geh3

My Feedback: (84)

Ihave had several boomerangs, all of them flew GREAT! Irecently built a TORUS and modified it by removing the covering from all covered surfaces
and covering these with fiberglass using the WESTSystems epoxy (105)and hardener (206) and light glass cloth. This turned out very well and flew great.
It was powered by a very healthy Wren 160. During the final stages of building this stock version. Ifound that Ihad to add unusual amounts of weight to the
front of the fuselage to achieve CG. Isuccessfully buried my flight batteries (Duralite EXB 5200 nimh,1 under the front retract well and 1in front of the most
forward firewall. In addition the ECULiPo was stuffed as far front as possible. Even doing this, Ihad to add additional lead to get CG. Unfortunalely this plane
was lost due to pilot error! but Iwas able to salvage all internal components except for 1 flight battery since the plane hit the ground almost flat. Since this plane is
great for any type of flying, and is easy to transport, Iam building another one with the goal in mind of extending the fuse 3.5-4" to avoid any extra weight
required to achieve CG!!!

STEP1 determine best place to extend the fuse... see picsfor the "blue line"Ihave chosen this spot since extending it here preserves the internal formers and the LGmount
and the steering servo mount and all I have to do is build up the extension and mount it. Yes I will loose some original graphics but these are easily replaced using ProMark
and others stay tuned for STEP2. NOTE:the plane in the pics below was my first one with the stock fuse length!

geh3

My Feedback: (84)

OKonto cutting the beast ...HMMMMMthis does take a bit of fortitude... cutting up a perfectly good airplane!!
Iestimate this mod will add 4-6 ozs to the frontal area of the plane but will save many many more oz by eliminating
adding lead. Iwill keep weight data and post it here...

PaulD

My Feedback: (39)

Intersting thread!

My beef is many jets are coming out tail heavy and needing lots of lead in the nose to balance. Some extra length should really make a big difference.

PaulD

Tom Antlfinger

My Feedback: (24)

My buddy Dave Elsinger maidened his Torus yesterday.......6 oz of lead in the nose with CG 1/2" behind the aft edge of the front spar. It flew perfectly. Zero tendency to snap in high G slow speed and hight speed turns. Behaves gently in the flare. Dave is considering taking more lead out.

He did switch from dual A123 up in the nose on the platform above the gear well to Electrodynamics 5-cell 2400 Sanyo NiCd's. Picked up about 8oz more battery weight. He's using a Duralite LiMn 4300 from Todd for the ECU.....Using a Kero Titan SE, FUT 6014HS, and JR 8411/8711 mix all around. Gear is Dreamworks retracts and struts.

We did not like the new way of mounting horns in the surfaces(see photo), so we had Paul Jacques, our club machinist make up parts identical in design to the aluminum nuts used on our XL's and Elan's, only made them a bit bigger to accomodate the 8-32 hardware. Look and work perfectly....very stout.....just be sure you hit the hard point area in the surface.....

We ordered 2 kits from Patricia on 10/07, shipped on 10/10, got them on 10/13, and Dave had his done on 10/20. He has built 12 Boomerang Jets for himself and other clubmembers. He can start one on Friday night and have it RTF on Sunday if you really push him...........I am the snail.....just starting mine tomorrow.....hope to fly it next weekend with a Wren kero 160 that is on my XL currently and is working flawlessly.....

Photos to follow...

Tom Antlfinger

My Feedback: (24)

More of Dave Elsinger's Torus maiden on 10/22......photos taken by club member Jeorg Becker with his Nikon.......master photographer Palmer Johnson has tutored J.B. and his latest work is excellent, IMO.....

Tom Antlfinger

My Feedback: (24)

Dave and I are thinking that all kits are not coming out exactly the same in regard to weight of the parts, especially the booms, leading to some requiring so much lead in the nose....or doing the major mod suggested by geh3.......

Hopefully mine will come out like Dave's, requiring little or no nose weight, using NiCd's and LiMn.......

We did notice that you can't position the Titan as far forward as possible as it hits the back of the Sullivan tank, pushing it forward just enought to not allow the hatch to fit as the front of the tank hits the cockpit tub......

highhorse

My Feedback: (2)

This wasn't Alan's first rodeo.

The nose should have been longer right out of the box, and there shouldn't be a "Here is how to spend extra time and $$ to balance your Torus" thread!

geh3

My Feedback: (84)

Yes well please note that even with some weight up front to achieve CG the TORUS is a really fun plane
and flies fine. Ijust have some time on my hands (retired) and Ilike to fly unique planes and if I
can get the overall weight down it will fly even better... esp in the climb and slow landing areas...

highhorse

My Feedback: (2)

I would never imply that the Boomers aren't a hoot.

Only that the moments of the Torus, as an outgrowth of the XL and XL II, were not a mystery.

Alan's stated reasoning for not glassing the wing is because he wanted the airplane to remain as light as possible, but a requirement to add weight forward is counter to that honorable goal.

Perhaps, as with the XL II, the QC has left something to be desired and, as suggested eslewhere, the booms are coming out heavyier than specced in the prototypes.

Tom Antlfinger

My Feedback: (24)

Didn't know that the Brits ride bulls and broncos?? Learn something new everyday......

Our experience with multiple Boomerang builds shows you can get away with little or no added lead just by adjusting batteries size and components placement......Dave and I prefer A123's for our installs, except when we need balance weight. I have (2) of Andy Low's 3000 maH 6 cell Sanyo NiCd packs in the nose of my XL, one for RX thru a Fromeco regulator and the other for ECU......no additional lead required. If I swapped out for A123, I would need almost a pound of lead.....so for that easy swap, I should chop the well-designed and supported forward fuse for a fix. Bet that after adding all the glass, CF reinforcement and expoxy, the weight difference between that and 6 oz or less lead in the nose will be inconsequential on the Torus.

Every jet I own needs either big bats or lead including my BVM F-100, F-4, Bandit ARF, BobCat ARF.......so guess BV needs to get a new horse for his next rodeo along with Alan.....

highhorse

My Feedback: (2)

So which weighs more, a pound of lead or a pound of feathers?

Weight is weight whether it's lead or nickel. I have a smoke pump in the nose of mine, and I don't need lead weight either. ;-) But if the weight in one form or another were not required I'd have left the smoke out and you would be flying with better batteries.

But surely, given that every XL for years has had to add weight of some form or another in the nose, the "New and Improved" XL II, the Torus, could have been designed with a longer nose moment to prevent us from having to install components we'd rather not have? It was a missed opportunity to fix a years-old problem the way PST did with their Reaction ARF.

CraigG

My Feedback: (40)

Yikes!......if you're going to let the grandkids play around your jets, keep the cans of spraypaint out of their reach.

Tom Antlfinger

My Feedback: (24)

Hi Craig:

I think Alan saw David Reid's ole Kingcat and decided to splash it.......

Great scheme IMO......no one gonna steal it and no one can critique your flying skills since can't see it, but couldn't pass up Patricia's deal on two of them..........

figueroa

My Feedback: (22)

That's what you get when you fly through a paint ball war game.
Just finished mine, still need to maiden.

Tom Antlfinger

My Feedback: (24)

Don't forget to put a pilot in the cockpit or you gonna have to put a pound of feathers in the nose.........

figueroa

My Feedback: (22)

I have just the wright pilot, he's been in both my Boomerang XL's. He use to be filled with buck shot.
His clothing even matches the plane.

Tom Antlfinger

My Feedback: (24)

geh3

My Feedback: (84)

Iam starting my fuselage mods today. Ihave also decided to do the following to avoid adding lead to the front:
1. Use smaller servos in the horizontal stab.(Futaba S9551) .. this should save over 1.5 oz in the rear that will save a lot up front
2.. Cut out the 2 small metal skids embedded in the lower tail of the booms.. since I only fly from grass.. not sure
how much that will save but even a small weight reduction in the aft section = a much larger one up front!
3. Iwill not fiberglass the stab and wings on this one... I did that on my first one and THAT contributed to extra weight
aft of the CG...which required more up front!
4. Once the fuse is cut, I will install the front retract and Rx battery system (2X5200 mah Duralite Lli-on EXB)
then the main retracts and the turbine since it will be very easy to manupilate the 2 smaller pieces. THEN
after removing that hardware, THEN Iwill rejoin the fuse halves and repaint...
SOhere we go...now for those of you who think I'm completely crazy... just wait until you see the video of the maiden...
AND you will note that Ileft the cross pieces in so the fuse will retain it's shape during this re-do

RCISFUN

My Feedback: (44)

Go Get Em George!

I should have traded Fuselages with you, I had one that was pre-cut in half...LOL

geh3

My Feedback: (84)

Front hatch cut for front battery!
WOWcouldn't do this without my trusty DREMEL!!!

NOTE:Another advantage of doing all fo this is that you can get in these places
and run an extra bead of HYSOL /BVM aeropoxy on some high stress areas!!!

I will put a small platform in here and hold this battery in with some electrical ty-wraps

geh3

My Feedback: (84)

Continuing with front battery install
1. Dremeled a bore for the front battery cable
2. Ditto to install the 2nd battery under the front retract
(this to be held in place by a wood cover under the retract and foam packing)
3 Mounting holes and blind nuts installed for front retract

SURE IS EASY TO WORK ON IN 2 PIECES!!!!
just doing this battery install alone will eliminate almost all need for lead to be added.....

PaulD

My Feedback: (39)

I like the front battery hatch idea. Had no idea there was so much room up there. May do that to mine this winter (I'll watch this thread to see how it turns out first).

Nice job so far.

PaulD

geh3

My Feedback: (84)

THANKS

Yes a 5200 mah pack fits perfect up there
all you need is a Dremel, and some courage
HAH ...my goal is to add "0" ballast to achieve CG!
this will definetly improve the flight envelope!!!

this is a really fun plane!!

figueroa

My Feedback: (22)

The nose is a great place for ballast, I poured 4 ounces of buck shot and some thinned out epoxy into the nose.
I was then able to remove 7 ounces from under the nose wheel retract area.
Keep the photos coming.
Thanks

geh3

My Feedback: (84)

Small platform to mount front battery
allows 1 or 2 ty wraps under it! Iwill
also use heavy dury double sided tape as well
Plenty of room up here even with the platform in!
NOTE:the duralite A123 packs will also fit using this same technique!