Pulse Jets " Days of Speed and Thunder "
Pulse Jets " Days of Speed and Thunder "
01-09-2014, 02:56 AM
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Rc groups
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2066583
A link to the rc groups pulse jet forum
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2066583
A link to the rc groups pulse jet forum
01-09-2014, 03:05 AM
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01-09-2014, 04:58 AM
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01-09-2014, 05:06 AM
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Anyone ACTUALLY put one of the HK pulsejets on a model and got it to fly? From what I've seen they are a complete pig to get started or come with a faulty flow injector. Have only seen static testing of these things on YouTube so far and they've been out for 3 months and sold out fairly quickly.
01-09-2014, 05:17 AM
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I have only seen some videos from Chris Lomas on youtube where he converts them to the Hobby King to methanol ..and gets them to start very easily
Im a bit the same as you I have not seen one fly
Im a bit the same as you I have not seen one fly
01-09-2014, 08:49 AM
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01-09-2014, 05:41 PM
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Hubert_64 in the forum http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2066583
builds and sells
planes
inferno , superscout and virus
engines
90ER , 100ER and the 140ER
http://www.pulsotriebwerk.de/index.html?galerie
builds and sells
planes
inferno , superscout and virus
engines
90ER , 100ER and the 140ER
http://www.pulsotriebwerk.de/index.html?galerie
Last edited by FasTest66; 01-09-2014 at 05:49 PM. Reason: Added URL
01-12-2014, 04:41 AM
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Yeah searching the web there does seem to be no one flying them ...I did have a look at the HK jets that Chris Lomas has modified and run on methanol and they are reliable and easy to start ..
he also has a set up with a clyne regulator and a bladder style tank that is used for reliable running .. fingers crossed there will be one in the air soon
he also has a set up with a clyne regulator and a bladder style tank that is used for reliable running .. fingers crossed there will be one in the air soon
01-12-2014, 06:08 AM
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01-12-2014, 07:32 AM
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Here is an eye opener for any of you entertaining the idea of building and flying pulse jets. Take a look at the regulations AMA Document 510-Q (I have included with this post) that the AMA came up with for us flyers in the US.
According to this document, the cross section of the smallest diameter of the tailpipe, can not exceed 1.25 square inches. This regulation would eliminate the use of all but the smallest pulse jet engines available to us today (Dynajet, HK Jet, OS Jet, Bailey Jet) to name a few.
You would not be able to operate the Inferno, Scout, or Virus type of pulse jet planes in the US, because of the tailpipe size restriction the AMA puts on pulse jet engines in the US. I got into a disagreement with another RCU member in another post, that said as an AMA member you were forbidden to operate a plane powered by any engine with a tailpipe exceeding 1.25 sq. in. in the US, even if you were on private land. He cited that this was because of insurance issues. I'm not sure if this is correct, and am contacting AMA on this issue.
The 510-Q pulse jet document leaves a lot open to interpretation. Another example is the declaration requirement in 9A of 510-Q. It says a high speed aircraft designed to fly 150 mph or faster, but doesn't actually say that you have to fly the plane at that speed, only that you fly a plane designed for this speed. The 510-Q document was approved in 2002, but before that I think the only requirement for RC pulse jet flying was to obtain a turbine waiver, which only requires a declaration of 50 hours with a plane designed for 100 mph or faster. At 100 mph there are a lot of planes that could be used for the speed declaration purpose, but at 150 mph you almost have to get into yet another area of RC modeling, just to have a plane to qualify you to for the 150 mph declaration. I highly doubt that many planes with a 1.25 sq. in. tail pipe jet will get anywhere near 150 mph, so where did they come up with that number?
As it states at the bottom of 510-Q, any infractions of the rules and you could loose your AMA membership.
I almost seems if you want to get serious about pulse jets in the US, you can't be a member of AMA.
Greg
According to this document, the cross section of the smallest diameter of the tailpipe, can not exceed 1.25 square inches. This regulation would eliminate the use of all but the smallest pulse jet engines available to us today (Dynajet, HK Jet, OS Jet, Bailey Jet) to name a few.
You would not be able to operate the Inferno, Scout, or Virus type of pulse jet planes in the US, because of the tailpipe size restriction the AMA puts on pulse jet engines in the US. I got into a disagreement with another RCU member in another post, that said as an AMA member you were forbidden to operate a plane powered by any engine with a tailpipe exceeding 1.25 sq. in. in the US, even if you were on private land. He cited that this was because of insurance issues. I'm not sure if this is correct, and am contacting AMA on this issue.
The 510-Q pulse jet document leaves a lot open to interpretation. Another example is the declaration requirement in 9A of 510-Q. It says a high speed aircraft designed to fly 150 mph or faster, but doesn't actually say that you have to fly the plane at that speed, only that you fly a plane designed for this speed. The 510-Q document was approved in 2002, but before that I think the only requirement for RC pulse jet flying was to obtain a turbine waiver, which only requires a declaration of 50 hours with a plane designed for 100 mph or faster. At 100 mph there are a lot of planes that could be used for the speed declaration purpose, but at 150 mph you almost have to get into yet another area of RC modeling, just to have a plane to qualify you to for the 150 mph declaration. I highly doubt that many planes with a 1.25 sq. in. tail pipe jet will get anywhere near 150 mph, so where did they come up with that number?
As it states at the bottom of 510-Q, any infractions of the rules and you could loose your AMA membership.
I almost seems if you want to get serious about pulse jets in the US, you can't be a member of AMA.
Greg
Last edited by OldRookie; 01-12-2014 at 08:08 AM.
01-12-2014, 08:00 PM
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01-13-2014, 02:22 AM
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Thanks Old Rookie, for posting the AMA Safety Regs on operating RC pulse jets. This is a Safety Code requirement for AMA members in the USA. This reg was established in 2002 as an alternate for pilots wishing to fly RC jets but not be certified for a turbine waiver. With the advent of the HK pulse jet there is renewed activity in the RC pulse jet area. I personally feel that the current reg, AMA Doc # 510Q, should be updated and trust that the jet community can provide some realistic inputs to this process. The prerequisite requirement of 50 flights with an RC model capable of 150 MPH should be lowered to 100 MPH-the same as for turbine jets. The intent of this requirement is to demonstrate proficiency with a high performance model. The term "capable" should also be revised to state that the model must be flown at this speed or greater. Just about any high performance model can be underpowered and flown at a far lower speed than what is advertised. This does not meet the intent of the speed requirement. Another option to consider are wheel brakes. if the pulse jet model is intended to takeoff and land on landing gear. Finally, a RC failsafe system should be required to shut off the pulse jet in case of a loss of signal or other out-of-control situation. Note that there is no ECU with a pulse jet but most modern RC systems can be programmed for a failsafe engine shutoff situation. These are my suggestions and I look forward to any discussion or comments. Keep in mind that the AMA Safety Code and Regulations are driven by insurance liability requirements and probably soon, FAA requirements.
Rgds,
Art ARRO
Rgds,
Art ARRO
01-13-2014, 02:47 AM
#17
Anyone ACTUALLY put one of the HK pulsejets on a model and got it to fly? From what I've seen they are a complete pig to get started or come with a faulty flow injector. Have only seen static testing of these things on YouTube so far and they've been out for 3 months and sold out fairly quickly.
Pulsejets are sort of an Urban legend. They are super easy to manufacture from cheap materials, runs on any fuel, everybody wants one, still no one seen or uses them, and from the few who try even fewer succeed.
A speedster turbine delta are a BNF shelf product where the same thing with a pulso on top would need ALOT of development and testing before working well.
01-13-2014, 08:25 AM
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Here is an eye opener for any of you entertaining the idea of building and flying pulse jets. Take a look at the regulations AMA Document 510-Q (I have included with this post) that the AMA came up with for us flyers in the US.
According to this document, the cross section of the smallest diameter of the tailpipe, can not exceed 1.25 square inches. This regulation would eliminate the use of all but the smallest pulse jet engines available to us today (Dynajet, HK Jet, OS Jet, Bailey Jet) to name a few.
You would not be able to operate the Inferno, Scout, or Virus type of pulse jet planes in the US, because of the tailpipe size restriction the AMA puts on pulse jet engines in the US. I got into a disagreement with another RCU member in another post, that said as an AMA member you were forbidden to operate a plane powered by any engine with a tailpipe exceeding 1.25 sq. in. in the US, even if you were on private land. He cited that this was because of insurance issues. I'm not sure if this is correct, and am contacting AMA on this issue.
The 510-Q pulse jet document leaves a lot open to interpretation. Another example is the declaration requirement in 9A of 510-Q. It says a high speed aircraft designed to fly 150 mph or faster, but doesn't actually say that you have to fly the plane at that speed, only that you fly a plane designed for this speed. The 510-Q document was approved in 2002, but before that I think the only requirement for RC pulse jet flying was to obtain a turbine waiver, which only requires a declaration of 50 hours with a plane designed for 100 mph or faster. At 100 mph there are a lot of planes that could be used for the speed declaration purpose, but at 150 mph you almost have to get into yet another area of RC modeling, just to have a plane to qualify you to for the 150 mph declaration. I highly doubt that many planes with a 1.25 sq. in. tail pipe jet will get anywhere near 150 mph, so where did they come up with that number?
As it states at the bottom of 510-Q, any infractions of the rules and you could loose your AMA membership.
I almost seems if you want to get serious about pulse jets in the US, you can't be a member of AMA.
Greg
According to this document, the cross section of the smallest diameter of the tailpipe, can not exceed 1.25 square inches. This regulation would eliminate the use of all but the smallest pulse jet engines available to us today (Dynajet, HK Jet, OS Jet, Bailey Jet) to name a few.
You would not be able to operate the Inferno, Scout, or Virus type of pulse jet planes in the US, because of the tailpipe size restriction the AMA puts on pulse jet engines in the US. I got into a disagreement with another RCU member in another post, that said as an AMA member you were forbidden to operate a plane powered by any engine with a tailpipe exceeding 1.25 sq. in. in the US, even if you were on private land. He cited that this was because of insurance issues. I'm not sure if this is correct, and am contacting AMA on this issue.
The 510-Q pulse jet document leaves a lot open to interpretation. Another example is the declaration requirement in 9A of 510-Q. It says a high speed aircraft designed to fly 150 mph or faster, but doesn't actually say that you have to fly the plane at that speed, only that you fly a plane designed for this speed. The 510-Q document was approved in 2002, but before that I think the only requirement for RC pulse jet flying was to obtain a turbine waiver, which only requires a declaration of 50 hours with a plane designed for 100 mph or faster. At 100 mph there are a lot of planes that could be used for the speed declaration purpose, but at 150 mph you almost have to get into yet another area of RC modeling, just to have a plane to qualify you to for the 150 mph declaration. I highly doubt that many planes with a 1.25 sq. in. tail pipe jet will get anywhere near 150 mph, so where did they come up with that number?
As it states at the bottom of 510-Q, any infractions of the rules and you could loose your AMA membership.
I almost seems if you want to get serious about pulse jets in the US, you can't be a member of AMA.
Greg
You can fly your pulse jet planes anywhere without any fear of loosing your AMA privileges. The issue of flying without complying with 510-Q is insurance. If you don't comply AMA doesn't cover you and you are liable for damages.
I also questioned the declaration you have to sign for having flown for 50 hours with a plane that is designed for 150 mph or faster. I asked if you just had to fly an airframe designed for 150+ at the 150+ speed for the 50 hours, or could you fly the same airframe at less than 150 mph and still claim the flights on the declaration. Example...Diamond Dust says on the box flown at 200 mph. If I fly this airframe at 110 mph with my OS 32SX with a pipe, is it OK to claim this on the declaration? He agreed that some of the things in 510-Q are certainly open to interpretation, and will get back to me tomorrow.
I also recommended they take another look at the 1.25 tail pipe limitation. Most of the pulse jets flown in Europe are the 8, 10, and 16 lb thrust engines. We would then be able to fly the Inferno, Scout, or Virus pulse jet airframes made for pulse jets.
He said that mine was the third call this month on the same things, and that they need to take a look at 510-Q again. HK has reopened the pulse jet genre in the US, and I truely hope it grows to the same level as pulse jet flying in Europe. In Europe they can get more pulse jet flyers and planes at one contest than we have in the whole US.
If you have any concerns on these issues, I would recommend contacting AMA with your concerns. This would help give the pulse jet enthusiasts a bigger voice at the AMA.
Greg
Last edited by OldRookie; 01-13-2014 at 08:31 AM.
01-13-2014, 08:42 PM
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01-13-2014, 08:45 PM
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01-13-2014, 08:45 PM
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01-16-2014, 09:28 PM
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Some details on the pulse jets from Germany
Super Scout:
length 154 cm; wingspan 110cm; weight raw from the mould 2600g
Engine: 90mm / 100mm pulsejet or turbine from 80N - 200N
Virus:
length: 125 cm; wingspan 105cm; weight raw from the mould 2200g
Engine 90mm pulsejet or turbine from 60N - 160N
Inferno:
length: 125 cm; wingspan 105cm; weight raw from the mould 2200g
Engine 90mm pulsejet or turbine from 60N - 160N
skyrunner:
length: 140cm; wingspan ??? weight ???
Engine : pulsejet 75mm/ 90mm or turbine Kolibri 15N to Wren 40N ( 60N)
Super Scout:
length 154 cm; wingspan 110cm; weight raw from the mould 2600g
Engine: 90mm / 100mm pulsejet or turbine from 80N - 200N
Virus:
length: 125 cm; wingspan 105cm; weight raw from the mould 2200g
Engine 90mm pulsejet or turbine from 60N - 160N
Inferno:
length: 125 cm; wingspan 105cm; weight raw from the mould 2200g
Engine 90mm pulsejet or turbine from 60N - 160N
skyrunner:
length: 140cm; wingspan ??? weight ???
Engine : pulsejet 75mm/ 90mm or turbine Kolibri 15N to Wren 40N ( 60N)
01-16-2014, 09:29 PM
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01-17-2014, 12:59 AM
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