-Eric01-

How long are the Durga dampers? Should I buy better ones from RC Mart? They are quite cheap there and I have to order some other things too...

malice23

Thanks for the feedback regarding the one way. Very helpful. I've also read that the TRF aeration dampers are too long for the durga and that they need limiters to fit properly. Is this true? also...what shock oil is the best setup for frnt/rear? I also purchased stabilizer bars for it. What combo, soft/med/ hard should I run? I'm new to the DB01 so any help is greatly appreciated.

malice23

Thanks for the feedback regarding the one way. Very helpful. I've also read that the TRF aeration dampers are too long for the durga and that they need limiters to fit properly. Is this true? also...what shock oil is the best setup for frnt/rear? I also purchased stabilizer bars for it. What combo, soft/med/ hard should I run? I'm new to the DB01 so any help is greatly appreciated.

dimblum

Yup, the TRF rear dampers are too long and will normally cause your rear uprights to break after a while [the rear wheels will rub against the uprights when the shocks are fully extended]. There are two solutions for this problem:

1. Add two o-rings along the piston shaft (inside the shock body)
2. Order the 'Atomic Carbon' rear shock tower - http://atomic-carbon.gforceimages.net/cfp.html

The Atomic Carbon rear tower has additional mounting holes for the TRF Shocks. Their front tower is pretty awesome as well.. Make sure to order the extra mounting hardware from a shop like RC Screwz if you decide to use the Atomic Carbon parts.. Atomic Carbon does not include their own mounting hardware. If you need to know the size of the screws and bolts you will need, just let me know.



Shock Oil Weight depends on the surface you will be racing on, the same goes for stabilizer bars (anti roll bars).. The basic rules are:

* Anti Roll Bars are mostly used for hard smooth surfaces only. Bumpy loose surfaces don't benefit from Anti Roll Bars too much. The smoother the surface, the harder the bar...

* Shock Oil Weight and spring tension should be lower for bumpy off-road tracks. I use soft springs and 30-35W oil for outdoor off-road. You also want to use very soft tires when racing on hard surfaces... All of these things help maintain grip..

Hope this helps.

malice23

I cant tell u how much this helps. Thank you so much. I already Ordered the 3racing shock towers so Im assuming I just have to go with the 2 O-rings. How do the o-rings hold up over time? The atomic carbon parts look awesome though. I might get them later on. I like the fact that the atomic carbon parts dont require any limiters. You get the full benefit of the shock travel. Is the performance better when using the atomic parts? and are all the holes usable without limiters on those parts?
The shock oil sounds about right, im guesing the harder 35wt goes up front. as far as springs, what combo do you use for front and rear. Harder up front and softer rear?

malice23

Also, are the rear dampers the only ones that require limiters?

dimblum

The 3Racing towers are actually pretty cool. They are not made of carbon fiber like they look, but seem to hold up very well.. The O-Rings will hold up for quite a while before you will need to change them (usually a few months). In my experience they did eventually break and required replacement, but it was never really a problem. It was easy to notice since one tire would move further down than the other while I was holding the car in the air.

The Atomic Carbon towers were first made to solve the problem with the TRF dampers and it works perfectly. You do get the benefit of additional shock travel in the rear and no need to use limiters. The 'length' problem was only with the rear shocks so the front tower serves the purpose of being 'extra' strong, looking cool, and making it easier to add and remove the shocks for maintenance. I wouldn't say that their is a performance difference besides the extra shock travel in the rear.. You will want to use some longer screws to attach the wing mounts to the Atomic Carbon tower though. The Atomic Carbon tower is so rigid that the wing mounts will take all the force from a bad landing or tumble.. The longer screws keep the mounts from pulling away from the screws.. So long as you use the kit mounts you are OK (they can absorb the shock).. If you mount an aluminum hop-up wing mount (like the one from 3Racing) then you might end up breaking the diff cover after too many bad landings because the shock mount will be too rigid. I should know since I did this a couple times. I put the plastic kit mounts back on and haven't had any trouble since.

Yup, the harder oil goes up front. I have switched from the soft (red) springs to the medium (yellow) springs for the front and back [medium yellow in the front - red in back]. To be honest it seemed better to keep the soft springs (red) all around and let the heavier oil do its work to change the damping.. That was the case for the track I run on, you may find that the stiffer springs work better... You want to find that happy medium where the car absorbs the bumps and jumps without slapping the chassis against the ground.

Hope this helps. Let me know if you have more questions.. I have tested about every part Tamiya has made for the DB-01, and its the only car I have been racing at my club track for the past year.

malice23

you've been very helpful...how about ride height...I know the basic dogbones straight rule applies for both front and rear on 4wd cars...when using the TRF dampers how much did you screw down on the front and rear. Do you just go by how level the dogbones are? I always found I got chassis slap when I set it up like that but I also got the best handling...I guess some chassis slap is unavoidable. Whats your take on the pistons? what holes have you run and what's the best combo?
Do all the holes on the atomic damper mounts work for the TRF shocks without limiters?
I thought about that wing mount problem. I ordered GPM aluminum mounts after reading how much ppl were breaking their mounts but now you're telling me that if the damper towers are stiff it'll rip off the diff covers lol. It makes sense that plastic mounts would absorb more impast though. Thats why I opted out on the aluminum front and rear bumpers too. Nothing better that a plastic bumper for impacts.
Whats your take on the blue 12degree caster blocks?
Thanks for your patience...this is very helpful for a new DB01 owner.

ElectricGuy007

After looking over my 501x Worlds Kit, I noticed I built the steering assembly incorrectly
that's why I was having steering issues before. It turns on a dime now.[>:]
Dimblum might be able to tell me how a center one way works, is it the same as a front one way?
The slipper assembly on the durga looks very close to a 501x assembly.

dimblum

I have always judged ride height by making the front and rear arms parallel to the bottom of the chassis (everything level). This seems to be one of the best settings for a good center of gravity and ample spacing for landing jumps.. Make sure all of your adjustments are done under load with the battery installed in the chassis, then lift and drop the car onto the ground for proper spring tension. Use this trick when setting wheel camber and toe in/out as well.

Your right about the chassis slap, it will always happen from time to time, but should not happen too often when you land jumps on all four wheels.

So far I have kept the stock pistons in the shocks and they seem fine.. I have not read much about making piston changes, but I might soon.

The rear Atomic Carbon tower has two sets of holes.. The upper row is for the TRF shocks and the lower row is for the kit shocks (or any aftermarket shocks that have the same piston length as the kit shocks).. I think the 3Racing shocks use kit length piston shafts, but I have always run the TRF shocks so I cannot confirm.

Yup, stick with the plastic parts for the wing mounts and bumpers. It will save a lot of aggravation.. I have seen the GPM parts and the bumpers always confused me for the same reason.. It's great to have certain aluminum parts, but not if they are going to transfer shock to a weaker plastic part...

The 12 degree caster blocks are great, so are the aluminum 501X rear uprights. These parts are better to have than the plastic kit parts. I have had a few ballstuds break free of the plastic parts in the past.. The aluminum parts have been rock solid so far and appear to solve that problem

Hope this helps.

dimblum

A one-way is not for everyone, but I sure like it. It serves to help steering control and also helps when landing a jump. It gives you the best of 4WD and 2WD control at the same time. Here is how it works: A one-way bearing replaces the standard pulley used drive the front belt. It allows the front wheels to independently 'free spin' in a forward motion -faster- than the motor can drive them. Here is one example of a one-way in action.. Let's say you are making a hard right turn; normally the outside wheel will want to turn more than the inside wheel since it has more distance to travel. Without a one-way, both front wheels will want to spin at the same rate with only a little slip from the differential.. with the one-way, the outside wheel can turn faster on the ground than the inside wheel while the motor still provides power to the wheels... It will also allow the front wheels to turn at a faster rate than the motor when you land a jump. This gives you better control after the landing and less chance of a rollover if you land off center.

One ways can be especially beneficial when you are making 'off-throttle' turns as well. The front wheels will have a lot more traction.

It sounds kind of confusing, but makes a lot of sense once it is installed and you are driving around the track.



Both the front and center one-ways serve the same function. The difference is the center one-way still allows use of the front differential, whereas the front one-way replaces the diff.

Front one-ways are meant for high grip 'on-road' tracks only -like carpet or tarmac- where transferring power between wheels is not really needed and a locked front differential is actually helpful for extra traction.

Center one-ways are meant for 'off-road' tracks where the front differential is still needed to maintain traction when the wheels slip on loose dirt.

Here is a link I found that covers one-way control in more detail (it also talks about break control etc). This should help explain it a little better: http://www.geocities.com/agusyt/OneWays.doc



The Slipper Clutch is the same for the 501/511X and the DB-01 (a few parts are interchanged between the two chassis). Tamiya designed it so that the center one-way cannot be installed without the slipper clutch. I imagine that they made this a requirement to ease any stress on the one-way bearing..

malice23

Thanks man..it is indeed very helpful. In your opinion, is it a significant difference if I choose to use the limiters on the 3Racing towers vs the atomics? Ans should I choose to run the 3racing towers, is it only 2 limiters? Just trying to make it a bit easier for me when I build it instead of constantly experimenting with limiters. However not having to use limiters is ideal and takes all the guess work out of it when using the atomics. NOT CHEAP THOUGH. 18GBP for one rear tower lol. Now for the most asked questions lol...what motor are you running? I was thinking an LRP eraser 10.5 sensored brushless setup. Im not running a mamba or anything crazy like that. I need control and am willing to sacrifice some speed. I was also looking at the 15.5 LRP also. Its going to be brushless though, I'm not running brushed motors on this thing.

Out of curiosity, how different is a durga fully upgraded when compared to a TRF501X? I know they say the suspension and steering geometry is similar as is the drive train but since you've driven both I'd like to know the difference. I also ordered the hard/medium and soft springs for both front and rear shocks as well as the belt tensioners. What tires do you find work well? Ive read on oople that the mini pins are good from schumacher. Ans lastly how successful have you been while racing the Durga?

ElectricGuy007

Thanks for the information. I have noticed the car is easier to drive with a front one way, not only that
but I have had significantly faster laps as well. Took a while to get some used to, but I'm used to it now.

dimblum

I would not say there is much of a difference if you run the shocks with limiters or not.. You are only sacrificing a tiny bit of shock travel in the rear, but it's very little. If memory serves me correct, I only had to use two limiters per rear shock.

Yeah, the Atomic Carbon towers are expensive to be sure.. I can understand their pricing since it is a very small company and carbon fiber is not cheap to work with in small quantities.

I have run 3 different Novak motors so far in the Durga. The Novak 17.5, a 13.5 and a 6.5 Ballistic (all sensored). I coupled these with a Novak GTB ESC and a Team Orion 3800 30C Lipo. All I can say is Awesome! brushless is the only way to go.. I ran the 17.5 for a while to race in the Stock Buggy class - this helped me get used to general control. I switched to the 13.5 to run in Super Stock - this helped me get used to higher speed turns and brake control. Now I am running the 6.5 and I feel like I am learning control all over again - this thing is 'really' fast..

A 15.5 or 13.5 would be great to run without going too fast.. I did better racing the 13.5 than I am with the 6.5.. I'm having trouble getting used to the speed.


A fully upgraded Durga is not too much different than a loaded 511X. The balance is a little better in the 511X by default since it uses saddle packs, it is also a little lighter. But for the most part they are very evenly matched.

I have mostly been using J-Concept Tires - Double Dee's (super soft green compound) mini pins for outdoor off-road. They have been excellent. The Panther Raptors and Pro-Line Hole Shots are also good. The J-Concept Rulux 4WD wheels are a direct fit and so are the Losi 4WD (XX4 XXX4) wheels if you need an alternative to Tamiya wheels.


I have been pretty successful racing the Durga so far and have won against other Associated B44, Kyosho and Losi racers.. Right now I am racing against seasoned pro's (10+ years racing skill), so I am having to learn how to keep up with them in 4WD Mod.. The Durga has been a great club racer and I don't have any intentions to retire it any time soon

malice23

Awesome. It helps to have people help that know the kit. What do you think about the stock tires? any particular foam insters i should look for when getting new tires? After hopping this kit up im left with a whole kiti n stock form lol...oh well another project to mess around with or just use for spares. Thanks very much for the advice it was really helpful.

dimblum

The stock tires are not very good for off-road dirt. They are a medium compound and a little too hard to get good traction. I tried racing with them a couple times and was sliding all over the track..

You are better off switching out to soft tires and using the sponge inserts that are included in the package. I have thought of combining soft aftermarket tires with the molded inserts that come with the kit, but so far I have not tried this combo.. I'm thinking the molded inserts might still be too stiff, but I could be wrong.

I know what you mean by spare parts.. It's good to keep all of your spares since something will inevitably break and need to be replaced. The good news is the Durga is super tough compared to some other cars. Parts do not break very often in my experience.

BuzzBomber

My Feedback: (4)

FWIW, those stock tires have very good traction on our track. It will depend what type of track you're running on. Ours tends to be very hard packed and dry with a layer of loose dirt on top.

-Eric01-

Are the ball bearings included (don't think so) or do I have to buy them seperatly? [sm=confused.gif]

The Collector1

My Feedback: (2)

Bearings do come with the kit

malice23

SO, sensored or sensorless brushless motor? whats your opinion?

dimblum

-Sensored only- Its the only way to ensure instant smooth power and no cogging of the motor while it tries to determine the rotor position. Most people say that the difference of running a sensorless motor is minimal, but most seasoned racers will disagree..

There is a reason sensorless motors are a little less expensive - you are sacrificing a little bit of control and power.

BuzzBomber

My Feedback: (4)

My 2ΒΆ: It's a lot less of an issue now with better batteries and better controller software than it was even a year ago. Also, in a 4wd car a silky smooth throttle response from dead stop is a lot less critical than in a 2wd or something like a rock crawler. I'm running a sidewinder esc with the latest firmware and CMS 4600 in my DB01 and I never have any cogging issues or problems getting a smooth start. And yes, I do race it.

futurematt

Hi, I was wondering if anyone here runs the Tamiya Aeration dampers for the DB01. I got some last week and when I fitted them, was surprised that they don't come with the usual rubber cap to keep the oil inside under pressure. Is that why they're called aeration dampers - as air is also trapped inside the damper? If that's the case why worry about getting the air bubbles out then?!

The action seems nice and smooth though, but I was expected more resistance to impact - is that what they are supposed to achieve?

BuzzBomber

My Feedback: (4)

The resistance to impact (damping) would be controlled more by the weight of oil used and the number and size of holes in the shock pistons. Heavier oil and/or smaller/few holes in the pistons equates to stiffer damping, and vice versa. I don't know that the shock design really significantly changes that.

mog ruith

anyway what happen to all the castle esc hype??
it was hot stuff for the past few year till the hobbywing esc came out
and regarding he cogging issue i couldnt agree much for me as a basher it dosent matter
with a good batt i dont have cogging issue