Temps

i have a caliber 30 and when in hover sometimes begins to shake violently so i have to bring it back down then itll be ok for a while then start again ive never crashed it or damaged it balanced the blades and tracked but still it does it but only in hover someone told me it might be the training gear ocialating at certain revs ??? could this be it and how do i fix it

WOS

My Feedback: (62)

My Caliber did the same thing. Shook like a dog out of water. I used heavier training gear and it stopped. Someone told me that the head speed should also be around 1800 rpm which I still have to check. Not that I am glad to see it, but am glad to see someone else having the same problem and it's not just in my heli like I did something wrong. Next time out the trainers are going away and will see if it all goes away completely

Temps

think ill try the same

Vortexgen

check the flybar paddles, sometimes thay come form kyosho preassembled (ARF version) slightly out of allignment/Track angle. this will cause a wobble to creep in.

normally some kind of resonance issue if you have training gear though.

headspeed has also been a factor as mentioned. mine is set/governed at 1450 rpm (low setting) and seems to be a good headspeed.

aerodynamic18

i had exactly the same problem too. the reason was that the cooling fan was destroyed even though the bolt was still fully screwed in(i got rid of the 2 screws that hold it on) and the only reason that this was noticed was because we droped the engne out to see if it was the problem. the only way that this could have happened was if something fell in which we didnt notice or see the fins falling out of the canopy . hope this helps :stupid:

SalsettiA

I had also the same problem with my big homemade training gears. I increase the RPM and reset the valve needle. It helped a little, but I was still loosing RPM from time to time at very low altitude. I've shorten my training gears lately and I don't feel those ennoying shakings anymore. You souldn't have any "broken" pieces.
If you can master you heli with those shackings, I assure you, that you're able to hover like (well,... almost like) a pro when you're gonna shorten your training gears, if you can, or take them off. I think, you shouldn't worry about that and maybe fly a little higher.

Good luck

AeroDave

Mine started to shake after I quit using the training gear and started flying in idle up. It only happens if my head speed is a bit low and then its not bad, just noticable. I'm going to experiment with my throttle/pitch curves and try to tune it out. Other pilots told me certain helis will shake a bit as they pass trough certain rpms. I guess mine never reached its "shaking point" until i got the head speed up a bit in idle up mode.

Temps

ah ha shortend training gear problem solved

Temps

please delete problem solved thanks

mvigod

no need to delete as this may help others. I too saw this in my Caliber 30 btw...I have to remove the training gear and see what happens. If that doesn't fix we will up the head speed.

randy41

I had the same problem with the roto pod training gear.
I took it to a friend and he flew it and nailed on the head.
We took those high dollar training gear of and put his
homemade 5 dollar set on and it was better. Still had a little
wobble. So he adjusted the pitch and rotor speed and
it now is as smooth as silk.

ANY BODY WANT TO BUY THE ROTO POD TRAINING GEAR.

WOS

My Feedback: (62)

It seams like myself, everyone else has had similar problems, I guess the Caliber does not like to be put in diapers!!!! it wants to compete with it's bigger brother the Caliber 60! SO OFF WITH THE DIAPERS I SAY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

randy41

I agree with you WOS.
I dont use training gear no more. Glad i done
away with my diapers.

AeroDave

Once I got the head speed up the shakes went away for good.

Furyflyer2

My Feedback: (117)

It may be a dampener problem, the rubber dampeners maybe a little to soft. Will see as RCadmin continues with the review and we get some flying time out of it.

Evillord

I had the very same problem here in Corpus Christi, Two friends, Mark and Ron from Ricks made a quick adjustment of the head speed and in less than 20 secs the Caliber was like silk! Ron told me most shakes are due to head speed problems as most heli's are way to slow.....something to think about.

BTW...I love my Calli!!!!!!!!!

AeroDave

Me too!!!!!!!!!!
the only time it shakes now is when I do a descent in normal mode and let the head speed get too low.

patriot21

take the training gear off gentlemen and the shakes magically disappear!!!

Confuzed

Hi Quattro27,

I have the same problem with the shakes on my Shuttle Plus. Looking at the pics of your heli I think we have the same training gear - is that the QuickUK gear on your model?

How did you shorten it?

Temps

to shorten take off two legs cut off about 1/2 inch of each put them back on opposite each over

satnaam

My Feedback: (5)

have a look at this from runryder.com. I did it and the wobbles are history. this works greata and the heli is very very smooth and no wobbles at all even durrig spool ups.

satnaam


CK_
Status: Heliman

Registered: Nov 2002
Location: West Palm Beach, FL
Posts: 56 Yes, no more wobbles even down to 1200 rpm! You just have to flip a few parts around to change the delta3 angle. Here's how to do it:






Flip the washout, grips, flybar control arms, and the bell mixing arms. If you use the stock washout you need to remove the pins and mount them the other way. I used a Freya washout slider from my spares box. The Freya washout is better because it has a brass bushing in the slider. If you use the Freya washout, remove the washer on the pivot bolt and replace with an M3 plain nut for a spacer to retain proper phasing to the swashplate. You will also have to use longer screws. The balls on the bell mixer must be swapped to the other side of the arm. Keep the bell mixer drooping down but flip them the other way on the flybar. If you want to know how this works read the post "Delta" in the main discussion but be prepared for some heavy reading and some head scratching. Thanks to Wayne Mann for the idea.

CK

01-03-2003 05:47 PM PROFILE PM EMAIL MY POSTS BUDDY ONLINE REPORT



Hotwings
Status: Veteran

Registered: Feb 2002
Location: s/w Florida, Port Charlotte
Posts: 528 wow
chris, next problem i have i'm giving to you. c-ya tomorrow at m.p. Ron

Hotwings' Gallery
I'm Very Proud to be one of the "Good Guys"

01-03-2003 06:15 PM PROFILE PM EMAIL MY POSTS BUDDY ONLINE GALLERY REPORT



Michael_Fath
Status: Senior Heliman

Registered: Dec 2001
Location: Chugiak, AK
Posts: 198 I just finished my test flight with the C30 flipped head. No more wobbles. Now, this should turn out to be a nice little heli. Thank you Wayne for the idea. Thank you CK for the picture.

Mike

01-03-2003 07:02 PM PROFILE PM EMAIL MY POSTS BUDDY ONLINE REPORT



d-n-jensen
Status: Veteran

Registered: Jul 2001
Location: Bellevue WA
Posts: 582 How did this affect the cyclic response and what is your total avalible pitch range?

Always beating the air into submission

01-03-2003 11:43 PM PROFILE PM EMAIL MY POSTS BUDDY ONLINE GALLERY REPORT



satnaam
Status: Senior Heliman

Registered: Aug 2002
Location: ONTARIO
Posts: 139 CK
can you tell me the part number for the washout unit from freya heli?? also tell me what do I need to do to make this change.
please

satnaam

01-04-2003 05:16 PM PROFILE PM EMAIL MY POSTS BUDDY ONLINE REPORT EDIT



Michael_Fath
Status: Senior Heliman

Registered: Dec 2001
Location: Chugiak, AK
Posts: 198 You don't need the Freya parts. You can modify the stock Caliber Washout Base. Here are Wayne Mann's comments on modifying the C30 head:

"If any of you guys that own Caliber 30s and want to flip the blade grips over, there are several things to keep in mind. The bell mixers that pivot on the flybar have an extra hole on the other side of the flybar. Do not try an use that hole. I do not understand why Kyosho extended the bell mixer to the other side of the flybar. You can not use that hole as it will reverse the cyclic inputs to the rotorblades. The swashplate will be controling the flybar paddles in the right direction, but the blades will be receiving backwards inputs. The metal bell mixers on the Caliber 90 are the same way.

In one of the RC Technique issues they showed a picture of a Caliber 30 at the flying field in a test of the machine. They had a ball on each side of the flybar on the bell mixer in the photo. I don't know if they tried to fly the machine this way, but needless to say they would not have had many positive things to say about the flight performance with the controls fighting one another. I know someone who tried to fly the Caliber 90 like this. He called me and said this thing hovers like sh*t. Finally we figured out what was going on.

Also the washout arm block has to be flipped over so that the bolts that hold the washout arms to the block are on the opposite side. The washout pins have to be pulled out, the hole drilled completely through the block with a drill bit just a hair smaller than the hole that the pins are in. This will allow you to press the pins through the block and out the other side so that you can flip the block. This is to provide clearance for the pushrod that goes from the swashplate to the bell mixer once the blade grips are flipped over.

The bell mixers have to be pulled off the flybar, rotated around so that the drooped end of the mixer is now pointing away from the other side of the flybar and the drooped end of the mixer is still pointing down.

The flybar control arms need to be flipped around so that they are controling the trailing edge of the paddles also. This is a push-pull arrangement do it really doesn't make any difference which side you are controling.

The swashplate will be going down for positive pitch with this arrangement.

You will basically have to go back through the initial set up procedures in order to get the pitches right. The pushrods going from the bell mixers to the pitch arm ball will have to be shortened also."

Look at CKs picture to understand how the Bell Mixers should look and you're good to go.

I thought the cyclic on the C30 was a bit slow with the stock head. With the flipped head, I am using the inner hole on the bell mixer to increase swash input (CKs picture shows the outer hole). I also have KSJ paddles (using the front hole). I have flown enough to know that the wobbles are gone. I have not done extensive flight tests, but the cyclics appear plenty reactive. To say that it's brisk here in AK would be an understatement. I don't think my neighbors would be thrilled if I started doing Kaoses (to test the cyclic rate) in my driveway while standing in my garage to keep warm.<G>

HTH,
Mike

01-04-2003 06:26 PM PROFILE PM EMAIL MY POSTS BUDDY ONLINE REPORT



CK_
Status: Heliman

Registered: Nov 2002
Location: West Palm Beach, FL
Posts: 56 satnaam,

The part number for the Freya washout is 0414-112. If you know anyone who flys a Freya, odds are they have a stock plastic one in their spare parts bin. The early Freyas had a problem with the plastic washout slipping on the mast so most people upgraded to the metal one. Now the Freya mast is knurled and the plastic washout doesn't slip. To make the change just study the photo and assemble the head that way. If you're using the Freya washout don't forget to remove the washer and replace with an M3 nut for a spacer between the wahout arm and the washout slider.

d-n-jensen,

The collective pitch range seems unaffected. I have the same +10 to -9 I had before. As for the cyclic response, I can't make an accurate judgement because when I did the head flip I also switched paddles from the stock ones to the hollow hirobo ones. I only got to fly the new head in 20-25 knot winds for half a tank. Then I noticed my clutch was acting up so I decided to call it a day. I think I'll start a new thread for my clutch problem.

I wanted to see how low the rpm could go down before it started to wobble. I must have had the headspeed down to about 1200 rpm in those strong winds and no hint of a wobble. Because of my clutch problems I probably only have about 10 min flight time on the flipped head however, the change in performance was so dramatic that I posted the mod here after only one flight. I'd like to hear from anyone with more flight time on the head.

CK

01-04-2003 11:13 PM PROFILE PM EMAIL MY POSTS BUDDY ONLINE REPORT



d-n-jensen
Status: Veteran

Registered: Jul 2001
Location: Bellevue WA
Posts: 582 I have almost 21 deg of total pitch measured on the bench and I set it up for -9.5 to + 11. I use -9 to +9 for flying and the +11 for auto's. I have set the pitch in the swashplate setting at 75 with the ail and elev set to 58. I get no binding with these settings.

Always beating the air into submission

01-05-2003 02:57 AM PROFILE PM EMAIL MY POSTS BUDDY ONLINE GALLERY REPORT

swmoheli

I have found that if you run a low head speed and too much pitch you can a real wild head wobble, if your dampers are sorft it looks like the coolest rollercoaster ever, but will scare the crap out of you if you're not expecting it.

As far as any shaking with training gear, the two blades above the gear whacking the air above down on to them will often cause a harmonic vibration in the gear, much like a tuning fork, this resonates through the heli's gear, chassis, and to the head and the whole thing shakes like mad during transitions through certain RPMs. The Best solution for this is, learn to hover quickly and toss the diaper, plus you will develop a better confidence when you see how easy it is to hover without the toothpicks, you'll wonder why you ever put them on.