I have bin trying some mixes. so far I have :
pitch to aileron
pitch to elevator
the next one is elevator to aileron and then rudder to aileron
em I on the right track ?.

pitch is the master aileron (6%)is the slave . this is done to stop the heli in a full power pull (12 degrees) to go straight up, right side up and inverted.
pitch is the master and elevator (6%) is the slave. this is done to to keep the nose down or up in rolls.
the cyclic to throttle is a good one but I keep forgetting to set it up. the 91 has a tone of torque. one more mix to setup.

if you can send me a map or a Lat and long position of the field I will cruise by sometime.

Maybe I'm not following, but here's my two cents.

You don't want pitch mixed with anything. You want throttle mixed with aileron and elevator cyclic to maintain rotor speed (you need some extra throttle to compensate for the additional load/drag imposed by cyclic input). I don't think it has anything to do with getting the heli to go straight up. I have the following mixes:

1. Master: Aileron. Slave: Throttle. Mix: 6% (i.e., 6% more throttle when full aileron applied)

2. Master: Elevator. Slave: Throttle. Mix: 6%

3. Master: Rudder. Slave: Throttle. Mix: 5%

My throttle curves are set up to give me 94% of my max carb travel at full stick, thereby leaving 6% left over for mixing. Seems to work well.

Also, if you don't have a HH gyro, you will want some revo mixing (throttle to tail rotor). If you have HH, revo should be zero (inhibited)

sure I had that mix before when I had a 61wc in my heli . but right now lack of power is not the problem. the problem now is trying to keep the loops and tumbles straight.

This sounds more like interaction in the head that you should not have to mix out.. I would check your timing on the head and make sure your anti-rotation block is not out of time... a few degrees forward or back can cause interactions like that. You should be able to fix it there and then remove the offending pmixes that your are talking about.. I would never put mixes like that in there.. there are other things you should look at and make sure if flys were you want it to..
Also check you balance at the flybar and make sure your not nose or tail heavy..

Hi Guys,

Vince is on the right track. Check out the latest MHT for an article by Mike Goza. He address the pitch "problem". This is pretty advanced stuff and probably only applys to about 5% of the people on this forum.

Keep experimenting Vince, you're on the cutting edge. The guys that do know this stuff avoid these forums like the plague.

Blair

Vince;
You're on the right track. Rarely will a heli fly perfectly straight in all attitudes. I routinely use pitch to cyclic mixing on all my helis to trim them for hover and full power flight both upright and inverted. Generally the amount of mixing needed is only 5-10%, but it really helps to trim the thing for hands off hovering and flight in all orientations. It also helps to get the rolls smoothed out. I trim mine exactly the way Mike Goza explained in his article, and have for a number of years. Hope this helps. Steve.

So I wasn't following....Very interesting stuff. It's too bad that really advanced guys "avoid these forums like the plague." Sounds like there's a lot of information that could be shared. Anyway, I don't get MHT, but I may sign up just to check out this article. Vince.b, a follow up post on how it comes out would sure be appreciated.

Hey Guys
I fly at the same field as Vinny. WE had been talking about mixes.
I had a problem with the heli ever so slightly rolling out in loops. Checked that there was no interaction off the swashplate from low to high using the Garry Wright bubble gauge. I also checked phasing on the swash plate and it all looked good. This is all on an older xcell se. Read the article in MHT and it talked about phasing happening due to the gyroscopic effect and the mass of the head. I did the mix from fore/aft cyclic to left/right cyclic and it tracks straight. Now all I need is slightly longer thumbs so I stop wiggling the tail through the loops:-)

Cheers
Al