oldest jet in the world to fly again
03-05-2013 | 10:06 AM
#1
Thread Starter
03-06-2013 | 03:01 AM
#7
RE: oldest jet in the world to fly again
ORIGINAL: tow
I belive the oldest jet fighter in the world to be the ME-262...........???
I belive the oldest jet fighter in the world to be the ME-262...........???
03-06-2013 | 05:14 AM
#9
RE: oldest jet in the world to fly again
Komet 163 was not a true jet, it was rocket powered.
The HE280 first prototype was completed in the summer of 1940, but the HeS 8 intended to power it was running into difficulties. On 22 September 1940, while work on the engine continued, the first prototype started glide tests with ballast hung in place of its engines. It would be another six months before Fritz Schäfer would take the second prototype into the air under its own power, on 30 March 1941. The type was then demonstrated to Ernst Udet, head of RLM's development wing, on 5 April, but like its predecessor, it apparently failed to make an impression.
Engine problems continued to plague the project. In 1942, the RLM had ordered Heinkel to abandon the HeS 8 and HeS 30 to focus all development on a follow-on engine, the HeS 011, a much more advanced (and therefore problematic) design. Meanwhile, the first He 280 prototype had been re-equipped with pulsejets and was towed aloft to test them. Bad weather caused the aircraft to ice up, however, and before the jets could be tested, pilot Helmut Schenk became the first person to put an air powered ejection seat to use. The seat worked perfectly, but the aircraft was lost, and never found.
On 27 March, Erhard Milch cancelled the project. The Jumo 004-powered Me 262 appeared to have most of the qualities of the He 280, but was better matched to its engine. Heinkel was ordered to abandon the He 280 and focus attention on bomber development and construction.
The Whittle E.28/39 was delivered to Brockworth for ground tests beginning on 7 April 1941, using a non-flightworthy version of the Power Jets W.1 engine. These included some short "hops" of about 6 ft in height from the grass airfield. With these initial tests satisfactorily completed, the aircraft was fitted with a flightworthy engine rated for 10 hours use, and then transferred to Cranwell which had a long runway. On 15 May 1941, Gloster's Chief Test Pilot, Flight Lieutenant Gerry Sayer flew the aircraft under jet power for the first time from RAF Cranwell, near Sleaford in Lincolnshire, in a flight lasting 17 minutes.
The 262 first flew 18 July 1942 in Leipheim near Günzburg, Germany, piloted by Fritz Wendel. This was almost nine months ahead of the British Gloster Meteor's first flight on 5 March 1943.
However, i do not know of any original 262 airframes that are flying?
So, when this Meteor flys it will be "The oldest jet fighter in the world" unless someone gets a HE262 going..... or a Whittle!.
Paul G
The HE280 first prototype was completed in the summer of 1940, but the HeS 8 intended to power it was running into difficulties. On 22 September 1940, while work on the engine continued, the first prototype started glide tests with ballast hung in place of its engines. It would be another six months before Fritz Schäfer would take the second prototype into the air under its own power, on 30 March 1941. The type was then demonstrated to Ernst Udet, head of RLM's development wing, on 5 April, but like its predecessor, it apparently failed to make an impression.
Engine problems continued to plague the project. In 1942, the RLM had ordered Heinkel to abandon the HeS 8 and HeS 30 to focus all development on a follow-on engine, the HeS 011, a much more advanced (and therefore problematic) design. Meanwhile, the first He 280 prototype had been re-equipped with pulsejets and was towed aloft to test them. Bad weather caused the aircraft to ice up, however, and before the jets could be tested, pilot Helmut Schenk became the first person to put an air powered ejection seat to use. The seat worked perfectly, but the aircraft was lost, and never found.
On 27 March, Erhard Milch cancelled the project. The Jumo 004-powered Me 262 appeared to have most of the qualities of the He 280, but was better matched to its engine. Heinkel was ordered to abandon the He 280 and focus attention on bomber development and construction.
The Whittle E.28/39 was delivered to Brockworth for ground tests beginning on 7 April 1941, using a non-flightworthy version of the Power Jets W.1 engine. These included some short "hops" of about 6 ft in height from the grass airfield. With these initial tests satisfactorily completed, the aircraft was fitted with a flightworthy engine rated for 10 hours use, and then transferred to Cranwell which had a long runway. On 15 May 1941, Gloster's Chief Test Pilot, Flight Lieutenant Gerry Sayer flew the aircraft under jet power for the first time from RAF Cranwell, near Sleaford in Lincolnshire, in a flight lasting 17 minutes.
The 262 first flew 18 July 1942 in Leipheim near Günzburg, Germany, piloted by Fritz Wendel. This was almost nine months ahead of the British Gloster Meteor's first flight on 5 March 1943.
However, i do not know of any original 262 airframes that are flying?
So, when this Meteor flys it will be "The oldest jet fighter in the world" unless someone gets a HE262 going..... or a Whittle!.
Paul G
03-06-2013 | 08:53 AM
#10
RE: oldest jet in the world to fly again
hi
i do not post that much on rcu
the me262 made by stormbirds.com to my understanding they got original werknr from the messeschmit foundation.
because they reversed engineerd an original .
only the engines are prat&whitney .
i do not post that much on rcu
the me262 made by stormbirds.com to my understanding they got original werknr from the messeschmit foundation.
because they reversed engineerd an original .
only the engines are prat&whitney .
03-06-2013 | 09:36 AM
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From: Namsostrondelag, NORWAY
RE: oldest jet in the world to fly again
If we are talking oldest jet still flying it still is the 262.. Reason why there aint any airworthy originals today should be obivious. If the coin flipped the other way ther would`nt be any Meteors flying today either....... (No politics Please)
03-06-2013 | 02:32 PM
#14
RE: oldest jet in the world to fly again
ORIGINAL: GrayUK
Komet 163 was not a true jet, it was rocket powered.
The HE280 first prototype was completed in the summer of 1940, but the HeS 8 intended to power it was running into difficulties. On 22 September 1940, while work on the engine continued, the first prototype started glide tests with ballast hung in place of its engines. It would be another six months before Fritz Schäfer would take the second prototype into the air under its own power, on 30 March 1941. The type was then demonstrated to Ernst Udet, head of RLM's development wing, on 5 April, but like its predecessor, it apparently failed to make an impression.
Engine problems continued to plague the project. In 1942, the RLM had ordered Heinkel to abandon the HeS 8 and HeS 30 to focus all development on a follow-on engine, the HeS 011, a much more advanced (and therefore problematic) design. Meanwhile, the first He 280 prototype had been re-equipped with pulsejets and was towed aloft to test them. Bad weather caused the aircraft to ice up, however, and before the jets could be tested, pilot Helmut Schenk became the first person to put an air powered ejection seat to use. The seat worked perfectly, but the aircraft was lost, and never found.
On 27 March, Erhard Milch cancelled the project. The Jumo 004-powered Me 262 appeared to have most of the qualities of the He 280, but was better matched to its engine. Heinkel was ordered to abandon the He 280 and focus attention on bomber development and construction.
The Whittle E.28/39 was delivered to Brockworth for ground tests beginning on 7 April 1941, using a non-flightworthy version of the Power Jets W.1 engine. These included some short ''hops'' of about 6 ft in height from the grass airfield. With these initial tests satisfactorily completed, the aircraft was fitted with a flightworthy engine rated for 10 hours use, and then transferred to Cranwell which had a long runway. On 15 May 1941, Gloster's Chief Test Pilot, Flight Lieutenant Gerry Sayer flew the aircraft under jet power for the first time from RAF Cranwell, near Sleaford in Lincolnshire, in a flight lasting 17 minutes.
The 262 first flew 18 July 1942 in Leipheim near Günzburg, Germany, piloted by Fritz Wendel. This was almost nine months ahead of the British Gloster Meteor's first flight on 5 March 1943.
However, i do not know of any original 262 airframes that are flying?
So, when this Meteor flys it will be ''The oldest jet fighter in the world'' unless someone gets a HE262 going..... or a Whittle!.
Paul G
Komet 163 was not a true jet, it was rocket powered.
The HE280 first prototype was completed in the summer of 1940, but the HeS 8 intended to power it was running into difficulties. On 22 September 1940, while work on the engine continued, the first prototype started glide tests with ballast hung in place of its engines. It would be another six months before Fritz Schäfer would take the second prototype into the air under its own power, on 30 March 1941. The type was then demonstrated to Ernst Udet, head of RLM's development wing, on 5 April, but like its predecessor, it apparently failed to make an impression.
Engine problems continued to plague the project. In 1942, the RLM had ordered Heinkel to abandon the HeS 8 and HeS 30 to focus all development on a follow-on engine, the HeS 011, a much more advanced (and therefore problematic) design. Meanwhile, the first He 280 prototype had been re-equipped with pulsejets and was towed aloft to test them. Bad weather caused the aircraft to ice up, however, and before the jets could be tested, pilot Helmut Schenk became the first person to put an air powered ejection seat to use. The seat worked perfectly, but the aircraft was lost, and never found.
On 27 March, Erhard Milch cancelled the project. The Jumo 004-powered Me 262 appeared to have most of the qualities of the He 280, but was better matched to its engine. Heinkel was ordered to abandon the He 280 and focus attention on bomber development and construction.
The Whittle E.28/39 was delivered to Brockworth for ground tests beginning on 7 April 1941, using a non-flightworthy version of the Power Jets W.1 engine. These included some short ''hops'' of about 6 ft in height from the grass airfield. With these initial tests satisfactorily completed, the aircraft was fitted with a flightworthy engine rated for 10 hours use, and then transferred to Cranwell which had a long runway. On 15 May 1941, Gloster's Chief Test Pilot, Flight Lieutenant Gerry Sayer flew the aircraft under jet power for the first time from RAF Cranwell, near Sleaford in Lincolnshire, in a flight lasting 17 minutes.
The 262 first flew 18 July 1942 in Leipheim near Günzburg, Germany, piloted by Fritz Wendel. This was almost nine months ahead of the British Gloster Meteor's first flight on 5 March 1943.
However, i do not know of any original 262 airframes that are flying?
So, when this Meteor flys it will be ''The oldest jet fighter in the world'' unless someone gets a HE262 going..... or a Whittle!.
Paul G
Setting aside the silly argument for a moment, how brave were the WWII test pilots??
"Meanwhile, the first He 280 prototype had been re-equipped with pulsejets and was towed aloft to test them. Bad weather caused the aircraft to ice up, however, and before the jets could be tested, pilot Helmut Schenk became the first person to put an air powered ejection seat to use. The seat worked perfectly, but the aircraft was lost, and never found."
Helmut must have had big ones!!
Roger
03-07-2013 | 02:37 AM
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From: Wylie,
TX
RE: oldest jet in the world to fly again
Not trying to whiz in anyone's Cheerios. This plane was credited for only 14 V1 kills of the over 10,500 V1 rockets launched at Britain during the war. Granted it was the threshold of jet technology but they canned this model when the V2 came out because it couldn't even get close to shooting one down. Still a magnificent piece of history. Glad we could enjoy the ressurection.</p>
03-07-2013 | 03:17 AM
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From: Namsostrondelag, NORWAY
RE: oldest jet in the world to fly again
The heading on this thread says "Oldest jet in the world to fly again"....... It doesn`t say "still flying". My mistake Whilst the Meteor was a great achievment for its time, and I`m taking my hat off for the people who manage to keeping an example airworthy, it`s been stated not to be the oldest in the world. That was my point! . Frank Whittle were the first to patent the turbojet engine. In the time German engineers were way ahead of that. The Me-262 were the first true jet-fighter to see service and combat. We can agree on that I think. No belitteling of others.
03-07-2013 | 03:22 AM
#19
RE: oldest jet in the world to fly again
ORIGINAL: pmerritt
Not trying to whiz in anyone's Cheerios. This plane was credited for only 14 V1 kills of the over 10,500 V1 rockets launched at Britain during the war. Granted it was the threshold of jet technology but they canned this model when the V2 came out because it couldn't even get close to shooting one down. Still a magnificent piece of history. Glad we could enjoy the ressurection.</p>
Not trying to whiz in anyone's Cheerios. This plane was credited for only 14 V1 kills of the over 10,500 V1 rockets launched at Britain during the war. Granted it was the threshold of jet technology but they canned this model when the V2 came out because it couldn't even get close to shooting one down. Still a magnificent piece of history. Glad we could enjoy the ressurection.</p>
I think the first air to air missile came into service in 1956 called the Aim-4- Falcon with the US airforce.
03-07-2013 | 07:16 AM
#20
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RE: oldest jet in the world to fly again
ORIGINAL: Vincent
For the record the first airframe to fly with a turbo jet engine was the German Heinkel HE 178. It flew on Aug 8 1939.
Vin...
For the record the first airframe to fly with a turbo jet engine was the German Heinkel HE 178. It flew on Aug 8 1939.
Vin...
I was helping my daughter on a timeline in aviation project for school and discovered the HE 178 was the first jet aircraft to fly and the ME 262 is the first jet fighter to fly.
Her school notes made no mention of any German accomplishments and gave Great Britain credit for development of the turbine engine when in fact it was independently co-developed by Great Britain and Germany around the same time. I found this disappointing and so we made sure to set the record straight.
As a side note, much of the Saturn V rocket came from German know how but you don't find much credit for that either.
03-07-2013 | 09:44 AM
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From: Namsostrondelag, NORWAY
RE: oldest jet in the world to fly again
ORIGINAL: Quikturn
+1
I was helping my daughter on a timeline in aviation project for school and discovered the HE 178 was the first jet aircraft to fly and the ME 262 is the first jet fighter to fly.
Her school notes made no mention of any German accomplishments and gave Great Britain credit for development of the turbine engine when in fact it was independently co-developed by Great Britain and Germany around the same time. I found this disappointing and so we made sure to set the record straight.
As a side note, much of the Saturn V rocket came from German know how but you don't find much credit for that either.
ORIGINAL: Vincent
For the record the first airframe to fly with a turbo jet engine was the German Heinkel HE 178. It flew on Aug 8 1939.
Vin...
For the record the first airframe to fly with a turbo jet engine was the German Heinkel HE 178. It flew on Aug 8 1939.
Vin...
I was helping my daughter on a timeline in aviation project for school and discovered the HE 178 was the first jet aircraft to fly and the ME 262 is the first jet fighter to fly.
Her school notes made no mention of any German accomplishments and gave Great Britain credit for development of the turbine engine when in fact it was independently co-developed by Great Britain and Germany around the same time. I found this disappointing and so we made sure to set the record straight.
As a side note, much of the Saturn V rocket came from German know how but you don't find much credit for that either.
03-08-2013 | 02:34 PM
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From: Namsostrondelag, NORWAY
RE: oldest jet in the world to fly again
