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ORIGINAL: marc s

All looks good guys, similarity between the SG hawk is very evident so should be a lot of construction x-over - look forward to seeing the builds.

marcs

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ORIGINAL: butler-campers

I begin withe the wing light.

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ORIGINAL: mick15

Hmmm that's very interesting, I lost my Airworld Hawk when the fin came off, the break looked much like yours.

m

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ORIGINAL: tobba

People

Looking for thoughts. I have a Tomahawk Hawk on order, due March. Keen for thoughts on the rudder setup.

From everything I am hearing the Tomahawk is pretty much identical to the SG. I saw a near disaster here in New Zealand with a SG Hawk on its second flight a month or so ago. This model was built by a chap that has been flying and building for many years, including many Jets. I did not view the rudder setup first hand, but I would expect it to be correctly setup. I am aware of a similar issue on the prototype SG Hawk but have heard nothing since. Maybe future kits were upgraded?

This is a big surface. Does it need 2 servos? Does it need a double arm - rigid push pull? or maybe more strengthening around the rudder tube where it mounts to the fuse? I am far from questioning the caliber of the design of either the SG or Tomahawk models - they are the best of the best, hence me buying one...! However the result on this model was a little disheartening.

See a few shots attached of the damage to the SG Hawk. One prior to the incident. These guys were very lucky. Just managed to squeeze it back on the runway.

Thoughts would be appreciated.

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ORIGINAL: Robrow

I think there are 2 different areas to talk about here, how models are flown and how they are manufactured.

It's interesting to see how the Hawk has become quite common now with many of the major manufacturers producing versions in ever increasing scale sizes. By it's very nature flying practice should evolve to more closely mimick that of full size versions but from what I have seen this does not seem to be happening. Although the manufacturers are controlling weight as sizes increase this would not be a good thing if the cost was compromised strength.

It would be nice to know if any of the manufactuers carry out structural testing/health monitoring as part of the development process?

I have not seen any Hawk flown scale, there is always some portion of the flight that is non scale, this in some cases may be unavoidable due to the nature of the flying site. The size of this non scale portion varies between the length of the entire flight down to maybe a few seconds.

Non of these comments are aimed at any individual or manufacturer, just simple observations designed to add to the constructive posts already made.

Rob.

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ORIGINAL: Ali

I have owned 2 Skygate Hawks, and have flown 3 others. I have 3 friends that own them who fly quite often, and then I would guess at having seen maybe another 5-10 fly a ross the world on my travels. The only time I have ever seen an issue with the rudder was on the prototype model when it was first released at the jet masters. That issue was a result of the rudder servo failing and causing flutter in the entire fin. I know as I watched Stephen Volker replace the servo on more than one occasion, go out and do another flight. Only for the same result. Half way through the flight as the rudder was loaded the servo or something in the servo set up would fail and always with the same result. Sorry but I do not thnk it is a model issue.
Mick, dont get me started o how many Airworld hawks I have owned, flown or seen fly with no issue what so ever. :D:D
I see it more and more often where the larger planes are flown in the same way as the smaller jets ( hard ) most of the time the pilot gets away with it, but sometimes not. At the last jet meeting I was at I watched a very competent pilot, who normally flies mainly smallish sport jets ( Bandits, etc ) Fly his new MB339. He was flying it really well, but just a little to '' Hard'' in my opinion. I went over and had a word with him, just offering some advice and trying to explain how these large heavy scale models have so much inertia behind them that it's easy to let the speed build up, and then when flown in the same manner as a sport jet that can be pulled and pushed much harder the loads are so great it can cause a failure. He took the advice on board and will hopefully get any enjoyable flights on that model.
I am just getting into full size flying and as part of it I am trying to fly as many different types as I can. The thing that amazes me is the different VNE's ( Velocity never to be exceeded) There are. Its amazing that two very similar looking aircraft can have such differing VNE's! I think its the same with models. For example.. I have seen people fly jets like Bandits, and Bobcats so , so hard with no issues. Yet I have seen models such as big L-39's and large deltas fold up like a paper bag mid flight in what looked to be a pretty tame flight. It's so difficult to give a comprehensive answer without going too technical. it's also so difficult giving a defined limit for each model. As most manufacturers do not test to destruction, and no models that I know of have a VNE. Even if they did how would we measure and monitor that we did not exceed them?
For me the way I try to work round it is I try to adopt a different style of flying for each model.
I have flown and will quite confidently fly a model such as my BVM Bobcat much harder, faster and more aggressively than I would something like my Skygate Hawk. I try and avoid mixing speed with high G maneuvers. Yes I do some pretty damn fast high speed runs, but I work up to these ( during flight testing away from a show environment before I get flamed ) I also do some high energy sharp pulls, but these I do turbine spooled down. I know for sure that if I mixed both those two aspects f my flight that it would be Bye Bye Bobcat!
The same as when I fly my Skygate hawk ( P-180 powered by the way ) As soon as I am off and cleaned up I am back on the throttle, and I am using that throttle stick nearly as much as some of my flight controls. I watched a Skygate fly in Italy once and the only thing that saved it was the fact it flamed out. The pilot took off and from the moment he took off till the moment it flamed out the pilot never once touched the throttle stick ( No I could not see it but I sure could hear it) The model got faster and faster till it reached it's maximum speed. I was fearing the worst as the pilot was just getting settled in and I thought if he goes for any vertical maneuvers this could be curtains. Luckily the turbine shut down just as he was pulling 45 for what looked as it it might have been a half reverse cuban ( Which I think might have been the first and last time for that model ) After a perfect landing I went up to the pilot and tried to explain that he might try and adopt some throttle management, to which he informed me that he was famed in his local club for flying pulse jets ( No throttle ) and he had never had one of those fail. I did try to explain to him that a small pulse jet delta, although flying fast does not have the same flight loads on the surfaces or controls as this big hawk... Not sure what the outcome was but I am hoping that all went well.
Sorry to waffle on guys, and please dont treat this as me pointing fingers, and having a preach. I am simply just trying to convey some of my experiences ( Good and bad ) As well as some of my worries.
If I can ever be of any help, or give ay advice then please feel free to get in touch.
Regards Al

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