through a fiberglass shop is for boats and surfboards this isn't what you need for model planes it's way too viscous(thick)for model planes it will turn your plane into a brick.
for airplanes you need to use a model specific product like Z-poxy if you chose that method of resin.

if you want to go with the WB poly then the local paint store is the place to get it.

as for the cloth, 85gram is way too heavy thats almost 3 ounces ,the weight you need is 16-21 gram or so, its like silk and is really light,you might have to special order some from your Local Hobby Shop or on line http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...?&I=LXL491&P=0 here is a example of what you want your LHS might have some or can get it fairly easy.

fiberglass weight is determined by the weight per sq.yrd/meter so, .56oz=16g, .75oz=21g per foot. 1ft=30.5cm sq.

dale691

The 85g cloth that I looked at was like silk, I don't know what is the measurement but i'd say it is per sq meter, anyway it looked like silk and was very light.

Thanks for your help Tim.

I think I'll go with the WB poly. how do you make it fuel proof?

I have used a product that they call finishing resin down here, but it was an overnight drying time.

One last question, well for now anyway can you explain the sanding sealer that was used in the Tom Price article, I have asked around about that also and people have heard of it but no one seems to have it. Is there something else I can use.

dasintex

My Feedback: (10)

Where is a good online site for 1/2oz Fiberglass; or other very light material suitable for glassing using WBPU like Minwax Poly; I saw a link a few posts ago for some 3/4 oz from Tower Hobbies, I am interested in conserving as much weight as possible.

mesaflyer

dasintex,
This is were I got my last fiberglass. http://thayercraft.com/Style%20106.htm
I also have some from Tower, but it has a lot of what I would call "loose strings" around the edges, and seems to be kinda separating. Not all of it, just parts. The thayercraft was much easier for me to work with. It cuts cleaner, and lays out better, at least for me. I went with the heavier cloth.

dasintex

My Feedback: (10)

Presents another question; 1/2 or 3/4 oz; pros and cons; I'm looking for weight conservation because I did a fair bit of Landing Gear and shear web Reinforcing on the RTC/ARF GS TF P-51, and that added some unplanned weight.

mesaflyer

Well, from what I have read, the difference in 1/2 to 3/4 is very small. And I didn't want to sacrifice strength for the nominal weight savings. When I did my Sea Fury (60 size airplane), I used two coats of sanding sealer, the .73 oz fiberglass, and 6 coats of poly. This added 5oz of weight to the wing, and 4oz to the fuselage. Maybe that is a lot, but didn't seem like it to me. This is a link to my off-and-on build thread. http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_72..._3/key_/tm.htm
Got get back to it soon.

bigtim

My Feedback: (13)

as long as the fiberglass is the silky type then its the one to use wheather its the .56oz or the .75oz the weight difference is minor.
I checked and I was wrong on the weight, it is by the yard, I editied my last post to reflect that for any one reading this thread.

the sanding sealer tom pierce uses is a product called DEFT its hard to find here in Ca. any more because its a laquer based product and our regulations are getting tighter.

what I did was to substitute it with there DEFT satin finish material its about the same as SS, sanding sealer, seals and raises any surface grain,when dry it sands to a nice smooth surface,so when you apply the top finish coats they have a nice glassy finish, its used in furnature finishing primarally.

the DEFT product is a brushing laquer, here is some information on it http://www.deftfinishes.com/trade/OurProducts/index.cfm the web page has there product listings there might be a alternative material in OZ under another name, it is another paint product you should be able to get at your local paint store.

dale691

Thanks again Tim, I understand the process now and think I can find the WBpoly, I'll go in search of the sealer see what I come up with. I assume that normal dope is not enough to seal the balsa?

Sorry to go on about this but I don't want to get it wrong when it comes time to do the job!

Cheers

bigtim

My Feedback: (13)

if you have regular Dope then it should work as a sanding sealer, the DEFT product smells about as bad as regular model airplane Dope does for sure,the main pourpose of the sealer is to protect the wood from exess moisture from the WB polyurethane.
as some have said it may not even be necessary, but I thought I would follow a tried and tested method, its paid off so far, good luck

mesaflyer

bigtim,
I used a Zinsser product called Bulls Eye Seal Coat universal wood sealer I bought from Home Depot. Worked real good. Used a natural bristle brush and cleans up with denatured alcohol. It's a wax free shellac. Worked good for me.

bigtim

My Feedback: (13)

I use Zinsser products all the time its great for stain killing before painting walls as well,and its quick dry,I havent thought of using it for a sanding/balsa sealer though, got to give it a try.