After flying and competing in control line stunt for the last 30 years I have decided to make the switch to R/C. All my local buddies who fly C/L have passed away or are to old to fly anymore. The hobby is slowly fading away. I'm getting in Sailplanes and have the basic dumb questions. I have a Aero-commander RTF two channel and have become somewhat bored with only two channels. I need some advice on the radio to buy. I want to get something I will not out grow when I need 7 or 8 channels for a plane with flaps, spoilers rudder etc. Hi-tec seems big as well as JR. Could someone explain what the heck this 2.4Hz is all about?? Does it solve the problem of no channels so you don't have to worry about turning on your transmitter and crashing someone? I'm big into building and do a ton of composite work along with my own 3 axis CNC machine I designed and built myself. Plus what the heck is MIXING?? could someone explain that! I know this is all basic stuff and should be in the "begineers" forum but I want the input from the best sailplane pilots in the world!!
Thanks
Steve

Hi Steve, I was also a bored controline stunt flier that made the move to RC. It's unbelievable how much grief I took for doing that. But I'm one of those guys who love all forms of modeling. Even did a stint with Indoor Free Flight for awhile. Love em all. If you can afford a 2.4 ghz radio, then by all means go that direction. I'm still flying a Hitec FM Flash 5 system which still works well, but if I was in the market, I'd buy 2.4 ghz. Either Futaba or Spektrum. 2.4 ghz will prevent frequency sharing problems, but if you're careful, a FM transmitter works well also. Buy a 2.4 ghz with multiple model memory. No need to buy the best or highest priced, but a good multi model memory 2.4 ghz system is all you need. An example of Mixing is when with a computer radio you automatically mix in some rudder when you use the ailerons. A lot of RCers will say this is just the greatest thing and others will never use it. It's kind of a preferential thing. I'm not the best model sailplane pilot in the world, but I am a very enthusiastic model sailplane flier. I've been flying the Parkzone Radian this last year and have had a blast with it. I can go out the local park, put it up, make my way back to my seat, AM radio for background noise and just enjoy a 40 min to an hour flight looking for thermals. I quite enjoy that kind of flying. I like trying to fly the pattern too, but its different. So don't get rid of all your Fox 35's just yet.

Steve

Mixing can be cool, you can program you radio to add a little rudder in when you give aileron, or you can "dial out roll induced from rudder."

Computer radios are great, but you have to become one with them. I first bought Airtronics Vision because it was/is the best sailplane radio, this was in the late 80's I then bought a Hitec Eclipse radio, I had to wait for them to write the owners manual, I think I had #77. Then I bought a Futaba 7c, because I read how good the 9c was. Turns out buying the 7c because the 9c's great reviews was like buying a Chevy because you read a great review on a Cadillac. So I bought a 9c. They don't sell 9c any more, but they have a 10 something 2.4 GHz, that's what I'd buy if I was starting RC now. I understand that being a UC flier converted to RC you might say will I get my money's worth out of it? A lifetime warranty doesn't have the same meaning at 65 as it does at 30, but the Futaba 10 GHz radio will last forever, you won't outgrow it and you'll learn to use it's features over time.

Learn to forgive the RCer's when they say the built an ARF, for they know not what they say.

The way a 2.4 system works is when you bind a reciever to a tranmitter, it stores the transmitters id code in memory in the reciever. The reciever will only listen to signals from that transmitter so the concept of channels is a thing of the past. Some systems like Futaba setup a pattern and freqency hop, some of them pick to clean channels when they power up.

They also reduce interference from things like noisy ignitions and metal to metal rubbing in the airframe because they operate well above the frequency of that stuff.

If you're buying new nowadays it's the way to go.

Steve,

Also, if you get a sailplane with flaps and ailerons, the mixing will allow you to link up the elevator so when you land you will have the proper amount of pitch when crowing in the plane.

I have the JR X9303 which I believe is one of the best radios you can buy for the money. You can use JR and the full like of Spektrum band receivers with this transmitter. And you are correct, with the 2.4Ghz technology you no longer have channels per se that can shoot you down if someone else turns on their transmitter on the same channel. The receiver "binds" to the transmitter so it knows you are the only owner.

Horizon has the manual and setup sheets online as well. ;-)

http://www.horizonhobby.com/Products...1#quickSupport

Oops! Sorry Andy. We must have been typing at the same time.

Guys,
Thanks for all the good advice. There is a Good Sailplane club here in Maine so I will be tapping them for help. They have a Hi-Start and trainers.

Rich: Good to see you over here in the Sailplane forum. I did not think you ever left the Composite section. You know me with my vacuum bagging infusing skills. I want to do a Rohacell hollow core carbon wing. Solid kelvar fuse. Can you or anyone recommend plans for a RES Electirc sailplane which kicks ass!! I have studied the pictures of some of high end planes at SailplanesUSA and Kennedy and plan to copy their construction with all composite wings and fuse's
Thanks guys

Some carbon fiber weaves will shield a 2.4GHz signal. That is why you see some sailplanes advertised as "2.4 friendly." The radio compartment on these planes is made without carbon fiber. The objection I have to 2.4 in sailplanes is that the receivers have a larger footprint than the really small 72MHz receivers. Both Futaba and JR use multiple antennas to get around the reflection problems that don&rsquo;t bother 72 MHz. Even if you only have to contend with two antennas, it is still more of a hassle than a 72MHz single long wire antenna. 2.4GHz receivers can be installed in a sailplane. Some in my club have gone to 2.4GHz in their sailplanes but the majority haven&rsquo;t. As a former electrical engineer, I cringe at some of the installations I&rsquo;ve seen. But they work.</p>

2.4GHz gives better protection against someone turning on to your frequency than will 72MHz receivers. But there are receivers on the market, such as the Berg, that incorporates transmitter signal recognition, TSR. This and the older PCM technique provide an extra measure of protection over FM. Ilive in an area where soaring is not really popular. There may be at most a half dozen of us flying at one time and I haven&rsquo;t had a frequency conflict in years. If I were flying in a more populated area, I would be more receptive to using it with my sailplanes. To make the point clear that I&rsquo;m not against 2.4, I use it almost exclusively on my pattern planes.</p>

Allan</p>

Contuining with this thread I found a thread on beginner R/C Radio. I now understand the bulk of it including mixing. Can someone tell me what DSM2 means??

That's a Spektrum thing. Check out their webpage. http://www.spektrumrc.com/DSM/Technology/DSM2.aspx It's the decision you have to make, go with Futaba or Spektrum. I think Spektrum and JR are pretty much the same.

DSM2 is an enhanced DSM. DSM is based on DSSS. DSSS appears to be:

So it sounds like all those are names that cover a 2.4 protocol that uses a wide band to enhance the security of the signal that uses just a small portion of the band to exchange our command information.

Bottom line, it's JR/Spektrum's method of 2.4

Welcome to RC and to RC Soaring.

WARNING! WARNING! YOU ARE ENTERING A ZONE OF HIGH ADDICTION POTENTIAL! WARNING

THERMAL AND SLOPE SOARING CAN ABSORB ALL YOU FREE TIME! WARNING!

I don't know what an Aerocommander is so I can't comment on that. However if you are flying thermal duration sailplanes, 2 and 3 channel planes are wonderful thermal soaring planes. My first RC glider was a Spirit, a R/E glider that also has spoilers. This is called a RES glider.

After thousands of flights, and flying competition up and down the East Coast I fly all kinds of gliders, both electric and pure, which span 2 - 7 channels. They are all fun.

As to radios, well the first quesiton is always budget. If you are buying for the future, then, "how much you got availalbe to spend?"

The article below will cover some of the considerations, but it sounds like you are well funded and looking for a strong, long term contender in a 2.4 GHz radio. BTW, I would definately recommend 2.4.

I would say the JR X9303 is probably the top of the stack in terms of popularity with sport and competition pilots. But the Airtronics SD-10G seems to be getting great reviews and I have started to see them showing up at the competition field.

The Hitec Aurora seems to have a rich feature set for gliders but I have not seen one at the club or at the ESL competitions.

I fly the Futaba 9C Super, which I am converting over to 2.4 Spektrum. The 9C Super was replaced by the 10C. I have not touched the 10C but I would expect that it is also an excellent candidate with enhancements of the 9C Super.

The Spektrum 7C, the top of the Spektrum line is not a real sailplane radio so I would not recommend it for someone buying for the future.

Any of these will serve you well, and yes, no channel conflict.

Note that in 2.4, receivers are generally brand/technology specific. So you buy Hitec receivers for a JR radio, Futaba receivers for a Futaba radio, etc. Of the major brands, only JR an Spektrum share technolgy, so you can use either Spekturm or JR receivers with the JR X9303.

With that said, seeing what receivers are available can be an important consideration. Since they are brand specific, you need to make sure they have receivers that will meet your needs. And I assume you will fly planes, other than gliders.

Will they fit in your plane? Do you need micro recievers for indoor flying? Do you need 10 channels for complex planes?

These resources may be helpful:

> Choosing a Sailplane Radio - What to Consider
> http://forums.flyesl.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=223

> What mixes do you use to set-up your plane?
> http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=290071

> The New Glider Pilot's Handbook
> http://forums.flyesl.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=251

> Novice Lounge - The Eastern Soaring League
> http://forums.flyesl.com/forum.asp?FORUM_ID=14

> Learning to use a hi-start
> http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_1171131/tm.htm

> Discus Launched Gliders
> http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_2357948/tm.htm

> How Slope Soaring Works
> http://users.iafrica.com/s/st/stevemac/afc/ssoar.html

> Introduction to Slope Soaring
> http://home.att.net/~charles.french/...lopeIntro.html