CAN ANYONE PROVIDE ME WITH INSTRUCTION FOR INSTALLING FUNCTIONAL WING WARPING IN THE 40 SIZE BALSA USA TAUBE????

Not possible. The BUSA wing as it is, would be much too rigid to warp. But you could of course build a completely new wing with more or less scale flexibility (which would also then need all the same complex rigging that the original Taube had).

If some of the stiffness could be taken out would it be possible to use torque rods and a couple of those new 700+ in/oz servos? Just wondering.
Walt

Given that the BUSA wing is made to be strong enough to use without rigging, it would be hard to use it as is. Typical BUSA construction used sheer webs between two spars. Even if you leave off the webs it would probably still be too stiff.

The basic fact is this: If the wing is strong enough to be used without functional rigging, it's definitely too rigid to warp.

On the topic of wing-warping, Don Coe actually used a hinge in the second (rear) spar of his AVRO wing because even the scale construction wouldn't twist enough.

I agree about the stiffness of BUSA wings if my M1a is typical of their construction. Stiff and strong. I know 'cause I've beat the bejeebers out of mine and never had to repair a the wing. I guess it all depends on how badly one wants wing warping.
Walt

As with most things, if you have enough money, time and patience it probably could be done. However, to me, it's like putting a $5K custom paint job on a Ford Fiesta. The 40 size Taube is "squint scale' at best. You also might have a problem trying to fit all the required hardware into a fuselage of that size.

J

The Taube has trailing edges (TE) that can be made to reflex up/ down. Instead of building the hard TE add bamboo skewers that fan out to the rear. Look at a 3-view to get the sight picture, here. On the ends glue a piece of alum tubing that has a hole to let rigging in order to attach covering. The Taube has bracing above and below the wing on which the warp cables make their runs. You could do that but it would be easier to just make a central pylon to attach the flying/ landings wires and warp cables. Not scale but neither is the BUSA version that accurate. Here's a pic of my EIII warp cable drive and another pic of my Bleriot XI wing. Any ??? feel free to ask via e-m or here and I'll try to answer.

That Bleriot is REALLY cool! I love the cable operated warping.

I had a Flair Taube; I agree that you could probably keep the rigidity of the main spars and find a way to make the trailing edge at the tip flexible. Even the Flair, which was a little better than the BUSA, only looked really looked like a Taube when it was up about 300 feet. It definitely could have used some independent roll control though. Even at altitude, you can see a hinge line, so it would be nice to make it bendable.

Let us know what you come up with.

Jim

I am in the process of modifying an 88 inch Wing Span, 1500Sq. In. Wing Area,Nick Zeroli Taube kit to warping tail and wing.

The suggestion above to use bamboo skewers is a good, but to get better flexiblity I have gone to 1.5 mm carbon fiber rods.By 1913 the builders of Taubeshad dropped the lower wing warping controls.

I am modeling a 1914 Jeannin Stahltaube that is in the German Technical Museum in Berlin for Control Line Sport Scale competition. It will be powered by an OS FS91 SII-P engine.

On the wing there are 6 cables from the carbon rods toan A frame on top of the wing then a single cable over the wing leading edge (through a pulley) then back under the wing to the lower edge of the body by the pilot's feet. Inside the body I have a high power servo.

For the elevator I have followed the three views as close as possible. The trailing edge of the elevator moves +/- 1.5 inches, 3 inches total travel from full up to full down.See pictures.

Thevideo is of a Full size replica of a 1913 Etrich Taube. It has the wood frame and the wood trusses under the wing but they also did not use thelower cables on the wing tips.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NLkK74hNw

It needs two dashes between the equal sign and the N, Grrr!
Clancy

Clancy
You also need ".com"after "youtube". What size servo are you using?
Thanks

Wingwarper
Thanks for catching the omission. I added the ".com"but it still will not accept the two dashes between the "=" and the "N". Just type it into your browser correctly.

The servos I am using are 39 oz/in torque standardfor Throttle and Rudder and 75 oz/in torque heavy duty for the Wing Warping. The Elevator warping if by the Control lines and a hand made three piece bellcrank. The Wing warp servo is below the bellcrank. I had to move it to the rear about two inches to getthe cables exiting the body in the scale position.
See picture.
Clancy

That's really looking good! Question: if it's CL why do you have wing warp? Are you coupling it with the elevator warp, like stunt ships? I'm a CL guy from way back and belonged to the Cincy group for the Scale Golden Age racing and currently (but haven't flown with) the Clarksville CL club.

ARUP
Iwant the wing warping to be able to do a good "Wing Wave" as a flight option in CL Scale. Most fliers use verylittle roll when doing a Wing Wave and do it too fast. The plane just kind of shakes inflight. A true wing wave isobvious from the ground. I have judged some that if the contestant had not calledd "Wing Wave" I would not have known what they tried to do. I will also be able to level the wings in flight.

Ialso plan on using the rudder when taxying to steer the model.
Clancy

Thinking outside the square here, why not just cheat?

If the wing incorporates a round wing joining tube (aluminium or carbon) why not let the wings pivot on the rod like all moving tailerons on a jet.

With the tube in a reasonable aerodynamic position very little servo muscle would be needed to raise & lower the trailing edge (1/4 inch up & down?) Any linkages could be hidden in the fuselage with perhaps a small slot near the trailing edge of the wing.

Rigging wires near the pivot would move very little so they could still provide some support. Others could be made elastic to allow for wing movement.

No wing warping, no ugly ailerons, just roll control. - John.

That's exactly how a clubmate set up his own designed and scratch-built Bleriot. Initially, the model tried to use this taileron trick only on the elevator (which sure looked weird) but there wasn't even force to turn the whole model. So after just barely making it back down, he redid it so that the main wings rotate. Worked beautifully!

Somethings I left out of my post above:

The A frame on top of the wing is hinged at the top surface of the wing and the wing had to be thinned to blend into the flexable area. I installed a long piece of 1/4 x 1/2 spruce drilled for the carbon rods to mount in. You can see the spruce and the hinged A frame in the first picture I posted. In that picture the rods are stainless steel wire but was too stiff so they werechanged to carbon rods. After this picture was taken I added strips of balsa on top and bottom of the spruce between the rib cap strips to blend everything together.

The wing actually does not warp! The trailing edge near the tips flex up and down so this method can be added to the Balsa USA kit of either size. See picture.

Great job! You've really found an outstanding solution for making this work with standard wing construction. This is what modeling is all about. BTW, is it the case that the airflow acts to "return" the TE to neutral and that there's no "down" only "up?"

If you look at the old picture of a Jeannin Stahltaube you see that both of the traiing edges are curved up some. For control one tip is flexed morewhile the other tip is relaxed some. The servo in my model only has to add the power required to change the flex in both tips, adding flex to one tip while releasing the other tip. The control cables are connected to the same hole in the servo arm and the cable loops pass throughthe loopin the other cable, that way if the servo arm breaks the cables are still tied together.

I tried to post above a youtube video of a real taube that shows the wing warping and in flight video.

Clancy

Very strange about that video. I can watch it (when I type it in). But it doesn't work when a copy and paste the link here? Weird. Anyway, it can be found by typing "1913 Etrich Taube Aeroplane" into the YouTube search.

What's interesting is that the inspiration for the wing-warping apparently came from a seed-pod rather than the more obvious fact of how birds use their wingtip feathers.

Here's a nice RC version:

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GhUp1LCw2cg&NR=1[/youtube]

Thanks for the answer! I was really curious about that! You can see a couple of my CL racers in my Gallery. Abu- that Taube vid is cool!

I cannot take credit for the Wing Warping design. I just coppied the designIgo Etrich of Austria did in 1909 when he designed the Taube that made it's first flightin February of 1910.

This picture gives you a better idea of the Wing Warp area on my Taube.
My wife asked if I was building a large model or a large butterfly?

Clancy

Bonus!!
Here is the three view drawing I am building from. It was sent to meby Tom Polapink, Publisher of WW1Aero magazine. It is from their issue 126 dated November 1989.
Clancy

My experience with these "Baubeschreibung" drawings is that they are not particularly accurate..and weren't meant to be. They were rough sketches that contained key, required pieces of information for Idflieg bureaucracy.

I agree but they are the best three views (only) available therefore I will include them in my documentation.  The photographs over rule the three views but so far I have found only one error.  The length of the horizontal stab forward of the flexable area, shown as 1700 is an obvious error.
Clancy

How do they compare with the scale drawings in the Taube datafile? In every case, these DF drawings seem to be better and based on better sources than the Baubeschreibung, though in almost every model I've build from DF, I've been able to find errors in those drawings as well. Sometimes they are simple drafting errors (such as a line not being carried through) but other times the curves might not match reality. But in terms of general outline, I tend to trust the DF drawings over most other sources.

For example, the DF drawings of the Albatros CI appear to be for the most part tracings of the original 1917 description that appeared in l'Aerophile. By comparison the CI Baubeschreibung is crude and seriously off in the nose area.