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Old 02-21-2011, 04:36 PM
  #26  
SDCrashmaster
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Default RE: Regrettable thing


ORIGINAL: 595flyer

what could the pilot have done to prevent chashing on the free-way with only one elevator.
He could have "chashing" on the freeway with two elevators. Would have been a more symmetrical chash that way.

Until someone describes the incident and lets us know what happened, all your posts are undecipherable dribble.
Old 02-21-2011, 05:32 PM
  #27  
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Default RE: Regrettable thing

It could be that the pilot has threatened to bring this up on RCU if not compensated for the crash, so the poster made this preemptive post. I'm not sure it was a wise choice but hey, it's snowing with thunder and lightning and the wife just bought some Extra Butter Popcorn so...
Old 02-21-2011, 05:34 PM
  #28  
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+1

SDChashmaster

Old 02-21-2011, 05:35 PM
  #29  
gtoro26
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Default RE: Regrettable thing

hello i am a rc jet modeler and i was personally at markham park on sunday when this jet took a dive
i just finish landing and as i was taxing back i did see a piece of airplane fly off as plane was about 100 feet high over mid runway
plane continued linear straight and then dove and crashed
it was later confirmed that one of the elevator from base root inside the aircraft tore completely off in mid flight
it was found in the middle of the field 300 yards away from crash site
this should not happen
the pilot i know to be a very experienced flyer and is very knowledgeable about detail
i believe this to be totally an unseen circumstance and there is no way of knowing that if all screws are tightened and all bolts are
locked a most crucial article of a jet an elevator should come off completely
it looked liked a clean cut break
i have had first hand experience with many jet crashes and this was definitely not pilot error or pilot mishap
i vouch for this individual and if there is any thing that anyone can do it would benefit all to accomodate as best as possible
Old 02-21-2011, 05:48 PM
  #30  
david robinson
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Default RE: Regrettable thing

I saw the crash as well I do not know the pilot but I have seen him there flying several high end jets, BVM, Skymaster etc... All I can say is that he was making a pass about 60-70 ft and the left elevator ripped off the airplane. He maintained control of the jet for a few seconds but then the airplane climbed drastically and crashed into the highway and exploded upon impact. I did not hear any flutter it just flew flew off. He did not seem to be going overly fast, thats why it caught my eye when it happened at that speed.
Old 02-21-2011, 05:50 PM
  #31  
giddyuperic
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Default RE: Regrettable thing

Where is he?
Old 02-21-2011, 05:51 PM
  #32  
David Searles
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Default RE: Regrettable thing

ORIGINAL: gtoro26

hello i am a rc jet modeler and i was personally at markham park on sunday when this jet took a dive
i just finish landing and as i was taxing back i did see a piece of airplane fly off as plane was about 100 feet high over mid runway
plane continued linear straight and then dove and crashed
it was later confirmed that one of the elevator from base root inside the aircraft tore completely off in mid flight
it was found in the middle of the field 300 yards away from crash site
this should not happen
the pilot i know to be a very experienced flyer and is very knowledgeable about detail
i believe this to be totally an unseen circumstance and there is no way of knowing that if all screws are tightened and all bolts are
locked a most crucial article of a jet an elevator should come off completely
it looked liked a clean cut break
i have had first hand experience with many jet crashes and this was definitely not pilot error or pilot mishap
i vouch for this individual and if there is any thing that anyone can do it would benefit all to accomodate as best as possible
Okay, the kernels are definitely popping now!

With all of two posts in 3 years, & your extensive experience, gtoro26, this should really settle the matter, I'm sure.

David S
Old 02-21-2011, 06:08 PM
  #33  
Xairflyer
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Default RE: Regrettable thing

You cant jump on the manufacturer until it is determined as a manufacturing fault that caused the elevator/tailplane or whatever part of the aircraft to come off, just because FEJ have had a hard time before (I don't own one by the way).

There could be many ways that this could have been caused, right from the build, to someone banging against it at the field, to knocking the tailplane taking it out of the car.

The previous owner may have knocked it in the past or it fell off the bench, two guys lost their lives in a fullsize homebuilt because another pilot who flew the aircraft a month earlier had a very hard landing, he did'nt mention it as he thought everything was ok when he looked over the aircraft, turned out the main spar was cracked and one wing folded in flight as the unknowing pilot pulled up a bit harder than normal.
Old 02-21-2011, 06:10 PM
  #34  
FILE IFR
 
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Default RE: Regrettable thing

ORIGINAL: gtoro26

i believe this to be totally an unseen circumstance and there is no way of knowing that if all screws are tightened and all bolts are
locked a most crucial article of a jet an elevator should come off completely
it looked liked a clean cut break

Thanks for coming forward with the added info, but I personally don't agree with what you have stated.... most all screws/bolts/block-mounts can be can be checked one way, or another and at any time.... especially in that tail section.

Old 02-21-2011, 06:23 PM
  #35  
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david robinson


Ouch! That highway & explosion part could have been omitted in your testimony.

... I strongly urge it in the interest of our hobby.
Old 02-21-2011, 06:32 PM
  #36  
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Default RE: Regrettable thing


ORIGINAL: david robinson

the airplane climbed drastically and crashed into the highway and exploded upon impact.
Unfortunately, I have had two crashes that resulted in the dreaded fire ball (not really an explosion, per se). I must say that neither turbine looked as clean as this one...

Bob
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Old 02-21-2011, 07:21 PM
  #37  
psb667
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Default RE: Regrettable thing

Perhaps he was describing the splatter factor. when they hit hard pieces go everywhere
Old 02-21-2011, 07:31 PM
  #38  
topgun24
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Default RE: Regrettable thing

I was there. I saw the crash.
It was absolutely structural failure. Elevator came off mid flight. The entire wood mount came out of the plane. The glue job was terrible. It was not the pilot's fault!!!
I have first hand knowledge of this plane from the day it was received from the factory. There was NO prior damage to the elevator EVER.
I have known 4 people to have FEJ and have NOT seen any of them survive past flight 12. They all have had major structural failure and crashed. 2 f-15's, 1 F-16 and 1 rafale.
Old 02-21-2011, 07:36 PM
  #39  
topgun24
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Also, there was NOT any way to tell that the wood was not properly glue in at the factory. It appeared that the wood was not even touching the fuse as it was sitting a a blob of crappy glue with a fillet of glue on the edge so you could not tell the wood was not touching the fuse. The wood appeared to be much thicker than it actually was since elevated on a blob of glue.
Old 02-21-2011, 07:47 PM
  #40  
Gary Arthur
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Default RE: Regrettable thing

From the original pictures, it does not appear to have any fire damage as stated in a few posts????????
Old 02-21-2011, 08:03 PM
  #41  
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Default RE: Regrettable thing

Hi,

Is it me, or does this whole thing sound and seem kinda fishy somehow? People vouching (anonymously) but the owner/pilot silent? I regard myself as a pretty competent builder and pilot, but I don't know that I can watch a crash and state unambiguously that the cause was manufacturer error, either.
Old 02-21-2011, 08:31 PM
  #42  
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Default RE: Regrettable thing

It seems to me that someone was possibly trying to blackmail FEJ in getting a new jet.  I was a former prosecutor so i see things diferent than most. 

All of these threads & post are great because i'm about 2 weeks for purchasing my 2nd jet and FEJ is in the lead by far.
Old 02-21-2011, 09:06 PM
  #43  
archie05
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ORIGINAL: FILE IFR


david robinson


Ouch! That highway & explosion part could have been omitted in your testimony.

... I strongly urge it in the interest of our hobby.
+1 I agree
Old 02-21-2011, 09:10 PM
  #44  
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Default RE: Regrettable thing

ORIGINAL: gtoro26

hello i am a rc jet modeler and i was personally at markham park on sunday when this jet took a dive
i just finish landing and as i was taxing back i did see a piece of airplane fly off as plane was about 100 feet high over mid runway
plane continued linear straight and then dove and crashed
it was later confirmed that one of the elevator from base root inside the aircraft tore completely off in mid flight
it was found in the middle of the field 300 yards away from crash site
this should not happen
the pilot i know to be a very experienced flyer and is very knowledgeable about detail
i believe this to be totally an unseen circumstance and there is no way of knowing that if all screws are tightened and all bolts are
locked a most crucial article of a jet an elevator should come off completely
it looked liked a clean cut break
i have had first hand experience with many jet crashes and this was definitely not pilot error or pilot mishap
i vouch for this individual and if there is any thing that anyone can do it would benefit all to accomodate as best as possible
Sounds like a post the owner of the airframe in question asked you to write. Two posts? Uh,,,, ok.


First hand experience? Many jet crashes? Yeah ok.
Old 02-21-2011, 09:50 PM
  #45  
HORNET FLYER
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Default RE: Regrettable thing

Lol, where did fej...the guy to start this thread go? In my jet years I have seen many jet crashes and the ones that caught on fire did not look like a.plane, but carbon matte...........this plane didnot look like it exploded.
Old 02-21-2011, 10:06 PM
  #46  
RCJetBazz
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Default RE: Regrettable thing


ORIGINAL: AltecareRC


ORIGINAL: Gary Arthur

By the photos, it appears that the customer may be claiming the elevator pivot failed and caused the crash.
Looks like " deja vu " but in may case both stab systems got yanked out or ripped off of the fuse at the same time in straight and level flight and at half power 2 minutes into the 3rd flight of the life of my FEJ Hawk.

Needless to say waited 5 months for a resolution and the factory washed its hands completely from me, so I did the same and stopped dealing with them.
Seems pretty consistent, glue joint failed completely for the one and the other seems the bulkhead ripped apart entirely. Both structural failures at the same and most crucial flight surfaces.


Old 02-22-2011, 01:07 AM
  #47  
airega1
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Default RE: Regrettable thing


ORIGINAL: gtoro26

hello i am a rc jet modeler and i was personally at markham park on sunday when this jet took a dive
i just finish landing and as i was taxing back i did see a piece of airplane fly off as plane was about 100 feet high over mid runway
plane continued linear straight and then dove and crashed
it was later confirmed that one of the elevator from base root inside the aircraft tore completely off in mid flight
it was found in the middle of the field 300 yards away from crash site
this should not happen
the pilot i know to be a very experienced flyer and is very knowledgeable about detail
i believe this to be totally an unseen circumstance and there is no way of knowing that if all screws are tightened and all bolts are
locked a most crucial article of a jet an elevator should come off completely
it looked liked a clean cut break
i have had first hand experience with many jet crashes and this was definitely not pilot error or pilot mishap
i vouch for this individual and if there is any thing that anyone can do it would benefit all to accomodate as best as possible
gtoro your argument sounds weak and pretty hard to take serious!
Old 02-22-2011, 03:48 AM
  #48  
pmerritt
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Based on a complete read of this post, it seems: 1.This was a "used" jet.
2.The manufacturerfelt the needtogo on the defense.
3. The pilot was skilled. (skill in flying doesn't necessarily define skill in building/engineering)
4. There was a structural failure in flight.
5. There are pictures of the carnage (which Iwill go to my grave wondering how anyone can determine the "exact" cause of failure from a mutilated pile ofbalsa, plastic, and metal, or the true blame of said failure without the additional costs of millions of dollars worth of flight data recording equipment and instruments on board)
6.Thatthis falls underthecontinuing thought process in the current millennium of "it's NEVER MYFAULT"
7.Why isn't the original seller being hammeredto death on a thread?
8. From what I see, "that dog ain't gonna hunt no more" (pick up the pieces, get some Kleenex, start allover)
9.One needs to research theirmanufacturer's productextensively before investing that much money into a toy. (Please don'thang me from the nearest oak tree describing thishobby as a toy.)
10. Onewho optionsto spend thousands of dollars on a machinewhich defies gravityhad better have the financialwherewithal to lose that money when gravity wins.

This all said, as a newbie in this hobby, I'vesmacked so many planes from about every conceivable fault known to RCflight, I'm willing to admit that pretty much 110% of them have been pilot error (believing that"piloterror" also is contiguous with "pilot responsibility"). Thusmeaning100% of EVERY action associated withthe operation of that aircraftfallsunder the responsibility of the person twistingthoselittle sticks! 11. That popcorn bowl is empty......someone please bring some more.

Old 02-22-2011, 04:13 AM
  #49  
topgun24
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Default RE: Regrettable thing

Why would you not blame the manufacture if your elevator and the wood mount departed causing you to crash during straight and level flight? I was there and the plane took at least 4 seconds to hit the ground after the elevator departed. The elevator was retrieved and the top right picture in the original post is what was retrieved. The elevator and the wood mount holding stab to fuse with that crappy glob of glue underside which appears to have prevented the wood from even touching the fuse. What quality does that look like to you? It was doomed to fail the day it was manufactured!!!
Old 02-22-2011, 04:14 AM
  #50  
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Default RE: Regrettable thing

This is a very back to front thread. To make sense of it all, we need the owner of the crashed jet to make a post explaining why Fly Eagle thought it necessary to start this. As Fly Eagle have the photos of the crashed jet & wrote what they posted, it would seem a reasonable guess, that some claim has been made against them.


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