Hello [8D]

Is the ML70 an ester- or an PAG-based oil?

Aerosynth is no longer producing Aerosynth2 oil and the Aerosave (mainly for 4 strokes?) http://www.aerosynth.de/pages/pdfs/ASaveEngl.pdf can’t be mixed with castor oil.

Thanks.

Davs!

I don't know about the ML-70, but why would you want to add castor oil to Aerosave?
For my engines (2- and 4-strokes) my standard mixture nowadays is 10% nitro / 15% Aerosave and the reminder methanol. It is my (and my fellow club mates) experience there is no need to add castor unless you plan to abuse your engines with extreme lean runs and/or poor cooling.

Hejsan[sm=regular_smile.gif]

Some like to add a little castor oil in the fuel – I’m one of them.

This subject reminds me of a song by Limahl: “Never Ending Story”…

Skål Red

Who makes ML70?

Hey.

G-max in England

http://www.modeltechnics.com/ingredi...gredients.html

That's almost all I could find about the oil. It's rather popular oil for glow engines here in Denmark.

To my knowlege the EDL and ML70 are Ester based oils

I was under the impression that all synthetics on the europe side of the pond were Esters and the AMEX stuff was PAG

I never mix with Castor these perfectly good oils but sometimes mix the 90% EDL and 10% ML70 but to my knowelege both EDL and ML70 can be mixed with Castor for the less Mechanicaly able modelers who will tune engines way too lean and would probably be better off doing electric if they still need Castor



But if I was using PAG there might be a case to use some Castor as it reputed to need 25% more PAQ to do the same job as Esters so lots of formulas in USA will be ~18% oil where ~15% is PAQ and ~3% is Castor to replace a ~10% Ester formula

That's my reading of the story from studying all the issues so I might be wrong but I mix my own brews and use it on my own engines 4 stroke and 2 stroke get ~10% Esters when run in (~15% while running in )

I am always aiming to use the least possible amount of oil as 10% EDL will mean 90% fuel that burns and less than 10% is possible that's even better

Some guys are even more extreme and use a lot less than 10% Esters no Castors and so far best I can see they seem to doing well on those formulas so later I might try that as well


Balsaeater

Spare me for that nonsens

Tuning ability has little to do with the high temp protection of castor over synthetics. Please keep it friendly when talking about oils.

I haven't found anything about ML-70 online, other than the mention of it being a component of many fuel sold in the UK.

Thanks for your replies.
I’ll get the AeroSynth 3 and mix it without castor… Balsaeater

Yeah let us know how you get on with the AeroSynth 3 and where you get it from and how much it costs

I may be moving for long periods soon to south Europe and and AeroSynth 3 is reputidly a more popular oil to be found there than EDL or ML70
I think that's because most of them order it from Graupner

One issue to watch is very low oil content like 10% with low nitro or Zero nitro fuel can make the firing sequence advance a tad for some engines and this will mean that although the engine may have eneogh oil to lubricate the engine the engine can be getting hot from pre detonation effects in long runs where WOT is used

The Simplist solution is running the engine richer will supply more fuel and fuel has a large cooling effect from the energy needed to vaporise it which draws the excess heat from the engine which works well for lots of sports uses

Putting in higher nitro methane often cures this as this will often retard ignition and nitro methane has a larger cooling effect as the volume of it is greater compared to methanol and draws of lots of heat from vaporization and for 3d work where ~1/3 to 1/2 throtle is used a lot that is the favoured solution

Putting in higher oil cures this as this will often retard ignition and oil has a cooling effects

As oil is often much cheaper than nitro and often less than 1/2 the price of nitro methane lots of guys opt to increase the oil content if the engine is going to be WOT all the flight as that is a cheaper solution for retarding ignition compared to increasing nitro levels

Other solutions exist of like differrent glow plugs or smaller or different props through to ram air cooling in cowling covers and mixing acetone into the fuel or mixing water into the fuel etc


Some guys drop a lot below 10% oil but I suspect they have to richen engine way to much to keep the engine cool and cancell out the oil saving or are running engines with very low compression or very low powered sports stuff on ~1/4 gas

I don't think less than 6% oil is possible as the con rods bushing will starved of oil below that

Best I can tell the schools of thought go from 10% to 15% synthetic ester oils with it rumored the Japanese 3D heli team use 10% oil synthetic Ester oils only and 3D heli is a severe enviorement

So for me I use 18% running in dropping to 15% and then after that when run in 10% and if engines in very hot summer days show signs of excessive heat I will bump up the nitro from my normal 5% to 10% or 15% but haven't had that issue yet


Balsaeater

I've found that my engines run much cooler on low-oil mixes, to the extent that I had to go to a warmer plug in some cases when changing from 18% to 12% lube.

What probably catches most people out is that the needles do get a lot more sensitive and it's easy to be just a click lean (which will eat a plug). Adding nitro will make the needles a little softer and allow you to run a bit richer without power issues but we run 12% oil and 5% nitro here in all our 2-strokes without any issues at all.

One thing you have to avoid though is adding nitro *and* running lean. The nitro tends to advance the ignition all on its own so you must run richer to compensate just as if you run higher nitro fuel in an engine with 18% oil you must richen the needle to avoid detonation.

Most visitors to our club (who still invariably run 18-20% oil) can't believe we've only got 5% nitro in our fuel because we get so much power and such crisp reliable engine operation with 10% oil.

Hey Balseeater.

What does WOT means?

AeroSynth 3 is very popular in Denmark. In my club, several are using 15 % AeroSynth 3 and 5 % nitro without any chances on the engine except from needle settings.

AeroSynth 3 costs for 1 liter (1/4 gallon) approx 100 DKr (20 USD)
1 liter ML70 120 DKr (24 USD).
1 liter nitro 100 – 200 DKr (20 – 40 USD).

I only have Cool Power FAI (17 % synthetics) for the time being (of course I'd put some castor in it [sm=tongue_smile.gif]), so it will take some time, until I can make new tests and report the results.

WOT = Wide Open Throttle.

[sm=thumbs_up.gif]