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Weatronics 2.4 micro vs R?
I have been following the posts on RCU and have gone thru the weatronics site. I have pretty much decided to use one for my next project. However I need to decide between the 12 CH Micro or 12 R (w/o gyro / GPS). After having gone thru the weatronics website and the Posts on RCU, I am curious as to when one would use the R series instead of Micro? There are very generic statements on the weatronics site which is understandable.
So I am looking for the experts in the subject to provide their opinions - What factors make it essential or reasonably prudent to use the 12 R over the 12 micro? What criteria determine this? e.g. when 12 Ch R is a no brainer Power Management Capabilities 1. 10 or XX Plus Servos. I know the physical limit is 12 ports but I am sure when you are getting to 12+ servos the amp draw and power management capabilities will become necessary / prudent. 2. Potential for drawing in excess of XXX Amps (short burst) or a typical flight would consume in excess of xxx amps. I could not find the max amps the micro can handle? 3. Avg Servo Leads exceeding 36 in or in other words models exceeding 100" in length/35lbs thrust. 4. Wt - if the model is 100" plus the wt of a weatronics 12 Ch R seris is less likely to impact overall performance. The 12 Ch micro is only 25G whereas the 12 Ch R series is 225g ...9 times the additional wt. 5. Programming limitations in 12 Micro over 12 R - I could not find any specific programming limitations in the 12 micro vs the 12 R (except of the physical ports limitation) Note: the above is a sample/partial list I created while typing this post without much thought. The idea is to get opinions on what factors you consider important in making this determination. I know there is no read made formula for the selection but looking to understand how you guys would make this decision between 12 Ch Micro and 12 Ch R. Thanks Neelesh PS: Money is not a deterministic creteria for me. It makes little difference between $350 vs $700 when the project costs more than 10K fully loaded! |
RE: Weatronics 2.4 micro vs R?
NRAHEJA - I am not an expert but here are my reasons. First I have no need for regulators since I don't run high voltage packs nor do I use very high drain servos. I bought Weatronic because I thought it was the best RF link available at pesent time. For all 2.4GIG receivers I use a separate battery for the receiver and a different pair (parralleled) for the servos. All of my jets currently are in the 12lb to 20lb class.
I have test flown my first 12 Ch receiver over 40 flights with excellent results and am now moving it to my jet. My second 12 Ch receiver will begin test flights as soon as the weather permits. |
RE: Weatronics 2.4 micro vs R?
I am using the larger 2.4 in my A10. If you have the room for it, I can't imagine a reason no to try the larger one if you are going to be running many 8711s etc.
MY research has suggested to me that the RF link is at least on par if not superioe to anything else out there and the redundancy in the system is comforting too. I am still wiating for mine though.... The downside to weatronic is the support. Gerhard himself has been very good. But he also requires support from Germany which seems to be the weak link. What are you building and where are you flying? I am in MN too. Dave |
RE: Weatronics 2.4 micro vs R?
Before I start using Wea 2,4 micro on my jets I had JR receiver and power box evolution. Then I 've just replaced the JR receiver with the Wea micro 12. I do have now over 40 flights with 2 different jets equiped as is and the system works great.<div>Marc</div>
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RE: Weatronics 2.4 micro vs R?
ORIGINAL: ddennison I am using the larger 2.4 in my A10. If you have the room for it, I can't imagine a reason no to try the larger one if you are going to be running many 8711s etc. MY research has suggested to me that the RF link is at least on par if not superioe to anything else out there and the redundancy in the system is comforting too. I am still wiating for mine though.... The downside to weatronic is the support. Gerhard himself has been very good. But he also requires support from Germany which seems to be the weak link. What are you building and where are you flying? I am in MN too. Dave We had met 2-3 years ago at the MN Jet Rally. I had dropped in as a spectator but the day was washed-out due to rains/bad weather. On a A-10 I cannot imagine NOT using a power management system such as the larger Weatronic Rx or Powerbox. I am in the process of finishing a BVM Rafale Single Engine w/ 7 8411s and 4 analog servos (requires 9 ports on the RX if you dont use reversed servos). No where close to an A-10 in size, complexity, # of servos. Needless to say keeping it light and simple is one of the goals. I am certain of buying a Weastronics RX for 2 key reasons - RF Link and built in redundancy of dual Rx. I basically need to better understand the differences between the 12 Micro and 12 R? 1. Are there any programming(Software) limitations between the Micro and R series. I did downloaded the manuals /software but was unable to determine programming limitations between the 2.For the rafale I need to program 4 servos on a single channel i.e. 2 elevator and 2 canards 2. What is the max current draw the Micro will handle, another way to ask this question would be to compare current handling capability of a micro with other 2.4 Rx's from JR. From what I have read the larger rx will handle is 32 Amps but I could not find the same on the micro. Hopefully more people will chime in with the differences between the 12 Micro vs the 12 R. Neelesh |
RE: Weatronics 2.4 micro vs R?
According to the Weatronic manual, page 19 section 8, for the micro Rx "The total current draw of all of the servos working under full load must not exceed 6 Amps otherwise the receivers circuit board may be damaged."
I use the 12-20 Rx in 35Mhz, the reason for using it is that the model has 15 servos/valves/devices to be controlled and since my radio has 12 channels the Weatronic Rx is an excellent solution to driving and programming more servos than there are channels. Eventually I will replace it with the 2.4Ghz version, but my other jets that have up to 12 channels will get the micro Rx. Harry |
RE: Weatronics 2.4 micro vs R?
Harry
Thanks for point the page out. I need to spend more time reading the manually ..again. You have answered a key question. Thanks, Neelesh |
RE: Weatronics 2.4 micro vs R?
I am flying Micros (12 ch and 8ch) and the 12-30 gyro111 plus GPS on 2.4 plus three larger DRs on 36 Mhz.
The great advantage of the larger receiver is the multiple servo outlets, all of which are fully programmable and upto 4 of which can be controlled by ONE channel AND the power management system eliminating the need for a Powerbox type of device. In addition the larger DRs also have voltage and pulse frequency assigment according top the needs of the servos. Although the Micro is able to handle 6 amps, if used with a Powerbox then the current through the receiver need only be a fraction of that, so could in theory be used in a larger model with high current draw. It should be remembered, however, that the Micro does NOT record amperage, just buss voltage, the larger DR records everything. That said if you have to buy a PB AND a Micro you might as well just get the larger DR with all of its facilities. ! To give you an example my Airworld Hawks both have DRs and typically draw 4 amps sustained with short spikes of up to 10 amps. Choice is yours. Regards, David Gladwin. |
RE: Weatronics 2.4 micro vs R?
1 Attachment(s)
ORIGINAL: nraheja Neelesh [/quote] Neelesh, I have been flying my BVM Rafale single with a JR 1221 rx without any problems. All things considered, the larger Weatronic rx would be preferable but fitting it in the Rafale could be a chalange. The Micro would probably be fine although you will probably need a matchbox or two...I need one even with a 12X transmitter. FYI, if you want to be able to do high-alpha stuff with your Rafale (which it does great), you might want to consider using the ail/elev on each wing as an elvon (i.e. they both move in unison on each wing). The mixing is a little complicated but it can be done with a 10X or 12X and with Futaba radios I'm sure. Either way the Rafale is a great flying jet. Craig |
RE: Weatronics 2.4 micro vs R?
Hi Neelesh,
Given the type of aircraft you're intending to equip, I'd go for the micro 12 along with 2 A123 2200 mAh batteries directly connected to the receiver without any regulator. The feature/safety to price ratio of this combo is unmatchable ( bear in mind that you'll get one channel used for each battery ) I've been test flying my Phoenix that has 6 x 8411 ( main flight controls ) on that setup and the receiver is just doing fine. Regarding the maximum current draw on the small unit, there is a trick. If you use two batteries, one at each side of the servo socket board, you'll be able to draw 4 amps from each side. So you'll have to plug one battery on channel 1 and one battery on channel 12. You'll then need to split and balance the big consumers ( servos ) on each side starting from channel 1 up and channel 12 down in a symmetrical way. That will make it up to 8 amps which should be fine to cover most situations. The programming capability of the micro is the same as the big R unit ( to the hardware differences ). The and assignment and programmability of the channels is the same. However you cannot: .Assign servo voltage by bank ( no on-board regulator ) .See the current draw .Get the battery switch-over feature Hope that this will help you... |
RE: Weatronics 2.4 micro vs R?
Has anyone had the opportunity to use the micro 12 with integral gyros?
Rob. |
RE: Weatronics 2.4 micro vs R?
ORIGINAL: olnico Hi Neelesh, Given the type of aircraft you're intending to equip, I'd go for the micro 12 along with 2 A123 2200 mAh batteries directly connected to the receiver without any regulator. The feature/safety to price ratio of this combo is unmatchable ( bear in mind that you'll get one channel used for each battery ) I've been test flying my Phoenix that has 6 x 8411 ( main flight controls ) on that setup and the receiver is just doing fine. Regarding the maximum current draw on the small unit, there is a trick. If you use two batteries, one at each side of the servo socket board, you'll be able to draw 4 amps from each side. So you'll have to plug one battery on channel 1 and one battery on channel 12. You'll then need to split and balance the big consumers ( servos ) on each side starting from channel 1 up and channel 12 down in a symmetrical way. That will make it up to 8 amps which should be fine to cover most situations. The programming capability of the micro is the same as the big R unit ( to the hardware differences ). The and assignment and programmability of the channels is the same. However you cannot: .Assign servo voltage by bank ( no on-board regulator ) .See the current draw .Get the battery switch-over feature Hope that this will help you... Oliver Thanks a lot and glad that you are able to provide such information. This is the exact information I was looking for and your trick to get 8 Amps sounds fantastic. To better understand, can you help out with come explanation onhow/why the 4 amp per side? Also th manual states 6 Amps which is per side or overall? Again, Thanks for the insights. Makes me a lot more comfortable given the information you have been sharing. |
RE: Weatronics 2.4 micro vs R?
ORIGINAL: olnico Hi Neelesh, Given the type of aircraft you're intending to equip, I'd go for the micro 12 along with 2 A123 2200 mAh batteries directly connected to the receiver without any regulator. The feature/safety to price ratio of this combo is unmatchable ( bear in mind that you'll get one channel used for each battery ) I've been test flying my Phoenix that has 6 x 8411 ( main flight controls ) on that setup and the receiver is just doing fine. Regarding the maximum current draw on the small unit, there is a trick. If you use two batteries, one at each side of the servo socket board, you'll be able to draw 4 amps from each side. So you'll have to plug one battery on channel 1 and one battery on channel 12. You'll then need to split and balance the big consumers ( servos ) on each side starting from channel 1 up and channel 12 down in a symmetrical way. That will make it up to 8 amps which should be fine to cover most situations. The programming capability of the micro is the same as the big R unit ( to the hardware differences ). The and assignment and programmability of the channels is the same. However you cannot: .Assign servo voltage by bank ( no on-board regulator ) .See the current draw .Get the battery switch-over feature Hope that this will help you... FYI, with my A-10, the big unit was perfect to accomodate the numerous outputs for multiple servos on ailerons, rudders, elevators and 4 individual flaps. I think I ended up using most of the outputs. Craig |
RE: Weatronics 2.4 micro vs R?
ORIGINAL: CraigG ORIGINAL: nraheja Neelesh I have been flying my BVM Rafale single with a JR 1221 rx without any problems. All things considered, the larger Weatronic rx would be preferable but fitting it in the Rafale could be a chalange. The Micro would probably be fine although you will probably need a matchbox or two...I need one even with a 12X transmitter. FYI, if you want to be able to do high-alpha stuff with your Rafale (which it does great), you might want to consider using the ail/elev on each wing as an elvon (i.e. they both move in unison on each wing). The mixing is a little complicated but it can be done with a 10X or 12X and with Futaba radios I'm sure. Either way the Rafale is a great flying jet. Craig [/quote] Craig, Exactly as you have stated, key reasons for avoiding the bigger rx are space and wt. If not I would have gone for the R series. Also since this kit/aircraft has been around for many years, it would have been used w/o power management systems for the most part. Doing hi alphas is an eventual goal. First I want to get her up in the air and get comfortable flying the airplane. I might just reach out to you for some tips when I am ready for the more advanced stuff. Would love to see more pictures of your Rafale. Are you flying with a P-180? Thanks, Neelesh |
RE: Weatronics 2.4 micro vs R?
I think 12 outputs will be just fine. The airplane has only 12 servos (Actually 11 since throttle is not really a servo).
The elevators, Canards and rudder/nose are on a Y. Technically I need only 9 outputs. Craig - In your case you probably need a match box because you have configured the elevators/canards on independant ports to make them function as elevons. I am not planning to start with that setup. This is my second jet and need more stick time before I get to the hi alpha stage. Thanks, |
RE: Weatronics 2.4 micro vs R?
ORIGINAL: nraheja ORIGINAL: olnico Hi Neelesh, Given the type of aircraft you're intending to equip, I'd go for the micro 12 along with 2 A123 2200 mAh batteries directly connected to the receiver without any regulator. The feature/safety to price ratio of this combo is unmatchable ( bear in mind that you'll get one channel used for each battery ) I've been test flying my Phoenix that has 6 x 8411 ( main flight controls ) on that setup and the receiver is just doing fine. Regarding the maximum current draw on the small unit, there is a trick. If you use two batteries, one at each side of the servo socket board, you'll be able to draw 4 amps from each side. So you'll have to plug one battery on channel 1 and one battery on channel 12. You'll then need to split and balance the big consumers ( servos ) on each side starting from channel 1 up and channel 12 down in a symmetrical way. That will make it up to 8 amps which should be fine to cover most situations. The programming capability of the micro is the same as the big R unit ( to the hardware differences ). The and assignment and programmability of the channels is the same. However you cannot: .Assign servo voltage by bank ( no on-board regulator ) .See the current draw .Get the battery switch-over feature Hope that this will help you... Oliver Thanks a lot and glad that you are able to provide such information. This is the exact information I was looking for and your trick to get 8 Amps sounds fantastic. To better understand, can you help out with come explanation onhow/why the 4 amp per side? Also the manual states 6 Amps which is per side or overall? Again, Thanks for the insights. Makes me a lot more comfortable given the information you have been sharing. It is just a marking and any channel can accept a battery port. The power supply bus is limited to 6 amps. However it can accept 6 amps from either side. So if you put one battery on each side of the power line, you'll be able to draw 6 amps from each side. This is called the Kirchhoff's law: the current charge is always constant through a node. http://www.physics.uoguelph.ca/tutor...Q.ohm.KCL.html To stay on the safe side, I'd rather limit myself to 4 amps from each side, but this is an arbitrary value. Let's say that with this trick you're limited to 12 amps with a good safety margin on 8 amps. |
RE: Weatronics 2.4 micro vs R?
1 Attachment(s)
ORIGINAL: nraheja Doing hi alphas is an eventual goal. First I want to get her up in the air and get comfortable flying the airplane. I might just reach out to you for some tips when I am ready for the more advanced stuff. Would love to see more pictures of your Rafale. Are you flying with a P-180? Thanks, Neelesh Craig |
RE: Weatronics 2.4 micro vs R?
ORIGINAL: Robrow Has anyone had the opportunity to use the micro 12 with intrgral gyros? Rob. |
RE: Weatronics 2.4 micro vs R?
If you look at the Rx socket layout, you'll see that the two battery ports are marked side by side on channel 11 and 12. It is just a marking and any channel can accept a battery port. The power supply bus is limited to 6 amps. However it can accept 6 amps from either side. So if you put one battery on each side of the power line, you'll be able to draw 6 amps from each side. This is called the Kirchhoff's law: the current charge is always constant through a node. http://www.physics.uoguelph.ca/tutor...Q.ohm.KCL.html To stay on the safe side, I'd rather limit myself to 4 amps from each side, but this is an arbitrary value. Let's say that with this trick you're limited to 12 amps with a good safety margin on 8 amps. This is very helpful. Thanks Oliver. Edited to correct typos/quote tag. |
RE: Weatronics 2.4 micro vs R?
Sounds like a good plan. I will be glad to answer any questions you may have. FYI, I've got an AMT USA AT-450 (olympus) in mine. Craig Sure is a beauty. Thanks for sharing the pictures. Always very helpful to see pictures of the install. |
RE: Weatronics 2.4 micro vs R?
No Woket, wrong !
The Micros will all be available with gyros and I have a 10 channel unit with three gyros. Not flown it yet as its an early model awaiting a firmware update. The 12 Micro will become available in due course with 3 gyros . Regards, DG. |
RE: Weatronics 2.4 micro vs R?
Oh wow, GREAT!!! Thanks David!
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RE: Weatronics 2.4 micro vs R?
Quite a coincidence but the postman brought me a 12 channel micro Gyro 111 yesterday for testing.
Its an amazing device, a dual channel 2.4 system PLUS a downlink to record masses of data PLUS 3 axes gyros, all in a box the same size as any standard receiver. Apart from the larger DR which are going into my Mig 29, Skygate and Airworld Hawks (for the power management and GPS functions etc) I would argue that this is by FAR the ultimate receiver for any jet due to its proven dual channel link, the data recording with downlink and now 3 axes gyros (assignable to any and every servo with two gyros assignable to one channel) PLUS the amazing flexibilty in servo configuration with Giga Control. Flight tests will begin soon in my Bobcat which means I can remove both the rudder, nosewheel steering and aileron gyros and let the integral gyros take over their tasks. When I have finally figured out all of the integral mixing capability (still waiting for the manual on that ) it will also allow automatic sensitivity adjustment, gear up and down. Regards, David Gladwin. |
RE: Weatronics 2.4 micro vs R?
David
From your post I understand that there are 2 versions of 12 Ch Micro 1. without any gyros 2. with gyros It is really amazing to have 3 gyros in such a small unit! Thanks, Neelesh |
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