21VZ-B V-Spec or NOSRAM - RS-21 RR
12-20-2008, 11:34 PM
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21VZ-B V-Spec or NOSRAM - RS-21 RR
Hi Guys I just got a hyper 8.5 off a mate minus motor and now am wondering what motor to put in it. The two I'm looking at are the OS VZ-B Vspec or the nosram RS-21 RR. I have heard great things about both. The nosram is about $100 more than the OS at my local hobby shop. i was wondering witch one would be the better choice i would like something that would last a while. All your help would be greatly appreciated thanks
12-21-2008, 01:34 AM
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RE: 21VZ-B V-Spec or NOSRAM - RS-21 RR
yeah i was going to go with the OS but then the nosram popped up just wanted to know what people thought of it good or bad
12-21-2008, 02:39 AM
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RE: 21VZ-B V-Spec or NOSRAM - RS-21 RR
I've not had a Nosram engine myself, but i do have 2 OS engines and can tell you they absolutely RRRIIIIPPP
What I would recommend you buy with the new engine though are replacement bearings (front and rear).
They will eventually go through normal wear and tear; and it will be good to have them on hand when that happens.
What I would recommend you buy with the new engine though are replacement bearings (front and rear).
They will eventually go through normal wear and tear; and it will be good to have them on hand when that happens.
12-21-2008, 02:45 AM
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RE: 21VZ-B V-Spec or NOSRAM - RS-21 RR
how long would the front and rear bearings normally last. i hope to be racing twice a month with a practice in between
12-21-2008, 04:21 AM
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RE: 21VZ-B V-Spec or NOSRAM - RS-21 RR
On average one and a half gallons or so, sometimes less, sometimes longer. Once they blow, replace them with the silicone upgrades. Those should last you quite a bit longer, maybe 4 times longer.
12-21-2008, 04:33 AM
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RE: 21VZ-B V-Spec or NOSRAM - RS-21 RR
thanks for that. one other thing do you know if the hyper 8.5 rtr comes with oil in the diffs or not
12-21-2008, 04:57 AM
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RE: 21VZ-B V-Spec or NOSRAM - RS-21 RR
Don't know, I have the 8.5 pro kit so i had to put everything together myself. I'd go ahead and change it to the set up you want anyway. Nothing more sure than doing it yourself. Good starting point is 5K front, 7K center, 3K rear.
12-21-2008, 05:40 AM
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RE: 21VZ-B V-Spec or NOSRAM - RS-21 RR
Nosram and SH engines are the same, maybe minor case and head differences. If you like SH engines then you'll like Nosram. OS Vspec on the other hand is a Worlds winning engine. Enough said.
12-21-2008, 08:34 AM
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RE: 21VZ-B V-Spec or NOSRAM - RS-21 RR
OS Vspec on the other hand is a Worlds winning engine. Enough said.
12-21-2008, 08:54 AM
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RE: 21VZ-B V-Spec or NOSRAM - RS-21 RR
ORIGINAL: Jerseyboy
Nosram and SH engines are the same, maybe minor case and head differences. If you like SH engines then you'll like Nosram. OS Vspec on the other hand is a Worlds winning engine. Enough said.
Nosram and SH engines are the same, maybe minor case and head differences. If you like SH engines then you'll like Nosram. OS Vspec on the other hand is a Worlds winning engine. Enough said.
This is NOT true in the case of the RR. The Nosram 21RR is a Picco Evo 2 turbo - same as the LRP 21X, and except for the fancy crank the Orion CRF 21. The Jammin JPX21 is also an identical Picco engine.
These engines have crazy power. I went to a big international truggy race a while back, and was blown away by the Nosrams (in truggies..) They absolutely scream..
Here, see (and even better, hear..
) for yourself:http://s166.photobucket.com/albums/u...TNosrams-1.flv
http://s166.photobucket.com/albums/u...ithNosrams.flv
http://s166.photobucket.com/albums/u...C8TNosrams.flv
http://s166.photobucket.com/albums/u...minNosrams.flv
Is that a great sound or what?...
In the end I wasn't up to paying the new price, so got a used one. I've only run it one race weekend though, and did really well with it despite a fried clutch(my fault - stupid linkages..)
At the next race I went to, places 1-3 were all Orion CRF's...
IMHO, just based on the races that I've personally been to, the Nosram/LRP and CRF's are THE powerhouses among the 21's - just based on what I've seen.
VSPEC's and RB's aren't weak or anything, but they don't make you stop what you're doing and laugh when they go by.. I'm serious - that's been my reaction seeing these things run..
I DO however think they're overpriced... That's why, if I wanted a race 21, I'd get the Jammin JPX 21 - cheaper than a VSPEC on ebay.com or at amain or tower with the discount codes...
VSPEC's scare me a bit cuz of all the bearing-problem talk, and at the 3-4 races I've been to, the only engines I've seen having problems were VSPEC's.. - including a couple deaths..
The guy I bought my Nosram from had had it in an RC8 buggy, which I also bought. I currently have a Mach 427 in my truggy, and will be trying the Nosram I think in the buggy in spring when the weather's better... That should just be nuts...
12-21-2008, 10:38 AM
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RE: 21VZ-B V-Spec or NOSRAM - RS-21 RR
Sounds like im at a formula one race. Thats an indoor track not the best place for a truggy race...Thats the kinda track youd see on road truck like onroad buggies..But def nice track. And you know my friend the OS.21 isnt a world winning engine for nothing. In my opinion you get what you pay for.
12-21-2008, 10:01 PM
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RE: 21VZ-B V-Spec or NOSRAM - RS-21 RR
just got back from my local track there was a guy running the nosram. the thing was stupidly quick and it just seemed to keep reving i had a chat to him and he said he hadnt had any problems with it at all. i might be swaying towards the nosram Thanks herrsavage for all the info
Thanks herrsavage for all the info
12-22-2008, 06:02 AM
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RE: 21VZ-B V-Spec or NOSRAM - RS-21 RR
I cant make up my mind i have been searching forums for pros and cons of both motors with the OS front and rear bearings seem to be the thing that goes wrong 1 1/2 to 2 gallons how did they stuff that up and i cant find that much said about the nosram good or bad is that because people don't use them i found a few people using the .28 nosram in there savages and they seem to go really well i just want to know if anyone has run one of these motors and if they had any problems. its a $400+ motor over here and it would be nice to know a bit more about it before i handed over my hard earned cash
12-22-2008, 08:39 AM
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RE: 21VZ-B V-Spec or NOSRAM - RS-21 RR
The Nosram 21RR is identical to the Jammin JPX21. You can't find much about it cuz it's totally new - like the LRP 21X.
Search for info about the JPX21 to learn about the Nosram. Except for a carb that may need to be sealed, the engine generally gets very positive reviews.
The pipe that's intended for the Nosram 21RR is the 2063.
Here's a couple short vids of me testing mine before that race I went to(and when my clutch was still half-way intact..
):
http://s166.photobucket.com/albums/u...t=MOV06331.flv
http://s166.photobucket.com/albums/u...t=MOV06330.flv
I think both the Nosram and OS VSPEC are probably awesome engines. I don't believe in having to replace bearings after a gallon though, so I'm VSPEC-shy..
I also think the Nosram is too pricey - but then I'm just opposed to spending a lot on engines. Instead of getting a new Nosram I went and got a new Sportwerks 26 with closed backplate and nice new 053 pipe - for half the price of a new Nosram.
For a 21 (especially in a buggy..) I'd probably either get some SH variant or a Go.. I just don't believe in spending €250+ on any engine. That's just me though.
(I am however keeping my eye open for deals on Nosrams/LRP's/Orions.. - but I'm stubborn and cheap..)
The Nosram is definitely a powerhouse though..
The Nosram 28 is an SH engine like the previous Nosram 21 Evo. It's basically an LRP Spec 3. Nosram is owned by LRP so their engines are always the same, just a different color.
ps Just for shxts and giggles, on the weekend I ran the Nosram in the RC8T, I also ran the Mach(stock Muggy pipe, and Fioroni clutch..) in the RC8 buggy. Not legal, but it was literally my first time ever running a buggy at all. Was way fast - and fun - did much better racing than I ever would've expected..:
http://s166.photobucket.com/albums/u...t=MOV06403.flv
Search for info about the JPX21 to learn about the Nosram. Except for a carb that may need to be sealed, the engine generally gets very positive reviews.
The pipe that's intended for the Nosram 21RR is the 2063.
Here's a couple short vids of me testing mine before that race I went to(and when my clutch was still half-way intact..
):http://s166.photobucket.com/albums/u...t=MOV06331.flv
http://s166.photobucket.com/albums/u...t=MOV06330.flv
I think both the Nosram and OS VSPEC are probably awesome engines. I don't believe in having to replace bearings after a gallon though, so I'm VSPEC-shy..
I also think the Nosram is too pricey - but then I'm just opposed to spending a lot on engines. Instead of getting a new Nosram I went and got a new Sportwerks 26 with closed backplate and nice new 053 pipe - for half the price of a new Nosram.
For a 21 (especially in a buggy..) I'd probably either get some SH variant or a Go.. I just don't believe in spending €250+ on any engine. That's just me though.
(I am however keeping my eye open for deals on Nosrams/LRP's/Orions.. - but I'm stubborn and cheap..)
The Nosram is definitely a powerhouse though..
The Nosram 28 is an SH engine like the previous Nosram 21 Evo. It's basically an LRP Spec 3. Nosram is owned by LRP so their engines are always the same, just a different color.
ps Just for shxts and giggles, on the weekend I ran the Nosram in the RC8T, I also ran the Mach(stock Muggy pipe, and Fioroni clutch..) in the RC8 buggy. Not legal, but it was literally my first time ever running a buggy at all. Was way fast - and fun - did much better racing than I ever would've expected..:
http://s166.photobucket.com/albums/u...t=MOV06403.flv
12-22-2008, 10:22 PM
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RE: 21VZ-B V-Spec or NOSRAM - RS-21 RR
thanks again HerrSavage you have been a great help im going to get the nosram tomorrow and then run it in after christmas i cant wait
and great vids ill get some up after i have run it in
and great vids ill get some up after i have run it in
09-04-2009, 02:00 AM
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RE: 21VZ-B V-Spec or NOSRAM - RS-21 RR
ORIGINAL: HerrSavage
The Nosram 21RR is identical to the Jammin JPX21. You can't find much about it cuz it's totally new - like the LRP 21X.
Search for info about the JPX21 to learn about the Nosram. Except for a carb that may need to be sealed, the engine generally gets very positive reviews.
The pipe that's intended for the Nosram 21RR is the 2063.
Here's a couple short vids of me testing mine before that race I went to(and when my clutch was still half-way intact..):
http://s166.photobucket.com/albums/u...t=MOV06331.flv
http://s166.photobucket.com/albums/u...t=MOV06330.flv
I think both the Nosram and OS VSPEC are probably awesome engines. I don't believe in having to replace bearings after a gallon though, so I'm VSPEC-shy..
I also think the Nosram is too pricey - but then I'm just opposed to spending a lot on engines. Instead of getting a new Nosram I went and got a new Sportwerks 26 with closed backplate and nice new 053 pipe - for half the price of a new Nosram.
For a 21 (especially in a buggy..) I'd probably either get some SH variant or a Go.. I just don't believe in spending €250+ on any engine. That's just me though.
(I am however keeping my eye open for deals on Nosrams/LRP's/Orions.. - but I'm stubborn and cheap..)
The Nosram is definitely a powerhouse though..
The Nosram 28 is an SH engine like the previous Nosram 21 Evo. It's basically an LRP Spec 3. Nosram is owned by LRP so their engines are always the same, just a different color.
ps Just for shxts and giggles, on the weekend I ran the Nosram in the RC8T, I also ran the Mach(stock Muggy pipe, and Fioroni clutch..) in the RC8 buggy. Not legal, but it was literally my first time ever running a buggy at all. Was way fast - and fun - did much better racing than I ever would've expected..:
http://s166.photobucket.com/albums/u...t=MOV06403.flv
The Nosram 21RR is identical to the Jammin JPX21. You can't find much about it cuz it's totally new - like the LRP 21X.
Search for info about the JPX21 to learn about the Nosram. Except for a carb that may need to be sealed, the engine generally gets very positive reviews.
The pipe that's intended for the Nosram 21RR is the 2063.
Here's a couple short vids of me testing mine before that race I went to(and when my clutch was still half-way intact..
):http://s166.photobucket.com/albums/u...t=MOV06331.flv
http://s166.photobucket.com/albums/u...t=MOV06330.flv
I think both the Nosram and OS VSPEC are probably awesome engines. I don't believe in having to replace bearings after a gallon though, so I'm VSPEC-shy..
I also think the Nosram is too pricey - but then I'm just opposed to spending a lot on engines. Instead of getting a new Nosram I went and got a new Sportwerks 26 with closed backplate and nice new 053 pipe - for half the price of a new Nosram.
For a 21 (especially in a buggy..) I'd probably either get some SH variant or a Go.. I just don't believe in spending €250+ on any engine. That's just me though.
(I am however keeping my eye open for deals on Nosrams/LRP's/Orions.. - but I'm stubborn and cheap..)
The Nosram is definitely a powerhouse though..
The Nosram 28 is an SH engine like the previous Nosram 21 Evo. It's basically an LRP Spec 3. Nosram is owned by LRP so their engines are always the same, just a different color.
ps Just for shxts and giggles, on the weekend I ran the Nosram in the RC8T, I also ran the Mach(stock Muggy pipe, and Fioroni clutch..) in the RC8 buggy. Not legal, but it was literally my first time ever running a buggy at all. Was way fast - and fun - did much better racing than I ever would've expected..:
http://s166.photobucket.com/albums/u...t=MOV06403.flv
What pipe and header do you use?
Cheers
09-06-2009, 04:29 AM
#19
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RE: 21VZ-B V-Spec or NOSRAM - RS-21 RR
On the Nosram?? Nosram 2063...
A lot of people like a JP-4 or an 086 on these 21 Picco turbos... I tried an 086, but found it harder to tune and overall not as impressive in the right places as with the 2063..
If I were in the market for a new truggy/buggy pipe, I'd get a JP-4... They apparently bring out the power in everything..
EDIT - If you're asking about the Mach 427 in the buggy, it's a bone stock pipe and header from a Losi Muggy.. Pretty sure it's the same pipe as on all the Losi RTR's... EXCELLENT, very underrated pipe..
A lot of people like a JP-4 or an 086 on these 21 Picco turbos... I tried an 086, but found it harder to tune and overall not as impressive in the right places as with the 2063..
If I were in the market for a new truggy/buggy pipe, I'd get a JP-4... They apparently bring out the power in everything..
EDIT - If you're asking about the Mach 427 in the buggy, it's a bone stock pipe and header from a Losi Muggy.. Pretty sure it's the same pipe as on all the Losi RTR's... EXCELLENT, very underrated pipe..
09-06-2009, 05:21 AM
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RE: 21VZ-B V-Spec or NOSRAM - RS-21 RR
Thanks
Yes, I ment the Nosram engine.
If the 086 is not 100% perfect, I could try my 053, that should give more bottom than top.
Yes, I ment the Nosram engine.
If the 086 is not 100% perfect, I could try my 053, that should give more bottom than top.
09-06-2009, 05:22 AM
#21
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RE: 21VZ-B V-Spec or NOSRAM - RS-21 RR
A lot of guys say the 086 IS perfect for the Piccos.. I just didn't see much out of it.. To be fair, I didn't put enough effort into retuning it though..
These Piccos already have brutal low-ends..
These sponsored guys running the Nosrams were having to detune them in order to be able to keep them under control..
These Piccos already have brutal low-ends..
These sponsored guys running the Nosrams were having to detune them in order to be able to keep them under control..
09-07-2009, 08:03 AM
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RE: 21VZ-B V-Spec or NOSRAM - RS-21 RR
Just to throw my 2 bits in to this:
I've just finished the break-in of my Jammin' JPX .21 that I had modded by 'supertib'. I also have the OS VZB V-spec's (blue head & black head) and I can honestly tell you...at this point of the engine's life, this modded JPX is already showing a much better performance range.
I was informed that this engine won't even begin to properly sing until about 1.5 to 2 gallons have run through it. I'm at half a gallon now and I've got a feeling this thing's going to be a monster.
I've also taken all three engines completely apart. As far as build quality, I can tell you I prefer the OS's at this time. And yes, the reason I took the OS's apart were to replace the bearings in both, and piston and piston sleeve in the 'black' head. The reason for taking the JPX apart at this early stage....it sucked sand last weekend[:@]. Fortunately I caught it very early and there doesn't appear to be any damage.
For the money....well;
O.S. 21VZ-B V-Spec Pro Modified Off-Road Competition Buggy Engine - $400.00 from Amain + shipping
O.S. Speed .21 VZ-B V-Spec II 08/09 Worlds Edition Competition Buggy Engine - $530.00 from Amain + shipping
OFNA Jammin JPX.21 Plus Off Road Competition Buggy Engine (Turbo Plug) $230.00 from Amain + shipping + modding chargers (usually about $100.00)
With the modded Jammin, you're still coming in $70.00 under a stock OS Engine.
One draw back.....finding flipping PICCO turbo plugs. NO ONE seems to carry these things. Usually have to search Far East LHS web sites or Ebay for them.
Good luck
I've just finished the break-in of my Jammin' JPX .21 that I had modded by 'supertib'. I also have the OS VZB V-spec's (blue head & black head) and I can honestly tell you...at this point of the engine's life, this modded JPX is already showing a much better performance range.
I was informed that this engine won't even begin to properly sing until about 1.5 to 2 gallons have run through it. I'm at half a gallon now and I've got a feeling this thing's going to be a monster.
I've also taken all three engines completely apart. As far as build quality, I can tell you I prefer the OS's at this time. And yes, the reason I took the OS's apart were to replace the bearings in both, and piston and piston sleeve in the 'black' head. The reason for taking the JPX apart at this early stage....it sucked sand last weekend[:@]. Fortunately I caught it very early and there doesn't appear to be any damage.
For the money....well;
O.S. 21VZ-B V-Spec Pro Modified Off-Road Competition Buggy Engine - $400.00 from Amain + shipping
O.S. Speed .21 VZ-B V-Spec II 08/09 Worlds Edition Competition Buggy Engine - $530.00 from Amain + shipping
OFNA Jammin JPX.21 Plus Off Road Competition Buggy Engine (Turbo Plug) $230.00 from Amain + shipping + modding chargers (usually about $100.00)
With the modded Jammin, you're still coming in $70.00 under a stock OS Engine.
One draw back.....finding flipping PICCO turbo plugs. NO ONE seems to carry these things. Usually have to search Far East LHS web sites or Ebay for them.
Good luck
09-07-2009, 10:06 AM
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RE: 21VZ-B V-Spec or NOSRAM - RS-21 RR
ORIGINAL: HerrSavage
Sirio and LRP turbo plugs seem to work fine...
Sirio and LRP turbo plugs seem to work fine...
I wont recommend them,....i run ONLY picco/ofna plugs in my JPX's....they last FOREVER it seems and im replacing them for the fact they have unknown time on them as i forgot when i put a new one in.....you just have to know where to shop to find the picco plugs....any one can PM me for that info...i wont be putting it out there tho sorry.
09-07-2009, 12:35 PM
#25
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RE: 21VZ-B V-Spec or NOSRAM - RS-21 RR
I thought Sirio and LRP are in the same "taper family" of turbo plugs as the Piccos - the one that OS is NOT in, etc.. Still, I see well experienced and succesful racers here running P3's in their Orions and co..
The LRP 21X and Nosram 21RR are both Jammin JPX/Picco Evo 2 clones, and both companies sell turbo plugs for those engines.. So if the engines are Piccos, the plugs might be too.. I don't know.. I do know though my Nosram runs very consistently with the Sirio plug, so I'm not bothered - or willing or concerned enough to order a few plugs from god knows where..
The LRP 21X and Nosram 21RR are both Jammin JPX/Picco Evo 2 clones, and both companies sell turbo plugs for those engines.. So if the engines are Piccos, the plugs might be too.. I don't know.. I do know though my Nosram runs very consistently with the Sirio plug, so I'm not bothered - or willing or concerned enough to order a few plugs from god knows where..
