SSC and Open B
10-04-2005, 03:00 PM
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SSC and Open B
Being a newbe to combat, I have noticed that most of the competitions here in the South tend to relegate Open B to the back burner. Why is this? Of the contest I have witnessed, Open B seemed far more exciting than the SSC competitions. And, it seems that SSC has far more restrictions than Open B. These may be dumb questions, but I will plead rookie ignorance.
10-04-2005, 05:44 PM
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RE: SSC and Open B
MarineDad,
Since I live in the Southeast and attend almost all the contests in the SE I can give you some of the answers you are looking for.
First, let me point out that SSC has been the most flown event not only in the SE but in the US during both 2004 & 2005. So it is not a localized phenomena, and the good thing for you is that Atlanta has had the most combat events annually in the last two years than any other area of the country.
Now onto the reasons:
1. CDs control what is flown, they choose events that will be most well attended.
2. There are more SSC fliers in the South than there are Open B.
3. Open B contests once held in Nashville, Orlando, Melbourne, Sharps, and West Palm are no longer held.
4. Former Open B fliers have "crossed over" and only fly one class.
5. One day contests, to attract out of town fliers, are now 8 rounds and it is almost impossible to run two classes during one day.
6. New clubs that are developing interest in combat are starting with SSC. The examples of this are Tuscaloosa, Jackson (TN), and Vicksburg (Ms).
7. SSC has been heavily promoted in the SE.
The speed of Open B is certainly a bigger adrenaline rush, but the number of cuts in SSC is higher than it is in Open B. This isn't a made up number or slanting of the facts. It is simply reporting the numbers as listed on the RC Combat Association web site (www.rccombat.com). So, for pilots, if the fun in combat is cuts, then SSC has more cuts.
I think all combat is good. I just wish we could generate some interest in Scale Combat down here in the deep south.
Since I live in the Southeast and attend almost all the contests in the SE I can give you some of the answers you are looking for.
First, let me point out that SSC has been the most flown event not only in the SE but in the US during both 2004 & 2005. So it is not a localized phenomena, and the good thing for you is that Atlanta has had the most combat events annually in the last two years than any other area of the country.
Now onto the reasons:
1. CDs control what is flown, they choose events that will be most well attended.
2. There are more SSC fliers in the South than there are Open B.
3. Open B contests once held in Nashville, Orlando, Melbourne, Sharps, and West Palm are no longer held.
4. Former Open B fliers have "crossed over" and only fly one class.
5. One day contests, to attract out of town fliers, are now 8 rounds and it is almost impossible to run two classes during one day.
6. New clubs that are developing interest in combat are starting with SSC. The examples of this are Tuscaloosa, Jackson (TN), and Vicksburg (Ms).
7. SSC has been heavily promoted in the SE.
The speed of Open B is certainly a bigger adrenaline rush, but the number of cuts in SSC is higher than it is in Open B. This isn't a made up number or slanting of the facts. It is simply reporting the numbers as listed on the RC Combat Association web site (www.rccombat.com). So, for pilots, if the fun in combat is cuts, then SSC has more cuts.
I think all combat is good. I just wish we could generate some interest in Scale Combat down here in the deep south.
10-04-2005, 07:13 PM
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RE: SSC and Open B
MarineDad,
I hope I can ask this without offending you but I probably will.....how can you, in one thread offer up such sage sounding advice on covering a wing with rip-stop nylon and in this thread ask this question about SSC vs Open B? You can plead "rookie ignorance" but what is the real question you are asking?
Once again, sorry if I offend, but anyone can register with any name and troll for trouble. Your 3 posts have trolled me in.
My class of choice is SSC. I'm from the north, an old geezer whose reaction time is slowing down but I still can get a cut or 2 in SSC and still fly Open B as well, adrenaline is my drug of choice.
rrh
I hope I can ask this without offending you but I probably will.....how can you, in one thread offer up such sage sounding advice on covering a wing with rip-stop nylon and in this thread ask this question about SSC vs Open B? You can plead "rookie ignorance" but what is the real question you are asking?
Once again, sorry if I offend, but anyone can register with any name and troll for trouble. Your 3 posts have trolled me in.
My class of choice is SSC. I'm from the north, an old geezer whose reaction time is slowing down but I still can get a cut or 2 in SSC and still fly Open B as well, adrenaline is my drug of choice.
rrh
10-04-2005, 11:11 PM
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RE: SSC and Open B
Randy:
My post about rip stop nylon was based on the fact that I just finished covering a wing in that manner. I am new to combat, and in fact new to rc flying. My flying history as a preteen and teenager was limited to building gullows kits and some of sig's control line. I got into RC this year (I am now 43) because my wife bought me a Great Planes p-51 kit (still havn't finished it yet). During the course of my training instruction I was introduced to combat. Since I had a 25 engine, I got an Open B airplane, and covered the wing with rip stop, using directions from some of the combat pilots at my field. I simply posted just what I learned.
My question about Open B vs SSC is based on the contests I have seen in my area in the past few months. More attention is being placed on SSC than Open B. In fact, some combat competitions are limited to SSC only. One contest I traveled to, I had intended on competing for the first time in Open B, but couldn't because it was relegated to the second day, when I had to travel back home.
So I guess I am asking if there is really a shift by the pilots to SSC, or are pilots having to shift to SSC? I'm not an accountant, but I did take a statistics course in college, and it seems to me if you only hold SSC competitions, you get more statistics for SSC than Open B. Kind of like a third world dictator winning an election because he is the only one on the ballot.
My post about rip stop nylon was based on the fact that I just finished covering a wing in that manner. I am new to combat, and in fact new to rc flying. My flying history as a preteen and teenager was limited to building gullows kits and some of sig's control line. I got into RC this year (I am now 43) because my wife bought me a Great Planes p-51 kit (still havn't finished it yet). During the course of my training instruction I was introduced to combat. Since I had a 25 engine, I got an Open B airplane, and covered the wing with rip stop, using directions from some of the combat pilots at my field. I simply posted just what I learned.
My question about Open B vs SSC is based on the contests I have seen in my area in the past few months. More attention is being placed on SSC than Open B. In fact, some combat competitions are limited to SSC only. One contest I traveled to, I had intended on competing for the first time in Open B, but couldn't because it was relegated to the second day, when I had to travel back home.
So I guess I am asking if there is really a shift by the pilots to SSC, or are pilots having to shift to SSC? I'm not an accountant, but I did take a statistics course in college, and it seems to me if you only hold SSC competitions, you get more statistics for SSC than Open B. Kind of like a third world dictator winning an election because he is the only one on the ballot.
10-05-2005, 06:44 AM
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RE: SSC and Open B
MarineDad,
Year to date in the SE there have been nine combat contests: four in Atlanta, two in Tuscaloosa, one in Nashville, and two in Jacksonville. The breakdown of events is:
- 8 SSC
- 3 Open B
- 1 Scale 2548
By thhe end of 2005 there will have been 11 SSC contests, and four Open B events.
Only one of the contest organizers noted above is an Open B flier. The other CDs or organizers fly SSC only.
If there were more Open B CDs there would be more Open B contests. I don't think you can blame a CD who only flies SSC for holding an SSC only contest. Two of the three Open B contests were in Jacksonville but the Open B turnout was so low in both events that the organizer is now questioning tying up his club field for contests that only draw 8 or less participants. His problem is that he wants to hold Open B events but is not getting enough Open B flier support.
The secret to growing any class of combat is to have contests. For Open B to grow more of the Open B fliers need to organize and hold contests. They also need to attend the contests that are held so they don't lose the ones they already have. Neither of these things has been done in the SE for the last couple of year. The driving forces of combat contests: Don Pruitt, Eddie Fulmer, Michael DeWoody, Patrick Lanfri, and I fly SSC (Patrick also flies Open B). So the contests we have held are for SSC which is the event we both fly and promote.
Let me ask you a question. Why should a Contest Director, Event Organizer/Promoter, be required to host events that he does not fly? Isn't it up to the folks who want contest for a certain class responsibility to plan and organize them?
Year to date in the SE there have been nine combat contests: four in Atlanta, two in Tuscaloosa, one in Nashville, and two in Jacksonville. The breakdown of events is:
- 8 SSC
- 3 Open B
- 1 Scale 2548
By thhe end of 2005 there will have been 11 SSC contests, and four Open B events.
Only one of the contest organizers noted above is an Open B flier. The other CDs or organizers fly SSC only.
If there were more Open B CDs there would be more Open B contests. I don't think you can blame a CD who only flies SSC for holding an SSC only contest. Two of the three Open B contests were in Jacksonville but the Open B turnout was so low in both events that the organizer is now questioning tying up his club field for contests that only draw 8 or less participants. His problem is that he wants to hold Open B events but is not getting enough Open B flier support.
The secret to growing any class of combat is to have contests. For Open B to grow more of the Open B fliers need to organize and hold contests. They also need to attend the contests that are held so they don't lose the ones they already have. Neither of these things has been done in the SE for the last couple of year. The driving forces of combat contests: Don Pruitt, Eddie Fulmer, Michael DeWoody, Patrick Lanfri, and I fly SSC (Patrick also flies Open B). So the contests we have held are for SSC which is the event we both fly and promote.
Let me ask you a question. Why should a Contest Director, Event Organizer/Promoter, be required to host events that he does not fly? Isn't it up to the folks who want contest for a certain class responsibility to plan and organize them?
10-05-2005, 08:05 AM
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RE: SSC and Open B
Lou, you just answered my question. From what you said, there are more CDs for SSC than there are for Open B, so I guess the latter part of my statement on pilots shifting is true.
10-05-2005, 08:49 AM
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RE: SSC and Open B
Over time, SSC has shown itself to be less stressful and with the current competitive SSC planes, easier to fly and maintain. It's cheaper to get in to, and cheaper to fly on a regular basis. I'll do practice combat with streamers with my SSC planes, but not with my B ships (and you can forget about anything close to practice with scale planes).
And while SSC planes are slower, the action tends to be low and close in and rather tightly flown, making for some very intense flying.
As Lou pointed out, the scores are higher in SSC. I'm honestly not sure if anyone flys SSC just for the higher scores though.
SSC planes also generally survive better than B planes in mid-airs and dirt naps. While nothing stops a propeller from tearing things up (most SSC planes I've seen written off have been due prop cuts), SSC planes usually take less damage from wing taps and ground impacts. (there was a lot of hype early on about SSC and how "surviveable" the planes were or weren't. Things have settled down, and while SSC pretty much proved you can't have indestructable combat as long as you have props, the planes do live longer on average when designed well)
That's not to say there isn't still a lot of interest in B class, and these things do tend to go in cycles.
And while SSC planes are slower, the action tends to be low and close in and rather tightly flown, making for some very intense flying.
As Lou pointed out, the scores are higher in SSC. I'm honestly not sure if anyone flys SSC just for the higher scores though.
SSC planes also generally survive better than B planes in mid-airs and dirt naps. While nothing stops a propeller from tearing things up (most SSC planes I've seen written off have been due prop cuts), SSC planes usually take less damage from wing taps and ground impacts. (there was a lot of hype early on about SSC and how "surviveable" the planes were or weren't. Things have settled down, and while SSC pretty much proved you can't have indestructable combat as long as you have props, the planes do live longer on average when designed well)
That's not to say there isn't still a lot of interest in B class, and these things do tend to go in cycles.
10-05-2005, 09:30 AM
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RE: SSC and Open B
In Holland (Europe), we fly 1/12 scale planes, and beside the adrenaline, a lot of discussion is going on about the high mortality rate of the planes. Nobody here likes to fly combat with ugly planes.
Building sloppy scale is no fun, but building nice looking planes is very contra-productive. Many pilots loose interest because of the number of mid-airs, and subsequent repairs that are needed, so the number of drop-outs after initial high enthousiasm is quite substantial.
We organize events for the fun of it, and competition is fierce. We are watching USA trends, and the lower speed SSC or 1/8 WW1 seems the answer, because we are reluctant to let go of the scale part.
A dish should not only tate well, It should look well too. Because of that, the spectators just love our competitions and the action that comes with it.
We are weary of the USA trend, that SSC will eventually kill 1/12 scale, which would mean the end of this beautiful and exciting game.
Building sloppy scale is no fun, but building nice looking planes is very contra-productive. Many pilots loose interest because of the number of mid-airs, and subsequent repairs that are needed, so the number of drop-outs after initial high enthousiasm is quite substantial.
We organize events for the fun of it, and competition is fierce. We are watching USA trends, and the lower speed SSC or 1/8 WW1 seems the answer, because we are reluctant to let go of the scale part.
A dish should not only tate well, It should look well too. Because of that, the spectators just love our competitions and the action that comes with it.
We are weary of the USA trend, that SSC will eventually kill 1/12 scale, which would mean the end of this beautiful and exciting game.
10-05-2005, 09:47 AM
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RE: SSC and Open B
Mr. Reivers,
Since the advent of the "Open" classes the participation in "scale" combat has been steadily declining. I think the two are related. In my area of the US there are only a couple of participants in scale combat. The time to build, lack of suitable kits, and the high loss rate of the scale planes all combine to relegate it to the back burner.
MarineDad,
There is an Atlanta SSC contest on October 22nd. I will give you two planes, ready to fly, a computer transmitter, fuel and pit the planes for you for this contest. If they get broken, such is life in combat, no harm no foul. All you have to do is come to the contest and fly, I will take care of all the details for you. The planes are competition grade Georgia Gorillas that have flown at the US Nationals and at other contests since. Both are in top competitive condition and the engines run very well. I will start them, needle them, and launch them for you to try out a combat contest.
Since the advent of the "Open" classes the participation in "scale" combat has been steadily declining. I think the two are related. In my area of the US there are only a couple of participants in scale combat. The time to build, lack of suitable kits, and the high loss rate of the scale planes all combine to relegate it to the back burner.
MarineDad,
There is an Atlanta SSC contest on October 22nd. I will give you two planes, ready to fly, a computer transmitter, fuel and pit the planes for you for this contest. If they get broken, such is life in combat, no harm no foul. All you have to do is come to the contest and fly, I will take care of all the details for you. The planes are competition grade Georgia Gorillas that have flown at the US Nationals and at other contests since. Both are in top competitive condition and the engines run very well. I will start them, needle them, and launch them for you to try out a combat contest.
10-06-2005, 06:34 AM
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RE: SSC and Open B
You just cant beat a deal like that! Ive been flying open B this my rookie year in combat. So far 10-12 rounds flown a couple mid airs and no unrepairable damage. I think i would prefer to run Open and Limited B if given the choice. One plane to build, one engine to stock. I like the sound of that. I am building an SSC ship this weekend to give it a try but im having trouble getting excited about them at the moment. I guess we will need to get our own CD here in the future so we can be more flexable. Currntly we have been flying open B and C. I like it fast, but i also see the down side of open planes and the rebuilding time. Guess i wont Knock it till i fly it.
10-06-2005, 09:13 AM
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RE: SSC and Open B
Well, if you really want to go fast, get in to 2610 
.
fwiw, my 2610 gear lasts longer than my SSC stuff, and a lot longer than my B gear. The impacts are a lot harder in 2610 scale, but the speeds are so fast that the furball doesn't form up nearly as tight, and it's much more persute flying, so mid-airs are a lot less common. Of course, I'm not flying wood planes either.
. fwiw, my 2610 gear lasts longer than my SSC stuff, and a lot longer than my B gear. The impacts are a lot harder in 2610 scale, but the speeds are so fast that the furball doesn't form up nearly as tight, and it's much more persute flying, so mid-airs are a lot less common. Of course, I'm not flying wood planes either.
10-06-2005, 12:18 PM
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RE: SSC and Open B
Those last two post bring up an interesting point of view, and an observation that I made this past weekend. I can't downplay the number of midairs that I saw in either competition at Gateway. But, I did notice more repairs taking place during the SSC competition than the Open B. To be fair, a few pilots were switching planes in the Open B, but there was just as many switching in SSC. Is there a substantial difference in the survivability rate between SSC and Open B?
Lou, I will check with the boss about that Saturday.
Lou, I will check with the boss about that Saturday.
10-06-2005, 02:34 PM
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RE: SSC and Open B
Bruce,
I think you will get different answers from different folks. This year I've flown 46 rounds of combat without losing a plane. SSC has a lot more bumping because we fly closer in, in a tighter airspace. I think the lower speeds result in lesser amounts of damage. Again, other's results will vary. I do know I don't ever want to go back to the carnage I had to build through several years ago.
At Jacksonville I lost a coroplast stab when someone flew right through it. I set the plane aside instead of taking the time to bolt on a new stab.
At Tuscaloosa and Bon Aqua I flew the same single plane all day. Some of it is the lower speed, some of it is me being a little bit more wary of barreling through the fur ball to get a cut and some of it is the other pilots are now concentrating on staying up the entire five minutes instead of going for a cut when there is a chance of getting knocked out of the match.
You have to be in the air to get cuts so I think a lot more pilots are flying a strategy of pursuit rather than fur ball combat.
I do have the actual counts of airplanes launched and airplanes landed at the Nats this year in SSC and Open B. That is really not a very good indicator of damage as many planes were dumb thumbed in, others ran out of fuel and still others failed on their own. You would need to record a contest then go back and count the mid-airs and rate the damage in each one to get accurate data. For me, flying 46 rounds of combat with the same planes is a good enough indicator that SSC is now finally reaching the "survivable" goals we set three years ago.
I think you will get different answers from different folks. This year I've flown 46 rounds of combat without losing a plane. SSC has a lot more bumping because we fly closer in, in a tighter airspace. I think the lower speeds result in lesser amounts of damage. Again, other's results will vary. I do know I don't ever want to go back to the carnage I had to build through several years ago.
At Jacksonville I lost a coroplast stab when someone flew right through it. I set the plane aside instead of taking the time to bolt on a new stab.
At Tuscaloosa and Bon Aqua I flew the same single plane all day. Some of it is the lower speed, some of it is me being a little bit more wary of barreling through the fur ball to get a cut and some of it is the other pilots are now concentrating on staying up the entire five minutes instead of going for a cut when there is a chance of getting knocked out of the match.
You have to be in the air to get cuts so I think a lot more pilots are flying a strategy of pursuit rather than fur ball combat.
I do have the actual counts of airplanes launched and airplanes landed at the Nats this year in SSC and Open B. That is really not a very good indicator of damage as many planes were dumb thumbed in, others ran out of fuel and still others failed on their own. You would need to record a contest then go back and count the mid-airs and rate the damage in each one to get accurate data. For me, flying 46 rounds of combat with the same planes is a good enough indicator that SSC is now finally reaching the "survivable" goals we set three years ago.
10-06-2005, 03:03 PM
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RE: SSC and Open B
In my experience (and I tracked mid-air rate, but not amount of damage), I mid-air a lot more often in SSC. However, my SSC wings keep coming back for more, I don't think I have a single SSC wing that hasn't been repaired at least once, and most have been done several times. So you'll run in to guys more often in SSC, which makes for more repairing, but the damage is usually less, making for quicker, cheaper repairs.
Guessing based on feel, most of the time, I can field repair an SSC wing, while most B wings have to go back to the shop, and I tend to have to actually fly more B planes at a contest.
Just the other weekend, for example, we did 5 rounds of B and 5 of SSC. I took 3 planes ready to go with no spare wings in both classes. In B class, I flew everything, and actaully had to take a wing from one plane and put it on another's fuse to make all 5 rounds. Of course, some of that was just bad luck. But in SSC, I flew the same wing and fuse the whole day. I had twice the mid-airs and crashes in SSC, but only the last round had anything bad enough to put aside the wing. (If there had been a 6th round, I'd have gone to a backup plane).
YMMV of course
Guessing based on feel, most of the time, I can field repair an SSC wing, while most B wings have to go back to the shop, and I tend to have to actually fly more B planes at a contest.
Just the other weekend, for example, we did 5 rounds of B and 5 of SSC. I took 3 planes ready to go with no spare wings in both classes. In B class, I flew everything, and actaully had to take a wing from one plane and put it on another's fuse to make all 5 rounds. Of course, some of that was just bad luck. But in SSC, I flew the same wing and fuse the whole day. I had twice the mid-airs and crashes in SSC, but only the last round had anything bad enough to put aside the wing. (If there had been a 6th round, I'd have gone to a backup plane).
YMMV of course
10-06-2005, 03:24 PM
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RE: SSC and Open B
It's also worth noting that your plane design has a LOT to do with it. Guys who fly Cobras and Falcons usually need to have more planes on hand than guys flying more conventional planes. That's why I'vee always flown conventional planes, and I think it's part of why Lou's seeing less damage.
I'm also convinced that there are basically 3 stages of pilot ability. (though it's a gradual thing, going from one group to the next)
1) newbie - Usually don't have a lot of mid-airs, or a lot of cuts either. Mainly because they struggle to get near other planes. Most of their mid-airs come from planes they never see, or when another pilot picks up on them and closes in. If left alone, they often spend most of the combat match up to high or out too far or in too close to make a cut or run in to anyone.
2) veteran - These are the guys who tear up a ton of aircraft. Good enough pilots to score a lot of cuts, because they know how to find the dept, target another plane, and get in close when they want to. While they can see their plane and their target, they often get creamed by a 3rd plane, and just as often run right in to their target. Many of them are prone to taking head-on or low percentage/high risk attacks because they often fly the shortest distance to their target.
3) ace - After flying for a while, you start to realize that your mid-air rate starts going down again, and the scores go up even more, and are more consistant. At this point, not only do you see your target, you know what he's doing, and can go around someone approaching head-on and get in behind them. You can often see and avoid more aircraft at the same time, so it becomes possible to fly, track a target, and dodge around other airplanes in the way with out loosing your target. You plan farther ahead, and your timing is much better. Not all pilots will reach this level, and guys who get stuck in the 2nd group often get tired of the constant rebuilding and repair they suffer.
I'm also convinced that there are basically 3 stages of pilot ability. (though it's a gradual thing, going from one group to the next)
1) newbie - Usually don't have a lot of mid-airs, or a lot of cuts either. Mainly because they struggle to get near other planes. Most of their mid-airs come from planes they never see, or when another pilot picks up on them and closes in. If left alone, they often spend most of the combat match up to high or out too far or in too close to make a cut or run in to anyone.
2) veteran - These are the guys who tear up a ton of aircraft. Good enough pilots to score a lot of cuts, because they know how to find the dept, target another plane, and get in close when they want to. While they can see their plane and their target, they often get creamed by a 3rd plane, and just as often run right in to their target. Many of them are prone to taking head-on or low percentage/high risk attacks because they often fly the shortest distance to their target.
3) ace - After flying for a while, you start to realize that your mid-air rate starts going down again, and the scores go up even more, and are more consistant. At this point, not only do you see your target, you know what he's doing, and can go around someone approaching head-on and get in behind them. You can often see and avoid more aircraft at the same time, so it becomes possible to fly, track a target, and dodge around other airplanes in the way with out loosing your target. You plan farther ahead, and your timing is much better. Not all pilots will reach this level, and guys who get stuck in the 2nd group often get tired of the constant rebuilding and repair they suffer.
10-06-2005, 07:47 PM
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RE: SSC and Open B
Kirk,
Excellent analysis. I am trying to move from veteran to ace (will never get the number of cuts you guys do), and managing to get there. You're also right about flying wings versus fuse planes. This year's planes are lasting much better than last year when I was flying wings.
Excellent analysis. I am trying to move from veteran to ace (will never get the number of cuts you guys do), and managing to get there. You're also right about flying wings versus fuse planes. This year's planes are lasting much better than last year when I was flying wings.
10-10-2005, 07:02 AM
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RE: SSC and Open B
I just finished my sscavenger over the weekend and started flying it. Pretty heavy winds all weekend but it handeled it very well. A lot slower than my b-plane. If things go well i will put it in harms way this weekend. See if i can get 8-10 rounds in with one plane.
10-11-2005, 09:17 AM
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RE: SSC and Open B
Hot Wheels, i did a lot of light tuning on Brian's ssvAVENGERS and found that they handled/flew/turned best when set up slightly different from his Open B AVENGERS. The B ships flew fantastic when set up exactly like the instructions- balance point on the TEAM-recommended spot, with the specified 2-turns-up-from-neutral aileron reflex. For the sscAVENGERS, I found the turning was tighter with the balance point at the max-rearward-recommended point, and the ailerons only 1 turn up from neutral. with this setup you will get a pitch-down when you chop the throttle, be ready for it if you go low and slow!! But this setup seemed to turn tighter and I thought it was worth the tradeoff. Also you must be VERY careful with the fuel tank mounting to avoid foaming, the little .15s really buzz and you will get foaming which will lead to reduced power. I would NOT use velcro or 2-sded tape to mount the tank, when I did I got way too much foaming. I ended up using a layer of foam between the tank and fuse, and held the tank on with a VERY loose wrapping of tape (velcro strip would work too). i also suggest you balance your prop. good luck!
10-11-2005, 12:07 PM
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RE: SSC and Open B
Thanks for the info Scott! I have been having exactly that foaming problem with the ssc plane and my open c plane. I moved the cg back a little more sunday and flew it, seems to work real well now. Im thinking about making a template for setup that gives me the exact same aleron setup on each new wing, I get those guages with most of the other planes ive built and it just makes setup easier for me. I need to start keeping a log of all the setups as well...
You using the anit-flutter tape seal on the ssc planes or is it not worth the effort on the slower planes?
You using the anit-flutter tape seal on the ssc planes or is it not worth the effort on the slower planes?
10-11-2005, 02:28 PM
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RE: SSC and Open B
To rid yourself of foaming fuel, try using Armour-All in your fuel. 2 squirts into a full gallon is usually enough to eliminate aeration issues, but sometimes it takes up to 4 squirts per gallon. Shake the fuel jug vigorously after puting it in. Almost no bubbles forming means you have enough Armour-All in it.
Don't buy in to the 'old wive's tale' about the silicone in Armour-All leaving deposits on the glow plug filiment. Some of my plugs lasted for over a year and none ever had any signs of deposits on them.
D
Don't buy in to the 'old wive's tale' about the silicone in Armour-All leaving deposits on the glow plug filiment. Some of my plugs lasted for over a year and none ever had any signs of deposits on them.
D
10-11-2005, 03:27 PM
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RE: SSC and Open B
I had heard something about that working, wd-40 is what was recomended but it did not work well. That could be why if they recomended the wrong substance...
10-11-2005, 07:09 PM
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RE: SSC and Open B
Hot Wheels,
Scott's advice is very good. He has good luck with his engines. I have used Demon's method with .25s successfully but haven't tried it with .15s. Chris Quinn also has good luck running plastic clunk tanks, but he uses a rectangular tank that has slanted sides to the top.
The biggest problems with the OS .LA .15s are leaking backplates and fuel starvation. After watching the success the Texas guys were having I decided to use their system of pressure bladders.
The complete article on how to make them and where to get the parts and pieces is here: http://www.georgiacombat.com/PressureBladders.html
Here's what one looks like.
There is also a good article on setting up the OS LA .15 here: http://www.georgiacombat.com/OS15EngineSetUp.htm
Scott's advice is very good. He has good luck with his engines. I have used Demon's method with .25s successfully but haven't tried it with .15s. Chris Quinn also has good luck running plastic clunk tanks, but he uses a rectangular tank that has slanted sides to the top.
The biggest problems with the OS .LA .15s are leaking backplates and fuel starvation. After watching the success the Texas guys were having I decided to use their system of pressure bladders.
The complete article on how to make them and where to get the parts and pieces is here: http://www.georgiacombat.com/PressureBladders.html
Here's what one looks like.
There is also a good article on setting up the OS LA .15 here: http://www.georgiacombat.com/OS15EngineSetUp.htm
10-11-2005, 11:37 PM
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RE: SSC and Open B
I've been running Mag .15's, and a hayes 3oz tank with no foaming problems at all. Of course my fuses aren't profile.
Bladder systems like Lou mentions can work, but it takes a while to get used to them, and they aren't necessary.
Bladder systems like Lou mentions can work, but it takes a while to get used to them, and they aren't necessary.
10-12-2005, 08:10 AM
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RE: SSC and Open B
Im trying to stay away from the bladder tanks right now. I dont like cutting a spot in the wing to house them.. May try one inside a fence post for thrills....
Read a couple times to use teflon tape on the plastic back plate on the la 15. not really sure how to make that work, wrap the plug and install or just try to make a surface gasket for the flange with the tape?
Read a couple times to use teflon tape on the plastic back plate on the la 15. not really sure how to make that work, wrap the plug and install or just try to make a surface gasket for the flange with the tape?
10-12-2005, 08:33 AM
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RE: SSC and Open B
Hot Wheels,
The folks using teflon tape wrap it around the plastic backplate for a friction fit with the case. A more certain fix is to purchase an OS FP .15 aluminum backplate to replace the plastic one that comes with the engine.
Kirk,
Having used both a tank and a bladder I feel it is no more difficult to use one over the other. You are right that it is not necessary but it removes so many variables from the engine run that for me it is worth it.
The folks using teflon tape wrap it around the plastic backplate for a friction fit with the case. A more certain fix is to purchase an OS FP .15 aluminum backplate to replace the plastic one that comes with the engine.
Kirk,
Having used both a tank and a bladder I feel it is no more difficult to use one over the other. You are right that it is not necessary but it removes so many variables from the engine run that for me it is worth it.