Accessories Needed for F-18F
 

Hi Everyone,

I am planning on getting a Skymaster F-18F with retracts, airbrake, etc...the whole works except bombs.

I am planning to put a P-120SE in it for power.

Since I am new to this whole thing, I need some advice on what else I need to make it all work.

For example:

What is the recommended Radio System for a large turbine?
Do I need a Weatronic box to control all the gizmos in the Jet?
What type and how many air valves do I need to actuate the gear, gear doors, and airbrake?
Do I need some sort of power management box for the jet's electrical systems?
Do I need any other exotic electronic devices to operate the jet?

I thank you for any help you can provide.

I am not planning to actually FLY this model, just for display for now.
I want all parts to operate as if it were a flying model.
At some point in the future I might learn to fly...

Bernard

RE: Accessories Needed for F-18F
 

Hello:

If you actually want to fly it, you might consider a more powerfull turbine, a Rhino or a larger JetCat. You need 11 door/speed brake cylinders, brake system valve , retract valve, speed brake valve. You do not have to have a power box, but they are very usefull. If you are going to display the model, just buy the retracts and hinge the doors (which is the most painfull part of the assembly).

Rob B.

RE: Accessories Needed for F-18F
 

Hi Bernard, for power I would go with something a bit bigger if yuo are planning to install all missiles and external tanks. Over 30lbs of thust... like the Rhino or similar.

For radio go with with any 9 channel or more radio, futaba or jr will do the job perfectly. You may also check the new Spektrum.
No need for weatronics reciever if you do not want to spend the extra dollars.
For valves use a UP3 valve, this will automatically control gear doors and retracts in one simple step. Very plug and play.
For the airbrakes I used two thin servos to actuate the small doors. Much simple than installing another air system. But if you go with an air system a regular retract valeve will do.
In the one I had I used a Powerbox, excelent product and works great. Two duralite for the powerpox and one for the turbine.
Remember to install a UAT, 100% necesary in my opinion...:)
Basically that is it.

Let me know if you have any questions.

Michel

RE: Accessories Needed for F-18F
 

Thank you guys for the responses.

The reason I picked the JetCat is because I want to use the Kerosene Starter Plug, no Propane, to simplify things internally.

Do other turbine brands have kerosene start feature?

The new 120SE has 28lbs. thrust...is that not enough? If I do not use the bombs and external tanks, will 28lbs. be enough?

Michel, who makes the "UP3" valve you refer to?

Also, is there a way to make the retracts and gear doors open and close slowly, more realistically?

Thanks for all your help!

Bernard

RE: Accessories Needed for F-18F
 

Hi Bernard the P120 will work ok without the external tanks. I had a Super Eagle (30lbs og thust) in mine.
The UP3 valve you can get it with Todd from DreamworksRC. This valve will make things move a bit more scale. If you want the gear doors to move slower you could put some restrictors in the airlines. This are also available from Todd.

Michel

RE: Accessories Needed for F-18F
 

Great.

Thank you for the help!

Bernard

RE: Accessories Needed for F-18F
 

Hello, Me again,

I have another question about the radio.
For an F-18F (1:8 scale), how many channels do I actually need?

Elevator, Rudder, Aileron, Throttle - that's 4 so far.
Flaps, Airbrakes - 2 more, right?
Gear Up, Gear Dn, Wheel Brakes - 3 more?

Is that correct?

I assume nosewheel steering is connected to the Rudder channel?

Also, I have seen F-18's with both Ailerons and Flaps, and some with only Flaps...which configuration is correct?

Thanks again for all the help.

Bernard

RE: Accessories Needed for F-18F
 

You will need 9 channels if going with all the extras.
The scale F-18 has ailerons and flaps.

Michel

RE: Accessories Needed for F-18F
 

Hi Michel,

Thanks again for the response.

One more question for now, hope you can answer this:

The Weatronic 12-20R - I am having trouble understanding exactly what this device does.
It is a Receiver, right? So I would use this instead of the Rx that comes with my Tx, right?
Is this device also a power distribution/power filtering system? If I had the 12-20R, would I still want a Powerbox?
(Reading the specs at weatronic-usa.com still leaves me full of questions)

Also, on a side note, the Flaps - are they just all up or all down? This function is assigned to just a switch on the Tx?
In other words, no proportional control of flaps right? No 10% flaps for takeoff or 30% for Base Leg for example...?
Is this the same behavior with the airbrakes - open or closed, no in between?

Thank you for all your help!

Bernard

RE: Accessories Needed for F-18F
 

Hi Bernard, not sure about the Weatronics, I do not use that device.

About the flaps in my case I put the flaps in the side slider of my 9Z and adjust flaps as needed depending on the landing conditions.
Maximun flap deflection for landing on the F-18F is 55mm. For takeoff I would recomend about 35mm, this will help on a smoother rotation.

For Airbrakes it is an on off situation. Open or close...

Michel

RE: Accessories Needed for F-18F
 

Thank you Michel!

I was wondering about a slider to control a channel on the Tx.

I will need to start searching for the proper radio that will give me the controls I need.

Is the 9Z still the best choice? Is it still in production?

Bernard

RE: Accessories Needed for F-18F
 

The weatronics combines two receivers and the powerbox function into one box. The unit select the receiver with best signal, allowing you to place the antennas in different orientations to achieve better reception at all planes attitudes. It will also log a lot of data for review. With the recent price reduction, a good thing is now even better.

RE: Accessories Needed for F-18F
 

I love the 9Z but they are out of production. Futaba has a new 12 channel radio coming besides de 12 and 14MZ. JR also has some really nice radios as well. Any one of this brands will do the job great.

Michel

RE: Accessories Needed for F-18F
 

Aloha,

I am now at the point of having to choose radio.

Do I need to use Futaba Servos with a Futaba Radio (ie, the 12FG 2.4Ghz)...OR...can I use JR servos with Futaba Radio?

The recommended servos for my jet are Futaba S9204 and S9151.

Well, the 9204 is discontinued and the 9151 is only for 4.8 volts and I don't feel comfortable with this setup.

What servos do you recommend for:

Elevator (2)
Ailerons (2)
Flaps (2)
Nosegear Steer (1)
Misc Functions(2 - 4)

Thanks again for all the help you people are giving me!

Bernard

(PS - I went for the Fei Bao F-18F ARF instead of the Skymaster)

RE: Accessories Needed for F-18F
 

Bernard,

You can use any brand servos...

Recommenf you read the Fei Bao F-18 thread here.. use the search function.. There is information about the recommended servos, cg, etc

Good luck,
Edgar

RE: Accessories Needed for F-18F
 

Bernard,
I would like to answer some of your questions regarding the transmitter, receiver and servos.
If you have a transmitter that works either PCM (1024 mode) or PPM you can use it. (Futaba, JR)

If you want to go with the Weatronic receiver, you won't need to get a power box to have adequate power supply for the servos that you will be installing. Of course you need to have two adequate batteries, one as the main and the second as a backup. Depending on the amount of servos and their power needs you will have to make a good choice of battery. I would go at least with a good 3600 mA/hr battery for the main. Check with others what they have and what the manufacturer tells you about the servos will give you an idea of how much they can draw.

You can actually use the same channel for the retracts and the gear doors and there is no need to use an additional sequencer as well, because you can program it in the Weatronic dual receiver.

You can use any servo with the Weatronic unit. You can use analog or digital. You can actually specify it in the setup for the receiver.

As Edgar said before, you can also do a range check and look at the log file from the SD-card to make sure you have adequate receiver signal strength, how much power the servos and the receiver are pulling out of the battery and other useful data.

If you get the Gyro version, you can use the gyro function on the nose gear or the ailerons.

The GPS enables you to later analyze the signal strength during the entire flight and see if you have to place the antennas different. Lots of fun and very useful data, since you are putting a lot of money into the air.

I hope this helps

Gerhard

RE: Accessories Needed for F-18F
 

Thank you Gerhard and Edgar...very helpful.

I think I have basically what I need now to get the whole jet together as a functioning unit.

Do you guys know of people who have other people fly their jets for its first flight? (like me...)

I have lots of RC flying craft but virtually no experience actually flying them!

I know it sounds weird, but I love aircraft of all kinds and if the closest I can get to one is by having a scale model, then so be it.

I live on Maui in Hawaii...anyone around here with jet experience?

Thanks again for the responses!

Bernard

RE: Accessories Needed for F-18F
 

Check out your local hobby store and go to AMA or tower hobbies to get a list of RC clubs near you.

Go to http://www.towerhobbies.com/rcwairclub.html

or

This is a "local" dealer http://www.airpacmodels.com/twe/shop_content.php?coID=7

Gerhard

RE: Accessories Needed for F-18F
 

Thanks Gerhard.

I just now noticed you are a rep for Weatronic, so I will ask you here:

Do any of the current Weatronic receivers work with (support) the new 2.4Ghz DSM technology such as with the Futaba 12fg 2048 2.4Ghz or the JR X9303 2.4Ghz?

I want to keep the interior of my jet as clutter free, high tech, and simple as I can afford.

Seems using a Weatronic would eliminate at least one black box from inside the fuselage...

Thanks again.

Bernard

RE: Accessories Needed for F-18F
 

Hi Bernard, about engine choice the P-120 will fly her with out the bombs and if you build it ligth. The Super eagle is a good choice also. But the best choice will be Rhino or TITAN. The rhino have a life time warranty but the kero start is not ready yet. The TITAN SE comes with the kero start option. I see you from Hawaii. Try to contact Eric or Duck from Airpac, they can help you a lot with this jet and they are from Hawaii as well.

Good luck!
Alex

RE: Accessories Needed for F-18F
 

Hi Bernard,
The 2.4 GHz technology is still very young and has its issues.

Some trust it and have no problems and others tried it and lost some real expensive models. So there is a mix of emotions in the field. It is a matter of time that enough experience is gained in the field to get a good feel for what makes sense and what not. Moisture in the air plays a roll as well as features of the construction of the model, as wwell as placement of receivers in the models. There are limitations because of it's features, as carbon or metal in models will obstruct the view of the antennas directly to the transmitter which is needed. Turbines and control units have had issues of disturbing some systems and others not at all.
Weatronic is working on a unit for this 2.4 GHz, but it will take a while - most likely innext year. We want to do it right and not have a lot of people be unsure what the heck is happeneing. It also entails quite a bit of education to understand that there are a set of "new rules" to follow with new do's and dont's. In addition I believe that 72 MHz will still coexist as it has it's proven good sides and reliability.

Thanks,

Gerhard

RE: Accessories Needed for F-18F
 

Thank you Gerhard...very well put.

Since I have not yet locked in on a radio I will rely on your experience in the matter and please ask you what radio(s) would you recommend for me?

I would be willing to budget about $750 - 1400 for a Transmitter. Do you have a couple of choices for me to pick from?

I would be wanting to use this Tx with a Weatronic Rx, so basically I would only need the Tx, and when I find out which ones I need, the proper servos.

(PS - Any reason you know of why the Weatronic products recently dropped in price?...A new product release soon?)

Thanks for your help.

Bernard

RE: Accessories Needed for F-18F
 

Bernard,
On the transmitter choice, it is a matter of taste and preference. There are a lot of good used ones from some people wanting to sell their 72 MHz stuff while the markiet is still in the transition. You can get some good deals out there. I personally use a Futaba transmitter, not even a fancy one. On the servos look at what they reccomend for your particular application. Brand is not as important as the strength specs etc.

The reason for the drop in price is, that the market is kind of hesitatant to buy new equipment because of the 2.4GHz. The Weatronic company in Germany had made a lot of them and now as the market is hesitant to buy them, we are selling them under value. Smart people are picking up on that and want to continue flying as safe as possible, while the 2.4 technology matures. I took over the Weatronic distribution because I believe in its technology being so far ahead of everyone else and it is just a matter of time that people will realize the true value that it brings along in terms of simplicity and safety by taking out the guesswork and speculation of what happens or might happen. It is also so easy on setup and changes, once you have figured it out.

Then the pricing on some of the 2.4GHz is again so attractive that again other people are obviously willing to take the risk of helping to prove out the thechnology. I always also think that you usually get what you pay for. Some of them are paying a big price on it in other ways too by loosing a ten thousand dollar airplane, which they will argue, could have happened with the 72MHz system as well. Often though, there is no real proof of what the reason for a crash was. Reasons can range from being "shot down" by someone inadvertantly switching on a transmitter, cell phone or other interference problems etc. The forums are full of it. Yet other reasoons are frequency unrelated ranging from batteries running out of power due to poorly synchronized servos or plainly not being sized properly or even charged to capacity etc.

A lot of this gueswork goes away with the weatronic dual receiver when also using the logging function.

Thanks,

Gerhard

RE: Accessories Needed for F-18F
 

Hi Gerhard,

I have been looking at the specs on the Weatronic 12-20 R Gyro and I notice the regulators put out a constant 6.0 volts to the servos.

I presume this means I can only use servos that handle 6.0 volts, right? (duh?) So for example I could not use Futaba S9151 with this Rx, right?

I mention the S9151 because it is one of the recommended servos for use with my jet for elevators and flaps actuation. The other recommended servo for use with this jet if the Futaba S9204 which appears to no longer exist...I hope when the jet arrives there will be some specific servo requirements spelled out in the manual (If there IS a manual that is!)

Thanks again for your help.

Bernard

RE: Accessories Needed for F-18F
 

Bernard,
I suppose you can check the specs of the servos and see what the range of voltage is that they can handle. It might be nominal at 4.8 V but could possibly also handle 6.0 V. I don't have that particular servo and information on it. maybe somone else can answer the question for you. Other than that there are lots of servos out there that should be in similar category that you can use. The manufacturer of your model should be able to let you know other choices or your local dealer will be able to help you out in finding the right servos.

Thanks

Gerhard