Willystylz

Good work on the translation Vyger! So essentially, the more downforce the body provides, the better it is in the corners. But on the other hand, higher downforce and drag would inhibit the car's top speed on the straights. And what would the "center of wind pressure" figures exactly mean?

Vyger

I'm only guessing at this, but I think they're talking about the pressure put on the top of body, in the center of the car. Since it's measured at the rear body post I think it's a combination of front and rear down-force generated by the wings, and the body itself. I’m just guessing of course because I can’t read any of the article and I’m not an aerodynamicist.

Willystylz

by the sounds of it your guess is probably close to right.

I also wonder if the results of their testing actually prove anything for the real world? IMO, the actual down force you'd want is totally dependant on the layout of the track. Lots of corners you'd want more down force. On a faster track with more straights you'd want less. One particular F1 body style could be better on certain tracks, while lacking on others.

d.k.v

whats the top speed of a f104 pro?

Ttam Says Blarg

depends on what motor you put in it.

d.k.v

whats the biggest motor you could put in one of these things?

id go bL mabye mm 7200 or what ever it is

Willystylz

i'm sure the sky's the limit, but the only issue i see being that the esc should be small, and brushless motor installations are tight in the F104 due to the extra wiring. There's very little room for wiring when you throw the body on, especially when you use the trimmed sidepods. I was trolling on the other big rc forum and saw somebody fit a brushless system in his F104.......not sure how he fit everything in there lol.

d.k.v

couldn't you shorten the motor wires and stuff for extra room?

whats the fastest youv got?

Willystylz

well yeah shortening the wires and resoldering does help. I've just got the Tamiya silver can in mine, and you'd be surprised it's actually pretty quick. Direct-drive cars are very efficient. No tranny's robbing any power. If someone threw a low turn brushless motor in this thing it'd go like stink.

Vyger

Willy is right, shortening the wires can help but the problem is the gauge of the wire. The 12 gauge wire can really interfere with the movement of the rear pod. If you bind this up the car wont handle well at all. I've been talking with one of my friends about using 16 gauge wire on a BL system. I think this would allow plenty room.

On the other hand running the silver can kit motor makes allot of sense. Like Willy said the direct drive cars are very efficient and it gives the car plenty of snap. Using a small LRP QCII or QCIII mounts up perfect within the limited space. I was at a local track last weekend and watched an F1 using the silver can keep up with guys running BL 14.5’s. It was impressive to watch.

You should keep in mind the silver can motors are very durable/reliable, if geared right they’ll last you several months of running, and replacements are $15

Willystylz

The F104 is one of those instances where running brushed actually makes sense.

d.k.v

i think one of these might be fun

Vyger

Well I went to the track this weekend and worked with a friend on getting his F104 set-up. Unfortunately I wasn’t able to stay for the whole day so I wasn’t able to see how the last run went but here’s what we did. Also keep in mind we changed one thing at a time on the car to see what the affect would be.

The car was run with kit tires, the new Tamiya Formula motor, an Orion 3400 lipo pack, an LRP QCII esc, and the aluminum motor mount parts. The front end was lowered to drop the chassis down to the lowest setting. The rear was also set up for the lowest ride height setting.

We tried it first with the stock t-plate and front springs. On the initial run the car was unstable or nervous in a straight line. It looked like small bumps in the track would really throw if off course. It was also very lazy on initial turn in and pushed considerably. The rear also chattered a bit exiting the turns. The straight line breaking was good and solid. The car didn’t 180 when the breaks were applied.

The Formula motor performed well with stock gearing 25/93. It was a bit faster in a straight line than the stock silver can. On the in field it was a little slower but not much. The other F104 running a silver can would real him in but wasn’t able to make a pass. Once back on the straight the Formula motor would pull. Over all I think it might be a good motor to run if Tamiya adopts it for their TCS series, but they may have already for the TCS Nats.

For the second run we changed out the T-plate to the softer one, offered by Tamiya. At first the car had the same characteristics as the first run, lazy and pushy. We pulled the car in and tightened up the T-plate two full turns and set the car back down. Right away you could see the car handling was better. The nervousness on the straight was completely gone. It ran straight and solid. The laziness on turn in was also absent. The car was able to carry more speed through the turn but still pushed a little. The chatter in the rear of the car was also gone. The car was very smooth on exit and on-power. We then loosened the T-plate two full turns again and the car went back to it’s original condition. Then we added one full turn back into the T-plate and seemed to find it’s sweet spot.

Unfortunately I was only able to see the first two runs on the car so that’s all I can report on. I heard he kept working on it for a couple of more runs, trying damper grease and adjusting the damper plate but I don’t know what the result was. Overall I was very pleased with how the car accepted the changes made. That tells me that the car definitely has promise and with a little more work it should run very well.

I hope this might help someone out there…
Vyg

Willystylz

Could it be that you guys needed the softer T-Plate because of the reduced weight from using the lipo? And thanks for all the testing info......especially on the Formula motor. Also did the Orion 3400 fit without any mods?

Vyger

Not a problem. I don't think the softer T-plate relates to that. I think it’s more because the car no longer has the weight of the battery going from side to side, it’s now front to back. In order to get more steering in the car we tightened up the T-plate, forcing the front of the car to work. If that makes sense? I’m going to test my car using a 3600nmh battery, why…because Tamiya developed the car with a nmh not a lipo.

Yes, the Orion 3400 fit into the car with no modifications, it had plenty of space between the upper deck and the connectors. I’m not sure about other company’s batteries but the Orion’s seem to fit very well.

studysession

Nice cars!@
Love the realism in the detail shown in the pics. Keep them coming.

Willystylz

Vyger

Nice pics Willy. I'm still working to get the electronics installed. Man there just isn't allot of room in there. I should have in done tonight...hopefully. Then it's time to start working on the body. My original idea wont work...I was going to use some stickers for the F201, but they're WAY to big for that little body. So I'm working on plan B...maybe a retro paint scheme....

bxpitbull

Vyger is GOD! Now if God would bless me with a cheap F103 roller he has no need for, he would make the PITBULL one happy son of a b****!

Ttam Says Blarg

Ya. Same goes here. Anyone getting rid of a f-103. Hit me up.

d.k.v

any one willing to take an obove shot of te chassis 4 me??
I mean the lower plate of the chassis

Thanks
matthew

Willystylz

you mean a shot underneath the car?

d.k.v

yer. lol i know what i mean

Vyger

You mean like this?

bxpitbull

Vyger, you show off. Where is the roller for cheap you was going to pass on to a brother? Oh, you forgot now huh? Dag.[sm=punching.gif]