What "real" effect do missile rails have on the flight surfaces on our model jets without the ordnance on them? Just curious if anyone knows.

Andy

I dont think the rails on an F-16 will matter. I have flown 2 Avonds 16s with rails for several years. The problem may arise when you put missiles on them. On my first 16 I put scale AIM-9s on the rails which caused wing flutter and ultimately the loss of the airplane. The last time I checked, PA recommends his F16 not be flown with the external stores. In PAs defense he was excellent to work with following my loss. He put out an AD covering the problem and sent all owners a modification to prevent further losses. I have bought two more of his airplanes since then. Both are excellent flyers. We dont really check the loads placed on the wings with external stores and in some cases it may be bad news.

On my Rafale from xtreme jets I have flown with only the rails without any noticeable effects and now I fly with the missiles on all the time and again no noticeable change in flight characteristics.


Alan

No effect at all imo after owning two AD and one Avonds F-16`s. Installing rockets does require a little trimming though.
V..

No effect on our SM F-16's.

Depends very much on the particular rails in question, as well as how well they have been mounted.

I've seen rails that are so badly mounted (not parallel to the centreline) that they cause yaw.

Some rails are also heavy enough to cause a CG change when they are added or removed.

How about the rails that mount under a wing?

None at all: as on most models they didn´t add much drag... perhaps just a little yawing at certain speeds.

However, they can be devastating to the wings if you need to land out of the runway or run out of it.. quite a common thing if you have a flameout.


Enrique

I was thinking in particular the rails under the F4 Phantom wings. Mine are mounted ROCK solid and perm. Some people I have talked to made them removable. The the only thing removable on mine is the ordnance.

I have a full ordinance set for my F-16 and plan on using it. I think the pylons will probably "give" before the wings do.
Will try it one station at a time, and keep adding pairs.

Aparently on the Byron F-16, they do help the slow speed performance..and that thing can fly incredibly slow at a very high alpha. Never noticed much of a difference on my Tamjets, 'cept that it looks cool.

Underwing pylons, on the BVM F-86 (small one) they help directional quite a bit..it really grooves with them and the tanks on...plus they protect the belly in case of a gear up....

anyone has experience flying the FB Rafale with external tanks. I have flown mine with rails and missiles without issue, but i don't know what to expect with the tanks, furthermore, i find their attaching methode to be weak somehow.
I don't even want to think of the possibility to have one of attaching points give up during flight... It would be a total disaster!!!

Regards.
Dany

I used the dowel method on my F4 but I improvised. I grinded off the paint to the fiberglass and then drilled holes about 1/2" appart all along where the pilon mounts. Also did the same on the bottom of the pilons. I then glued both surfaces with Hysol and secured it all down with wood screws in the dowels. The wing would rip in half before they come off!

Andy

Anyone walked into , or Accidentally Kicked their Missile Rail ? Pretty much in the way. we can't tell any difference in the flight of my JL F-16 at all.

Right before the maiden on my SM F16 I was taking it off the stand and flipping it upright to put on the ground. Of course the missile rail hit my leg and snapped in half No difference in flight and I'll put up with them 'til they really pee me off.

Well, they can be a problem if somehow part of the attachment breaks and it's dangling/flopping in the breeze. My Gripen was tough to control after semi-bad TO broke one of the two mount screws......but got it back OK after a nervous circuit. I (still) use 4-40 nylon cap screw for easy breakaway....

Ray

I'll let you know.......I'm sure I'll do that once I finish the build

Dany,

You'll need more power on landings because the drag will be higher. Throttle management is going to be more critical with the external tanks during the flare. Speed will bleed off fast at idle and be sure you’re fast enough to the runway to make a good landing.

I've got one missile rail that's slightly angled down and I notice my wings wobble or rock slightly at higher speeds. I don't normally fly my Rafale at full throttle straight and level for very long.

And how do you install rails in a wing with washout? with the same washout of the tip or aligned with the root?

I ask because I intend scratch build a F9F-5 Phanter with washout in the tips and I don't know if the tip tanks must be fitted aligned with the tip airfoil or with the root airfoil.

BR

Jesus

The real effect of missile rails is to prevent or minimising the WINGTIP VORTEX. Look for "WINGTIP VORTEX" in wikipedia.

Hello JesĂşs:

Yo pienso que deberĂ*a de seguir el perfil, al igual que en el F-16 el soporte del misil y el propio misil tienen tambien washout.

I think that yes.

Regards from Spain.

Carlos.
________________________________________

http://cmjets.blogspot.com/

I use the wing tip missle rails as wing tip skids ever time I land my F-18. It saves the paint on the wings.

I have the FB wing tanks mounted on my extreme Rafale and a centerline wet smoke tank, with this configuration i need a nice amount of dowm elevator for level flight. with just the centerline tank no tirm needed.
The plane feels sluggish in turns and you will need more power for landings but it does look nice in the air




Alan

Airforce 7,

flying with external tanks requires more power on landings due to higher drag. Do you mean that i should com in faster?? we have a rather short runway (110m of asphalt) do you think it is enough with the tanks on.
Actually i haven't flown the Rafale on our runway, but did the maiden on much longer runway, but took the precaution to take measurements similar to our field and did my two flights "with the limits" take off/landing in less then 100 meters.
But i don't know with the tanks on...
Any suggestion?
Thanks/.
Dany

Dany,

I've flown the X-tremejets and the FB Rafales. They are nearly identical except for a few differences in the way the hatches attach, paint finish and steering (gear). What I've experienced is that you can make a good landing in a short distance if you manage the throttle well through the landing pattern. You can make the landings on your short airstrip no problem given that your approach is at the right angle of attack and speed. The external tanks will require you to relearn the pattern and approach with the throttle at a different position on the transmitter. Fortunately the Rafale airframe is so forgiving in terms of stall characteristics that you can "work" the landing over the runway with the throttle at idle and slow it down if you come in to fast. As for your take-offs, I think your airstrip is too short for a scale take-off. You’re likely going to have to leap off the runway by the time you reach the end. If the nose wheel steering is perfectly trimmed and can go full throttle from the start then you are in good shape. I typically do a slow ground roll to establish good tracking straight down the runway and then go full throttle for the takeoff about (122-152 meters) 400-500 feet down the runway.

Ken