Epoxy Issues:
07-25-2017, 06:39 PM
#26
Dennis, is this a script for the Comedy Channel or something?? In post 11 I am standing too close to the mixing pot, need to shake my head??, and have a "Master Race Complex", now it is simply about money. This is a joke right?? Read post 6 again. I said I use US Composites 635 for most of my work. A simple trip to their website will tell you that 16Oz of resin with the necessary hardener is $17. I guess you are not capable of figuring that out yourself?
07-25-2017, 06:43 PM
#27
Shawn and Scott - not to be a ninny here... BUT!! Why not list the brand, price, size of container, source, and/or any other useful information about the product you use and rely on that meets your standards, so the rest can have the chance to benefit from such products. We're missing the nitty gritty details, fellas. We can't use the help if we don't know what specifically you're talking about.
Scott
07-25-2017, 06:58 PM
#28
Quick, you and I were typing at the same time. I said in Post 6 I use US Composites 635 resin. I intentionally try not to narrow selection to the brand I use as there are many suitable resin systems available. I thought I made that fairly clear, but if not I apologize. There are many laminating resins that work very well, the one I use is not necessarily the best. MGS is considered one of the finest, but it is kind of pricy.
Scott
Scott
07-25-2017, 07:01 PM
#29
Okay, let's get serious. If you're going to build any aircraft, there is only one brand of adhesive to use:
HYSOL
Hysol E-20HP, High Strength Clear Epoxy Adhesive, Slow Cure, 50ml, by Loctite, from Loctite, loc-vpoxy - Chief Aircraft Inc.
After all, how can Hysol not work, they use it to build turbine powered unlimited hydroplanes that run at 200 + MPH across water
HYSOL
Hysol E-20HP, High Strength Clear Epoxy Adhesive, Slow Cure, 50ml, by Loctite, from Loctite, loc-vpoxy - Chief Aircraft Inc.
After all, how can Hysol not work, they use it to build turbine powered unlimited hydroplanes that run at 200 + MPH across water
07-25-2017, 07:19 PM
#30
Nope - I just missed that part. So my apologies to you. Thank you for repeating the information - does Shawn use the same or different? Despite my usual banter, I do appreciate the finer things. I have a tight budget, but if something is a higher value than the leading product, I'm interested in trying something different. Many people equate value with dollars spent. Someone smart once said "dollars are what you pay, value is what you get".
Not sure what Shawn uses, you will have to ask him. I think the US composites I use is one of the best values for the money. Like I said, MGS is considered better, but it costs a bunch more.
By the way, I love your tag line...
Scott
07-25-2017, 07:37 PM
#31
I agree that Hysol products have never let me down. I however do not have them in my home shop. As Dennis has pointed out, cost and availability does play a part. For overall performance I do most of my home composites with Tap Plastics marine grade laminating epoxy resin. They have 3 different speed hardeners, they are not super mix ratio sensitive, wets out really well and when cured sands very well. That was my major gripe with West System. Even when fully cured when sanding there would be enough heat generated to exceed its TG and then it was like sanding rubber. It does work very well for sheeting wings though. When I want a paste adhesive, I will add Cabosil, milled fiber, flox, micro balloons or carbon powder or any combination of those depending on the job. For simple fuel proofing, thinning with 99% alcohol does a great job. Some resin systems when thinned will remain tacky. This is called Amine Blush which simply means the solvents in the resin don't completely flash off. Although it can be removed with acetone, the Tap system hasn't given me that issue. The airplane pictured was completely built with this system. Fuselage layup, wing sheeting, wing and tail glassing, the ply/G-10/CF engine mount. Even the Kevlar live hinges. The airplane has a 62" span, YS 115 power, electric retracts, 6 servo setup and weighs 6.25 lbs.
07-26-2017, 04:21 AM
#34
I use the dollar store 5 minute epoxy, it lasts for years, and the cyano in the smallest multi tube packs from there because I don't go through much and it hardens on me. For laminating, I use polyester resin because I have some from my street rod hobby, and it (and I) is cheap and works.I don't go 200 mph, but try for 150, 200 later. Ya I know Dennis, he is in our club. He knows enough to get by for sure.
07-26-2017, 04:54 AM
#35
Okay then, I think we have our answers:
1) GP epoxy is known to have the resin crystallize over time
2) To return the crystallized resin back to liquid, it needs to be heated, preferably in warm to hot water, until the crystals have all "melted"
3) Hobby shop epoxies are hit or miss in how well they work based on numerous factors, age being one
4) Recommending a "name brand" epoxy is asking for trouble, regardless of brand recommended, due to personal biases of other "keyboard experts"
I used the term "keyboard experts" here for a reason. Since I don't know any of the others posting in this thread, let alone in the aircraft forum, I have nothing but the individual's claims as to what they do or don't know. In the R/C boat racing world, someone that makes claims about what they know or how well they do on the water but is never seen at any races is called a "keyboard racer". The same situation is happening here, several people saying this or that works better than something someone else is using, based on their biases.
1) GP epoxy is known to have the resin crystallize over time
2) To return the crystallized resin back to liquid, it needs to be heated, preferably in warm to hot water, until the crystals have all "melted"
3) Hobby shop epoxies are hit or miss in how well they work based on numerous factors, age being one
4) Recommending a "name brand" epoxy is asking for trouble, regardless of brand recommended, due to personal biases of other "keyboard experts"
I used the term "keyboard experts" here for a reason. Since I don't know any of the others posting in this thread, let alone in the aircraft forum, I have nothing but the individual's claims as to what they do or don't know. In the R/C boat racing world, someone that makes claims about what they know or how well they do on the water but is never seen at any races is called a "keyboard racer". The same situation is happening here, several people saying this or that works better than something someone else is using, based on their biases.
Last edited by Hydro Junkie; 07-26-2017 at 04:56 AM.
07-26-2017, 11:43 AM
#36
I use the dollar store 5 minute epoxy, it lasts for years, and the cyano in the smallest multi tube packs from there because I don't go through much and it hardens on me. For laminating, I use polyester resin because I have some from my street rod hobby, and it (and I) is cheap and works.I don't go 200 mph, but try for 150, 200 later. Ya I know Dennis, he is in our club. He knows enough to get by for sure.
The great thing about this hobby is there is nothing set in stone except landings are mandatory. If you want to use hobby shop supplies and they work for you who has the right to ridicule you for it. Likewise if someone uses stuff from a dollar store, if it works more power to ya. Hell the dollar store is a fantastic source for detail parts if you use a little imagination.
It shouldn’t mater if one uses highest end supplies or bargain basement supplies as long as it works for the intended purpose. Those who feel the need to put others down because they feel superior in my opinion suffer from a God complex. Go back and read the first post by the op.
07-26-2017, 05:13 PM
#38
You two always banter out qualifications as part of your argument. Not only is it only your opinion of yourself but it seems an awful inflated opinion at that. Degree, job title, published papers on the subject???? Any definitive works recognized by a modeling or scientific community/publication????? It doesn’t mater no one really cares anyhow.
Op says my epoxy is bad. Easy solution would be to throw it out and get a fresher batch from the hobby shop.
07-27-2017, 03:25 PM
#39
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Propworn, it's like food - all food are good but it taste differently. Different kind of epoxy have different qualities - some are more flexy (sould be good for glueing perhaps?), some becomes stiffer and harder (should be good for making a wing skin or spar perhaps?). Basically if something is more flexy or softer it won't break as easily, if it's stiffer and harder it will often break more easily - what do you want for your particular use? I think that if you are using one particular brand and stays with it and are happy with it then no one should tell you that it's no good in any way - if it works for you, thats what it's about. But you really don't know the difference before you have tried other brands or types. Some of the guys in here have a long ride in this hobby and have tried a lot of different kinds of glues and epoxies and such and of course it is a matter of opinion, but it might be worth listening to what they have to say still - don't you think?
Last edited by ibuild; 07-27-2017 at 03:52 PM.
07-27-2017, 04:28 PM
#40
Like I said I don't have any problem with what ever is used/suggested. I have an issue for instance when someone posts they have great success doing things a certain way and are promptly put down as inferior. For instance in this case “If you want to use crap epoxy” Heck I know guys who build using nothing but carpenters glue. I grew up when the glue of choice was Amberoid.
