Spiro

Hello again,

Now that I have a few bucks in my pocket I have been turning my eye towards a clean electric setup. A friend of mine has just purchased a used brushless rig with a mega 16/15/3 and a CC35 controller. He doesn’t have much in the way of batteries now, so we are still trying to decide where to go there. As far as my LMH goes, if I were to consider an electric setup I thought I might ask to see what people were recommending these days as far as motor, controller, and battery choice.

What is your recommendation for brushless running gear on the LMH?

Thanks in advance,
Spiro

oosel

My Feedback: (4)

I run a hacker but I hear the mega setup is very good to. honestly when i was ordering my brushless setup i had called to order the mega motor but at the time no one had it in stock. So I got the hacker. I run the stock gears and 4/4 blade grips. for batteries i use 7 cell 2400 nicd. I have some 3000 nimh but they dont have quite the punch of a nicd, If im messin around and come in to fast towards the ground a nicd has the instant power to keep me from smacking the ground lol. A nimh has a little less punch and you can notice it, but for just flying around on a day thats not to windy they are great. My controller is a jeti master 40-3p with a hacker C40 12Tmotor.

gmaster

no second guessing... i did tons of research back this time last year.. and in jan 2003 i started buying parts for my corona.. hands down .. Hacker C40 12S Motor and Hacker Master Heli ESC.. not one single glitch or problem since I built my corona back in early Feb. the Mega combos are also good for the money..

batteries.. there are a lot of different ways to go.. NiCds.. NiMHs.. LiPo's... I went with good ole NiCds.. CP-2400SCR Sanyo SubC 7-cell packs.. i get easily 10mins of hovering with no problem straight off the charger.. i have 6 packs and i cycle thru them basically can stay hovering as long as i want works great.. I got all my packs pre-built with the cells i wanted from www.batterystation.com, they charge $5 to build the packs for you in whatever configuration you want and they add Dean's ultra connectors on there for free.. i even asked for a few extras and the guy threw them in.. great people.. turn around time was less then 5 days.. ordered monday.. had my packs friday..

Mini Boy

Hi Spiro!

Gmaster has it correct ... I too did a great deal of research, probably 150 hours or so last January / February. I don't think I've hears of anyone who has used the Hacker setup to have anything but good reports. I would guess that the Mega, or another brand of brushless motor that isn't as pricey as the Hacker could also produce good results, but I've heard some problems there too. And, the same goes for cheaper ESC's, there have been quite a few dissappointed customers in that department also. In my opinion ( two cents worth), trying to re-invent the wheel can be a time consuming task ... and may cost more in the long run than going with what is known to work.

Chat later,

Russ

Spiro

Thanks for the input guys. I am having a great time flying with the Vmax7 right now, but when it isn’t cooperating and I am on the ground… that can be frustrating. I think the messy fuel issue alone is enough to make me want to go electric at this point. I can never keep things as clean as I would like and I have the hardest time keeping the darn paint on the canopy! It can be pretty frustrating to put some serious time into a paint job only to have it become sticky and peel off…

My buddy who is now learning (and doing great! I wish I had picked it up as fast as he is) has a brushless Mega setup on the way. I will fly that a bit and help him get the heli dialed in. Perhaps if that seems to give me the convenient high performance I have been longing for, I might go that route. I am also considering the Hackers after listening to so many strong reviews from you guys over the last year or so. The hackers seem to cost a bit more lettuce, but if their product delivers and the price isn’t completely out of line then I would strongly consider one of their setups.

Questions:

Where are some good places for a decent deal on a Hacker motor and ecs?

Some people seem to run 7 cells, some run 8. What is the thinking there?

What would it take to get into LiPo? What type and configuration of cells? Charger?


Thanks again. Now I have to go burn some of this fuel

Spiro

Spiro

MiniBoy,

Where is your CG with that landing gear and battery setup? The installation looks pretty smooth, but I worry that the CG would be to far back. How do you like that setup?

Spiro

gmaster

i got my hacker motor/esc combo from NipponDave at www.aircraft-world.com, dont let the 'he's from japan' worry you.. he's actually from the US but living in japan.. his shipping was awesome.. it only cost like $2.50 and i got all my stuff within a week. you cant beat that also Mike Roffee at www.roffeetvhobby.com is a great source for corona parts and knowledge.. (i got all my corona stuff from him).. he also sells different Brushless combos.. I am not sure what he has now but I have heard he carries mega combos..etc..

as for batteries.. its just a choice.. some people say with their setups.. 8-cells give more UMPH!!!.. but with 7-cells i have no problem with power all the way thru the battery cycle.. and save a lil weight.. it all depends.. i guess the Hacker motor/esc runs great on any choice of pack...

charger.. i use Great Plains Triton charger.. it charges all the normal battery types.. NiCds.. NiMHs.. and LiPo's.. works great.. The reason I got this charger was from recommendation and reviews that it would charge LiPo's so in the future if I moved on to that I could.. The Orbit I heard also does a great job but it is expensive... I am not familiar with the LiPo setups but there are TONS of people on the other forum that use LiPo's and have great results.. the cost right now for me isnt worth it.. i imagine when the price comes down and they become more stable.. i will move on to LiPo's but for now i will stick with what I have..

Spiro

gmaster,

The www.aircraft-world.com link apears to be broken. Is that address correct?

Thanks again,
Spiro

gmaster

i clicked the link and it works here..


http://www.aircraft-world.com

Welcome to Air Craft... the World Shop
R/C Electric Aircraft and Glider Accessories...

Mini Boy

Hi Spiro!

Oosel and Gmaster seem to concurr with most of the opinions that I have observed on these discussion boards. If I "were to do it again", I don't know if I would go the LiPoly route or not. My gut feeling is that the LiPo's need some more time to be proven, and also to become more popular so the price gets a little more reasonable. In the meantime, if you decide to stick with NiCd or NiMh packs, get GOOD ones .. Sanyo has seemed to be the best for reliability and duration. I certainly agree with Gmaster, that you should really give serious thought to getting a GOOD charger, not an "O.K." one, and absolutely one that is capable of charging Lithium batteries, as I have no doubt that in the next year or two, LiPo's will have come of age and will be the power source of choice.

The Hacker ESC is actually manufactured by Jeti, yet you never hear of anyone using a Jeti "Phasor" brushless motor in much of anything ..... this I cannot understand!!

As for the CG on my Corona, since the battery pack is without doubt the heaviest component in the whole machine, I mounted the pack in the landing gear where it would be the most convenient to swap out. This also is pretty close to the battery being centered under the center of the main shaft. Then, I moved the reciever and gyro and ESC forward to get the CG correct. As it is shown in the previously attached photo, the Machine balances fore / aft with a whisker of nose down attitude, and laterally it has a tad of a roll to the left, as the keel of the crutch is offset to the right, putting the motor out on the left side and it cant be changed. However, it flies as smooth as silk.

Since the new format on this site allows for 3 MB image files, I will attach a bigger shot of the right side as an experiment.

This may be bad, as DSL took over 30 seconds to upload ..... (OOPS)!

Chat later,

Russ

Spiro

Russ,

Man, that is a clean looking install. Nice work. I especially appreciate the detail work on your wire routing.

I am glad to hear your setup balances well. I like the look of those landing gear and wouldn't mind a similar rig myself. What type of gear are those and were can you get them?

Jeff

Mini Boy

Hi Spiro!

The gear is what lots of others have used, and I followed suit. They are from a JR Voyager-E, and I procured them from Roffee's (GREAT folks to do business with!!!) for $ 14.00 a set. These ideas were floating around when I was doing all my reasearch about a year ago, and I stole them from Gkurt, K1kxxx, Hoverup and others, and refined some of them a bit more. I honestly believe that short of a totally new crutch design which would be more bi-laterally symetrical (and there are some around), there aren't many ways to improve on the setup.

The stock gear is ok, especialy for the oil slinger version, but you would get real tired real quick of taking the canopy off every time you want to swap a battery pack!!! AND ... if you wrap the packs in flat black sign vinyl film as in my earlier photo, you really don't even notice the pack when the heli is in flight or parked.

Think of how nice it would be to throw any kind of Krylon, or rustoleum, or clear coat, or decals on the canopy and not have to worry about "fuel proof"!!!! AArrrrGhghhh .... I can't even imagine it!!! How about bringing the machine home from flying and plunk it in the $63,537.00 dining room table, with no fears of getting thrown out of the house?!?!?! Oh .... how about those paper towels??? (Uh-Oh ...... there he goes again).

Chat soon,

Russ

Spiro

I mentioned I have a buddy here who has been learning on my vmax7 LMH. Well his ebay corona came and I helped him run through that tonight. We got everything set up right and balanced well, then took it for a little spin. I did the blade tracking and test flight in my living room at 1:00 in the morning! The neighbors didn’t hear a thing. I must admit I was VERY impressed by how quiet and smooth the machine was. Not to mention squeaky clean. I can’t wait to give it a try with a little more room

His setup:
Corona 120
Mega 16/15/3
CC 35 controller
7 cell battery (2400 nicad of unknown cell type)
4/4 grips
HS81 servos
Ikarus Profi HH gyro
JR Voyager E gear
Old school Futaba TX/RX

The rig was very smooth and easy. I will let you know how he likes it once he has a few batteries through.

For what it is worth,
Spiro

Mini Boy

Hi Spiro!

Sorry not to respond sooner ... I just realized that this sites new format dropped the e-mail notification when a new post appears on a subscribed thread.

Glad you like the Corona. I wrote somewhere earlier that a few have used the Mega Motors, but I don't think I've seen a single report of a Jeti. Seems to me they'd work O.K. too. Both are a lot less $$ than a Hacker.

Isn't it wild to be able to play (carefully) in your living room????? I think the absence of the noise, smoke, smell and slime is terriffic (am building a Hobbico Superstar EP as a result of the fun with the Corona).

Chat soon,

Russ

Spiro

Yeah, my nitro rig seems deafening now and slimy… I am most likely going to move to an electric rig. Right now I am trying to decide if I want another LMH or if I should drop the money into something else with CP. Eolo?

Spiro

Mini Boy

Hi again Spiro!

Well .... I got my "Forum Preferences" fixed, and I got an e-mail from your return post .... life is good!!

I have not followed the Eolo threads, but HAVE read a few here and there. From my recollection, they are mostly good to excellent. I must admit that building a second "one of the same" (LMH) would not be too exciting, and there is always the "graduating to something more advanced" factor to be considered.

As always, get as much data from these forums as you can, as I have absolutely NO quams with the way my Corona turned out as a result of the help I got here from Hoverup, N1XXX, Gmaster, Gkurt and many others. If I were to build another Corona, I would probably do it the same (after some updated research).

In my own humble opinion, my next heli will be a .45 size machine (MAYBE even a .60 size), and I'm leaning toward Graupner (although that is NOT etched in concrete), as they have some of the coolest fuselages in existence. I prefer scale stuff, and am not particularly interested in aerobatics and all of that. Also, no matter what the others may say, the bigger they are ... the EASIER they are to fly ... PERIOD! AND .... this is what it's all about, we all have different opinions about the "ideal" machine.

There is one given though, what ever it turns out to be, mine WILL be elecric power!! I've been through the slimey oil slinger thing, and that is for the birds. I'm kind of hanging loose to see how the LiPo scene plays out, as for the big birds, you may have to put out some pretty serious $$$ for several battery packs and at least two chargers that can do LiPo's. I am already reading some pretty upbeat info on that subject.

So, 'nuff said ..... keep in touch, and I'll continue on with my Superster EP, with skis, floats and wheels. You see, my "front yard" is a 50 acre lake, that really is a cool flying field. Oh. also, I have plans to put "floaties" on the Corona for snow and water operations. Incidentally, I bought the Superstar specifically because it uses the same 7 cell packs that I already have for the Corona.

Chat soon,

Russ

Spiro

I hear you on the big birds. I have seen a few and they just look rock solid and stable. I too am a fan of scale heli’s. I would say I am far more interested in a ship that flys smooth and looks amazing than I am in attempting some sort of inverted flipping outside death spiral…

My only problems with the bigger stuff is I have been drooling over the electric world for almost a year now. I a more or less convinced that is the way to go. Yet, as you point out, it costs a whole wheel barrel full of gippers to make battery packs for big heli’s. One of the reasons I was considering the Eolo was that it is still a small helicopter, so batteries would be relatively cheep, but has full collective. I am a ways away from doing anything on that front anyway, so now worries now. Who knows, perhaps LiPo will drop in price significantly sometime in the foreseeable future and the electric equation might change a bit.

By the way, I flew a couple of tanks in the twilight tonight with the friend I have been teaching. He gives me constant crap every time I start wiping down my Vmax7 LMH.

Spiro

Mini Boy

Hi again Spiro!

Trust me, I agree with you 100% !!

The Corona / 117 is a pretty user friendly size heli, to say nothing of the inherent near indestructability!! I am not sure, but I have a hunch that the Eolo is as big or perhaps a tad bigger than the aforementioned. If this is the case, I think you could well deal with a 7 to 8 cell pack based machine, that would have the advantage of collective pitch. The crashability and availability of parts for tha Eolo are another story .... but I'm sure you could investigate that info right here on these forums.

I am SURE that (in the next year or two) LiPo's will be dropping in price, and at the same time more than likely increasing in duration (MaH's) as well as in quality, but this is another of those technological "wait-and-see" things. SO .... in the meanwhile ... what to do???

Ya gotta WING IT!!!!

One thing though, as I read the threads and posts about those Norvel things, I just can't imagine putting up with that kind of frustration! I would have thrown all that stuff out in the lake after the third time I had a problem ....... life is way to short to put up with that amount of grief.

AND .... Once again ...... my three cents worth,

Russ

Spiro

Merino Pond, by any chance?

For scale, I would have to go with the Vario MD520N
http://www.variousa.com/md520.html
Now that would be fun to convert to electric...

Mini Boy

Hi Spiro:

Well I must say that the Vario MD 520 N would eliminate some aggravation with the absence of a tail rotor!!

The link below is to V-East, Graupner's U.S.A. distributor. There may be others, I'm not sure.

http://www.v-eastonline.com/grap-scale.html

If you click around, you will see the "Uni Electro" version of the ".45 size" electric mechanics.

(This is the link to the mechanics):

http://www.v-eastonline.com/grap-mech.html

And no, I'm not on Marino Pond, but you were only off to the west by about 2 miles. I'm on Webster Lake, also very well known by the Indian name ...
Lake Chargoggagoggmanchaugagoggchaubunnagungamaugg. Honest, it's in the Guinness record books as the longest name of a place or thing in the world(??) ... at least the country.

Chat soon,

Russ