aeajr

My Feedback: (2)

I have posted pieces and parts of this in other threads but have never started a thread on the topic. I have revised and updated the article for your consideration.


FINDING LOST PLANES - Plane Locators
by Ed Anderson
aeajr on the forums
updated Oct 2008

Over the years I have been flying I have learned how hard it can be to find a
plane that has landed in the woods, tall grass and other places where you can't
see it. On my second flight, I lost my Aerobird when a huge gust of wind carried
it over deep woods, never to be seen again. Even though I was certain I knew
where it went down, after 8 hours of searching, and the help of friends, nothing.

When I moved on to sailplanes I started by flying a Great Planes
Spirit 2 Meter. Again, during my early learning phase, I got into trouble
and it went down into heavy woods and brush in a very hard to search area. I
went into the woods about fifty feet, trying to decide how to proceed when I
heard Beep Beep Beep. The plane was about 100 feet away in heavy tree
growth. I could not see it, but I could hear it. I had the plane located and out
in 10 minutes. Believe me, where it had landed I likely would not have found it.

The difference was a little device you put in the plane. Over time I have come
across several types of locators and with a wide variety of costs and ranges. Some
attach to your receiver and some don't.


SOUND BASED LOCATORS THAT ATTACH TO YOUR RECEIVER

The most common and lowest cost of the locators attach to your receiver. Normally they
draw very little power and are quiet. But if the signal is lost, or if you activate a particular
channel, they let out a sound that can be hear for 50 to 150 feet. Normally that is enough
to help you locate the plane quickly.

I have sound based locators in most of my sailplanes, slope gliders and parkflyers.

SkyKing RC Lost Model Locator - $20
My current favorite because it works with my PCM receivers too.
http://www.skykingrcproducts.com/acc...del_alarm.html
Review
http://www.slopeflyer.com/artman/pub...el_alarm.shtml

The Lost Model Alarm - I have a bunch of these too
http://www.californiasailplanes.com/...l%20alarm.html

They hook to any channel or can share a channel with one of your servos.
These will work most planes with a 72 MHZ receiver and may work with other
radio band equipment too. If you use PCM or if your receiver has a fail safe setting
check with the locator maker as the fail safe may prevent the locator from working.

Channel Conflict Test!

Because these watch for a transmitter signal, they can also tell
if someone is on my channel. If I turn on the receiver only, and not the
transmitter, and the device does not go into lost plane mode then someone
else is on that frequency. I may have just saved my plane, or someone else's.

Low Voltage Watch - Mostly of value with gliders or glow planes

In addition to helping me find the plane, both locators also monitor my
battery pack voltage and sound an alarm if the pack voltage gets below a
safe level. This is especially valuable on my gliders. If I catch a good
thermal, or if I am slope soaring, I could be in the air for over an hour, so a
pack that tested good on the ground could run low during the flight. These
alarms would warn me during the flight. If the plane is not too far away, I
can hear them in the air.

Here are two others I have not tried.

Lost Model Locator - $10
http://www.allthingsrc.com/webshop/p...products_id/39

RC Reporter - $24
A bunch of features
http://wingedshadow.com/rcrprod.html


MODEL LOCATORS THAT DO NOT ATTACH TO YOUR RECEIVER

The Loc8tor - $100 for receiver and two transmitters
http://www.loc8tor.com/faqs.asp#G3

The locators above won't work with many 27 MHz, 2.4 GHz or planes that
have failsafe features on their recievers. As noted above the Sky King can work
with PCM based systems.

For these planes an alternative would be the Loc8tor. This is a medium range
transmitter/receiver system that is good for 100 to 600 feet.

The system consists of a small 5 g tag that you put in the plane. The battery is
good for months. This is bound to a receiver that can read the signal and take
you to within a foot of the plane. The higher the plane, the greater the range.

In windy conditions, such as when you are slope soaring, a sound beeper may be
hard to hear. The Loc8tor could work much better and provide longer range.

Also note that most of the sound beepers work off the receiver battery. If the
crash is hard enough, the receiver battery can be disconnected. The transmitter
on the Loc8tor uses an internal battery. Even if it is thrown from the plane, it will
be powered by its own battery. Assuming it is not destroyed in the crash, you
should still be able to find it and be near the plane.

$100 gets you the receiver and two transmitter tags. You can move the tags
from plane to plane or buy more tags at about $25 each. Each receiver can
monitor and locate up to 24 transmitters so you can buy one and share it
among a group of pilots. Cost per plane is then about $26.


The Walston System - Long Range Finder - $540-$740
http://walstonretrieval.com/main.htm

For really long range finds, measured in miles, there is the Walston system.
The plane unit is about $140 while the tracking unit is $400 to $600 dollars.

This is especially appropriate for purchase by sailplane clubs, where a
sailplane can cost over $1000 A $140 transmitter is worth the cost. Each
pilots buys one or more transmitters and the club buys the receiver/tracker.

This is not a low cost system, but for high value planes that are flown at great
distances, this is THE solution to have.


SUMMARY

Every plane I own has some kind of locator and/or a battery monitor.
Of course I could move one from plane to plane, but at $10-25 the sound
beepers are cheap enough I can put one in every plane and forget it!

I have not tried the Loc8tor but it looks very intersting and at $25 per plane has
a longwr range than the sound beepers and is not dependant on the receiver battery.
It will work with any plane regardless of the radio system.

For my big gliders that are flown up to a mile out and over 1000 feet high I add the
Walston. I had a servo fail on one of my big gliders which caused it to crash
a half mile from the field. I looked for 3 days, with the help of several
people. We did not find this 10 foot wing span plane. Finally a hiker found it,
found my name stickers and called me. That was the last time a glider went
out without a locator AND the Walston. Between the two I am sure I would
have found it.

Many new pilots don't know about these devices. Now you do!

BMatthews

And here I thought this was only an issue with my free flight models....

I have to admit that due to some odd happenings I've had to go fetch my RC models from time to time. Only once in very heavy bush did the servo sound lead me to the model. The rest of the time my free flight senses did the trick.

aeajr

My Feedback: (2)

I was on the slope on a very gusty day. My Zagi 3C wing ended up on top of a 50 foot tree about 200 yards away.

Unfortunatly this tree was one of many in a small forest. The leaves were so thick I could not see the plane, but I could hear it. Even with the beeper it took me some time to find it because it was on top of the leaves. Finally I caught sight of the red monokote.

Without the plane locator, that plane would still be there.

aeajr

My Feedback: (2)

Anyone have a locator that will work with Spektrum 2.4 GHz receivers?

Sailplane

aeajr,

Does the Sky King Lost Model Locator work with 2 to 4 cell lipos?

aeajr

My Feedback: (2)

As receiver packs? NO!

As motor packs? Yes, because the ESC or BEC sends 5-6V to the receiver and that is what the Sky King sees.

It won't help as a battery monitor but it will work as a plane finder and for checking for channel conflict. Also keeps you from forgetting to disconnect the batteries. That is important when it comes to lipos.

aeajr

My Feedback: (2)

I know people don't lose planes anymore, but for the few that do, this could be helpful.

Cloudsoarer

Make your own!
Here are a couple of examples I have made and used that work well (I did not design them).
The first is for 3 cell (NIMH) HLG - uses only 4 parts but they are more expensive. Can be used for 4 cells and lipos too but you will need to change the value of the resistors and I do not have that data (someone here will probably work it out).
The second has a higher component count and may need a circuit board or vero board, but can also be direct wired together and encapulized in epoxy. It has a 4.4volt cutoff.
Both sound a piezo buzzer (take off an old computer motherboard) when they reach their cutoff voltage. BUT via the capacitor, they also can sound off with vigorous movement of servos as they temporally load the battery on startup. The caps as shown allow intermittent sounding as the battery nears drained. A higher value cap will limit this tendancy. So if the model is lost you can wander about waggling your controls for some hours and getting intermittent beeps.
They are very light and only use a couple of milliamps in monitoring mode. I guess you could also adapt them with another resistor to flash a powerful LED. All parts available from RS Components. The National TC44 is the most expensive part but is used in most portable devices like cell phones to monitor batteries.

Sandmann_AU

I lost my first plane into a swamp on its fourth flight - two hours of searching and avoiding spiders, snakes, and whatever else yielded nothing. It was only by chance that five weeks later someone was chasing their own lost plane that they could see stuck in the top of a tree, and found mine (sitting nicely on its wheels) at the base of said tree. Since then I've always used lost model alarms as a matter of course on every plane. The hobby shops here generally stock one that has the low voltage and lost signal alarms for about AU$15. These alarms have two leads with a male and female plug, and are connected between the receiver and an aileron servo, and have an extra feature such that if you turn the model on and move the aileron to full deflection within a second or two it checks the batteries. It will also start beeping slowly if you haven't moved the aileron in a few minutes, and get faster when it loses signal. Even better they seem to work fine with a 2.4GHz system.

I did find one problem with these units though - if you're using a Y adapter to drive two aileron servos from a single channel you must put the alarm AFTER the Y adapter so only one servo's fed from the alarm, rather than plugging the alarm into the Rx and the Y adapter into the alarm. For some reason connecting it the wrong way can cause the aileron servos to start dancing on their own when the engine's running. Of course, the better solution is to use separate channels for the aileron servos.

snuts

Last night I slept poorly, thinking my Bird of time made the lake.With no spoilers, I vanished into the cloudbase. Fighting to keep from terminal velocity-Failed- Watched the outside 40% flutter north definatly into the lake. We heard the screaming fuse, a mile away. But it was already down by the time we saw the wing piece. This morning after breakfast I got a call, with the locator going in the background! It was found at dusk making noises from in the tall swamp grass. The gentleman didn't know what to do so he left it out on his picnic table for the night, scared to shut it off. I hade added up $700 to replace all the electronics etc. This $30 investment brought home $700. I can't imagine being without one in every airplane.
Just of interest my altimiter recorded 4144ft!
-Snuts-

likeswindinhair

i have a california sailplane locator that plugs into reciever. i also use 2.4 system on the radio.  so what I want to be clear on is I wont be able to use it? Ive lost one plane due to lockout and dont want to go thru that again. what if you use a seperate battery for reciever. can you use it then?

juggler-3310

I own three of the Sky King lost model alarms. They seem to work well, and I've never had one in a plane that went down. But I did lose my Zagi a few weeks ago, and was cursing myself that I didn't have one of these locators in the plane at the time. I went searching through the woods for about an hour, and it was tough going. The underbrush was extremely thick. By luck I managed to find it. When I got the plane out I checked to see what had gone wrong. Nothing was working. No motor, elevons, or receiver power. Nothing.  I went to disconnect the LiPo battery, and when the Dean's connector was about half way out suddenly everything turned back on again. Then I plugged the connector all the way back in again, and everything shut down. Unplugged it half way again, and suddenly everything came back to life. Plugged it back in all the way, dead. My connector apparently had gone bad somehow. And even if I had one of these lost model locators in the plane when it went down, it still wouldn't have worked because there would have been no battery connection to supply it with power. When things go wrong, they can really go wrong. I was lucky that I found this plane.

juggler

Tom Nied

I read with interest. I recently lost a Radian. Just got so high, I couldn't see it anymore. I felt like it flew away. Went home and found a welcome voicemail on my cell phone. Pat in the neighborhood was reporting that my aircraft had crash landed on his driveway. So putting a name and phone number on each plane is simple and cheap insurance. It brought my plane that I thought was gone forever home.

aeajr

My Feedback: (2)

Congratulations on getting your Radian back.

Tom Nied

Yes and Thank-You. And the good news is, I've completed repairs and got a 37 min 42 second flight in this evening! How High SP reports my maximum altitude was 523 ft. My Radian flies again.

aeajr

My Feedback: (2)

Rumor has it that www.californiasailplanes.com will have a new plane finder/battery monitor that works with Spektrum radios pretty soon. I have a bunch of their units for my 72 MHz planes and like the a lot. I presume these will be similar.

GBR2

My Feedback: (1)

The skyking unit will work with the Spektrum 2.4 receivers that have the pre-set failsafe option.

320pilot

Lost my 2 meter Poly Pulsar yesterday
dumb dumb dumb

I had been flying it with a Sky King Lost Model Locator, but recently took it out to connect up a RAM3 altitude logging device. AR6250 Rx was running out of pins. Been having some great, high flights (1700 feet) and wanted to have a log of flight duration, sink rates, etc.
Well yesterday, I stayed with a big CU, sharing a thermal with a hawk, drifting downwind for too long. When I went to come back to my field, wind aloft had increased, and I wasn't making headway, at altitude, so dived a bit towards my location with flap (first mistake?) . Now tried to stay lower, with power, but couldn't see orienation of wings; kept looping, or steep turns losing altitude.
Finally lost it below first tree line, cut power and selected full flaps hoping to find it in a field. Had the RAM3 on board too.
Well, after two days of walking a line, with GPS from launch site to tree ridge it went behind, no luck. Lots of thick, thick forest, Pulsar could be very high in canopy too.

Now we are getting stong rain and wind, end of the Pulsar, even if I can find it. Was going to try a tree top recon mission with my Ascent rigged up with video cam today, but wind never let up.

So there has to be an answer to losing these sailplanes. Maybe next time I launch an expensive sailplane, I will have the Walston system on board. Would have saved me a lot of grief. I hope none of you ever have to look for a nice sailplane like this.

ray
LML might have helped, but there is a lot of woods here where it went down. LML does work with AR6250 if you follow instructions on SkyKing web site. I'll be flying with a LML in everything now! graph is from Pulsar a few days ago

CBM Racing

Yep, well worth their cost whatever you use. Brother lost his radian just like snuts lost his BOT. He never got his back though. I wish he could find it just to see altimeter reading! He didn't have name or number or anything, so if someone finds it, they got a free glider with no guilt! So, if nothing else, put your name and cell number on it.

aeajr

My Feedback: (2)

the SkyKing locator has pins so you can connect your altimiter through the Sky King locator.

320pilot

Yes Ed,
I saw those pins just now on my Sky King LML.

Flew a video mission this morning while the wind was still calm. I have a Sony Webbie cam mounted on an Ascent 450BL. Since the camera is shooting through the propeller you see lots of wavy lines, until you shut down the motor. Climbed fairly high, over wooded area where I think Pulsar is, then shut down motor to swoop back and forth over the tree tops.

Lots of great video now in HiDef, but no sign of the Pulsar. I have burned the fly-by video to DVD, will watch/pause it again tonight, and may fly another mission later today, if wind drops off.

Unfortunately, we had wind and rain last night, so Pulsar (what's left of it) could be lower in tree canopy. Did another "walk in the woods", too no luck. My name is on the Pulsar, so maybe a hunter will call in the Fall.

ray

desert flier

I nearly lost my bubble dancer was specked out under a cue and then flew into the blue and it disapeared lost it for about 20 seconds I have an eagle tree data logger and barograph showed 4000ft i then spotted a glint and pulled dive break and spun down a little shaken. I have definately decided to get the GPS unit for it so that a courdinate is displayed on the screen[&:]

320pilot

desert flier
Glad you were lucky. If I hadn't been so far downwind; just very high, my vertical dive, with full flaps would have brought my Pulsar back into sight. I had done this before! Problem was, when I got lower, after the dive, it still wasn't visible enough for me to fly it back. Just flashing wings, and now it was low, just over some trees. I had only had this Pulsar, my first high performance sailplane for 4 months.

Next e-sailplane, I will practice and set up a dual rate, to fly it back, in trim/level flight with a low/moderate power setting. And practice. I had only been doing full power climbs, overhead before this loss, and at low level, far away, they (full power climbs ) kept looping the bird, which I could barely see. Another bit of advice I got was fly it back laterally, don't try to fly it back pointed straight at you.

A pair of handy binoculars might have saved the day, too. I was flying on my own, with the binocs at home. Something else I will practice. I have a very good pair of 7X50 Military Steiner binocs, that could have saved the day.

Even better, DON'T LET THE BIRD GET TOO FAR DOWNWIND! Just because you are high, if the winds are strong, you may have trouble flying it back as I did.

I like the idea of the Eagle Tree, but don't you need a full FPV setup?

desert flier

no I have no FPV I have the altimiter logger in the glider and on the ground i have the reciever wich gives an audio signal for lift or sink and an altatude readout all live and when I get the GPS part it will also give coordinates[8D]

320pilot

GPS coordinates would be nice. Do you get a real time GPS position during flight, or only after you had landed?

here is one more idea I saw, maybe you could adapt it to find a lost plane? Put the dog collar/Tx in your sailplane? If you opened up the collar case, the electronics might be smaller.

http://www.cabelas.com/cabelas/en/te...883&id=0059343


thanks