Things that go boom in the night
 

Mr. Paul:

#1 Lighten up mate

#2......been to U.K. 3X and never saw anything that would burn in the driving 45 deg F. rain.....lighting up that Weston Pipe definitely takes the chill out while you are waiting for a freq pin....

#3....there are many places here in the colony where ripping a good one after a hearty beans and kraut meal washed down with a couple of pints will start a 100,000 acre brush fire...it's known as 1/2 the United States, west of the front range of the Rocky Mountains....and Florida...ask any one of your fellow countrymen who have enjoyed the Grand Hospitality extended at Lake Wales and Florida Jet Meetings....it took them quite a while to learn how to tank the gas until they were in a free-fire zone...like at the bottom of the motel pool..!!! :>)

#4...all these natural disasters involve most of the insurance companies that write liability here in the U.S. including LLoyds of London....yup, a jet starts a brush fire in Los Angeles, my insurance premiums go up in Wisconsin, 2300 miles away.....and that's even farther than from St. Andrew's to the Cliffs of Dover..now that's real chicken poop....

#5...all this blowpipe stuff is old hat....puts me to sleep...my teenage buddy and I plumbed a Bentley Butane lighter fluid re-filler into a DynaJet 45 years ago, and we are both still alive with all ten fingers and both eyes.....gorgeous plume for about 15 seconds....gasoline in one end and butane at the other.....now that's a cooker!

Actually, if you just get off on the plume, plumb in a little Powermax, rather than smoke oil in your smoker...works great....and allot lighter than that Weston Pipe.

Tom

Afterburner question
 

Hey Paul, not all of us regret that you aren't here. and not all of us will attack fliers that want to push the envelope, given that safety is observed. and finally, not all of us are owned by the AMA. Mig driver, I say press on RESPONSIBLY..... not just a few short years ago, no one thought that it was very smart to have jet engines as hobbies that rotate in access of 100 thousand rpms.
had those pioneers caved in, ducted fans would still be state of the art.

Gentleman
 

I did indeed try this in my shop, with two ( 2 ) friends with fire extiguishers at hand. I had it pointed out side, and hit the button for maybe 6 seconds until the stink got too bad from burning pipe metal. If those of you who look down from the clouds at little guys like me trying something at home,

1) not putting our hobby at mortal peril
2) not getting the AMA mad
3) not being " unbright " ( that one really pissed me off )
4) and NOT starting forst fires,

you guys might want to read the ENTIRE post. I will continue to try and make this work , because it interests me. I have 1 and only 1 jet right now, and after a year converting it, and NOT dumb enouph to gamble it on an unknown. Really guys, what I did was not really all that big a deal.

I wonder if Mike Murphy went through this much CRAP over his first MW 44 ????

Go 4 it!!!
 

Just a thought or two...

Just adding a longer tailpipe and injecting fuel might add to your thrust but it will definitely add to your EGT. Which will mean either slower acceleration (just because of the pipe) and more stress on the turbine. (probably both)

I'd do my homework first. There are probably engines that will take AB better than others. Read Kamps' and Shreckling's books for starters. Also hop over to the nearest university, they'll probably have some stuff that can help you.


Check out this: http://www.microjeteng.com/rad.htm

Good luck.

Afterburner question
 

I'm sorry but i'm not answering this thread anymore.
i can't believe what a world we live in where we have to bow down to the AMA police, i'm bloody pleased that i live in the UK.

i would say loads more but i'd be puttng myself in the firing line , good luck, and if you want it to work contact me offlist and i'll glady give you some ideas which WILL work

Afterburner question
 

Afterburner question
 

Terry,

Are you able to install your setup on a thrust stand, where you can measure thrust with AB on/off? Which turbine were you using in your experiment?

Good luck, and be careful! :)

AMA ?
 

Who is this AMA anyway?

Is it Agency for Model Abolition?

My philosophy in life is to do something until told not to!


Replies on a postcard to:

Inmate 213564
Peterhead Penitentiary
Aberdeen
Scotland
UK

(All mail will be scrutinised and censored before delivery)

right now
 

its set up on my test stand with a Ram 1000, I built another stand for the pipe.

Afterburner question
 

Actually you are wrong here, I do know Terry and I also know that he is new to turbine planes. He is not flying out in the dessert. I guess the statemnet before he flies it in a model will be "Hey hold my beer and watch this *****!" Go for it Terry several of the people that DO know you have put it on record before you do something stupid at an AMA field.

Afterburner question
 

wow!

Afterburner Flame holder.
 

Getting back to the original post, I suspect that if you are just injecting the fuel into the pipe with no upstream mechanism for holding/stabilizing the flame, the fuel will attach to the sidewalls of the pipe and the flame will stabilize there...hense the very hot metal temps.

You need to have some form of bluff boddy/v-gutter flame stabilizer in the "afterburner" duct to stabilze the flame in the air stream, as opposed to the duct wall. Take a look at some photo's or x-sectional illustrations of current military gas turbine engine afterburners for a better illustration of what I'm trying to describe.

Peter

Afterburner question
 

Right Pete, a flameholder structure. Also, take a look at the liners used in the AB portion of the full scale engines. Perhaps your inner tailpipe could be porous, introducing a thin film of air on the inner surface.

Time to roll it out of the garage too!

Afterburner question
 

Terry,
Do you have a AMA waiver yet ?

Afterburner question
 

Some of you guys really need to get a life, or get ahold of yourselves. I can remember another afterburner thread here a few months back where SEVERAL jet pilots were giving suggestions on how to make it work, so dont start getting all high and mighty. MigDriver, thumbs up to you for pushing back the envelope a little, regardless of what anyone else says, at least you have some balls between your legs. You guys seem to be quick to forget that without people out there constantly trying new things, you wouldnt have your precious little turbines now, would you! We would still be flying glow powered ducted fans. And what about the persons who pioneered those? Hell, maybe we all ought to just go back to foam gliders since some seem to be so afraid of new things. By the way, the AMA is a club, NOT a police force! If you dont like their ways, drop your membership and find a private field somewhere. I fly in my own private area, far removed from anyone else, except for a few more like me who choose to fly there. If you come there, you are welcome, If you dont like the way we do things, you can pack up your S**T and leave! We are safety conscious, courteous, and follow the same safety rules that any AMA field would do. BUT, no one tells us how to fly or what to fly. There are too many "sheep" in the flock that are letting the AMA lead them around by the pubic hair.

Oh yeah, the guy who made the comment about Migdriver not expecting to bring his plane to Austin and fly it, you might want to read a little more before you shoot off your mouth. His afterburner is not even in a plane! Attitudes like yours are exactly why I choose to fly at a private field. I dont have to put up with those chosen few who have to be A**holes! :mad:

Afterburner question
 

I could care less if it is public record or not, what is your point? I fly at a private field, so I dont need a waiver. Or, are you trying to say that possessing that precious waiver is in some way a direct reflection of one's skill level? Nope, no waiver here, no need for one. But you are right about one thing: it does take ALL kinds, and some of you guys are sure proving that every time you open your mouths. Dang, I am sure glad the individuals who pioneered some of the advancements of this hobby didnt have your attitudes, or we'd all still be winding up rubber bands!! :rolleyes:

SOME PEOPLE JUST DON'T GET IT !!!
 

Not everyone has access to a decent flying site that is not an AMA club site. I envy you guys that have a site where you can fly whatever you want to without any concerns about property damage liabilities. But unless you are flying on a dry lake bed, then you are probably risking someone elses property, everytime you fly. But for those of us that do most or all of our flying at AMA clubs or AMA sanctioned events, we must comply with the rules.
I realize that the AMA is only secondary insurance and that our homeowners policy is primary. My feeling is that under the right circumstances you could be wishing you had 10 times more insurance than you have.
Case in point. A couple of months ago, I flew my P120 powered Kangaroo (for the 13th time) at an AMA club site. About 1 minute into the flight, the airplane went straight into the ground at an estimated speed of 160mph. At least that's what the speed limiter was set at. The crash site was 8 feet away from a warehouse full of compressed gas cylinders. A friend of mine used up all of my AMA required fire extinguisher on it, without any results. I then used all of my 5 gallon water fire extinguisher (not an AMA requirement) to put out the fire.
I don't even want to think about the property damage that would have resulted from the jet going into that building. And what if I didn't own a home and thus had no homeowners insurance? What would be the long range repercussions of this crash? Because of this incident, I have decided to never fly a turbine powered plane at this site. And I have made a recommendation to the Club that turbine powered aircraft be banned from flying at this particular club site.
So thats why some of us get very nervous when we see or hear about someone that is disregarding current AMA rules.
Sorry, I'll get off the soap box now.

Afterburner question
 

Well said Gary.

insurance
 

i just moved into my new home and got all of my new insurance in place. i added a 1 million dollar umbrella as well for around $300 dollars a year. covers me for all kinds of things. heck i even have slander coverage, wow, am i excited about that one. i am even high risk their, just the carrier has not figured that one out yet. anyway that is m 2 cents on the insurance thing. barry

Afterburner question
 

Hi,

Where is that list contained on the site?

Turbine waiver holder list
 

Shaun, It's on the AMA site under Membership services / AMA Documents (PDF)

http://modelaircraft.org/templates/a...8EC96C27CE4F26

lowlevldevl, Unless you own all the property around where you fly, at least for several miles, then you are risking someone elses property. But with the Kadet LT40 and BeerCat bipe that you list on your member profile, you probably won't do too much damage

Re: Turbine waiver holder list
 

Now I'm shooting root beer out my nose!

Afterburner question
 

hey seanreit, kinda burns like an out of control after burner hehe!!

Afterburner question
 

Wow.. Reading this thread, i sure am happy to be in Europe, and not to mention in Norway...

The insurance-coverage you guys are talking about is so high that i could send i turbine-model into a crowd at 200 mph, and still wouldn't need anywhere near that amount of coverage here... But then again, reading about the kind of money that US courts award people at trials, i'm not surprised... We're talking sums of money that isn't anywhere near realistic for either parts in such a case...
A pretty much screwed up justice-system in my opinion, but i really don't care... I'm not over there... ;)

....and i might ad that although we have something similar to AMA in Norway, providing insurance and such, it is not anything like AMA when it comes to waivers and limitations like those described in this thread.... Some clubs require a "check-ride" to fly at their field and maybe a technical inspection of a new model, but that's the closest thing we have to any waiver, and these are local rules, not something pushed down on us.....

...and just in case i would happen to hit somebody or something with my Magnum, i am a member of the mentioned oraganization, and i am insured through my membership....

The day this organization would turn into a AMA-lookalike, with members showing the same attitude as some of the guys posting in this thread, i would quit this hobby in a minute... I would never accept beeing pushed around as to where and what i can fly...

Just curious... How much of the model turbine pioneer-work was done in the US?

migdriver: Keep up the good work!

Afterburner question
 

DEVILDOG I'm With you!