Decided to start flying next years Advance sequence today and have a question for those who have read or flown the pattern. The first maneuver is a Stall Turn with 3/4 roll up a down, I'm guessing it is a center maneuver followed by a Half Reverse Cuban Eight, it is going to be difficult to get in any straight flight between without going out of the box. Am I missing something?

It will be a short line

-Mike

Hey Mike, wanted to congratulate you for your NATS performance this year, great job!!! All the D3 pilots that went deserve recognition for what they have accomplished, great job everyone!!! Way to go Ryan for the Masters win.

Thanks, it was a lot of fun. Did you notice 4 of the top 6 in masters were our D3 pilots? And I gotta fly against that?????? LOL

You would have done very well I think, too bad you couldn't make it. It was a ton of fun on site 4 all week.

I'll see you in Jax if not sooner!

-Mike

Yea, been kicking myself for not going!! next year for sure.

Brian,
Since it is a stall turn, the upline and downline are right at the center pole. The stall turn is either canopy toward you or belly toward you, depending on which way you roll on the upline. Since you pivot around the CG, you should have room for a straight segment, more room than after the square loop in the current intermediate pattern. Also, the 1/2 reverse doesn't have to be big.

Yeah, you should have been at the Nats. Would have been interesting had you been there. You would have done very well.

I thought you were going to stay in intermediate, and give Gary heck next year!

Jon

If you put the upline on top of the center pole you'll be off center. Wouldn't the center of the 1/4 loop be on the center pole? IIRC old AMA stall turn the manuver started at center with the first pull so the entire stall turn was offset to the side. Will be interesting

Not if you have an ideal stall turn, and the plane pivots around its own CG. That way both the up and down line and partial rolls will be on the center pole. The 1/4 loop has to start before the center pole to get the upline on center. Watch the masters pilots do it at the next contest. Remember, when the plane does the stall turn, you will either be looking at the canopy side of the plane, or the belly, not the side of the plane.

Jon

No. Ideally, the radius should start before center, ride the center line all the way through the roll and the stall turn, then right back down the pole and the exit radius should be out of the other side.

In a perfect world.

-M

Or what Jon said.....

-Mike

Sounds easy, doesn't it!! A LITTLE harder in practice...

Jon

Yep it's really hard in a high wind. The crab angles get stupid and if you have any strong headwind, you have to power through the stall or you'll get blown half way to the end pole....

Try a figure M with 3/4 rolls, I'm STILL trying to get that thing to look decent!

-Mike

Sorry for abandoning the thread but I have been gone with the family all day. Interesting replies as I was thinking it had to be a mistake. I personally like a nice medium to large radius entering the stall turn and of course the same coming out, I also will normally put at least a two count between maneuvers as this is what I have been taught. On my reverse Cubans I like a two count after the pull followed by the roll and then another two count also making sure the back side is nice and round but this makes for a good size reverse Cuban. I tried quite a few times to do this and there is just not enough room. I guess its just going to take some practice, it just seems wrong and unnatural to me.

Yeah well, there's a lot that's going to be wierd about the new schedules. At least we don't have to deal with the horrible plane killer reverse avalanche! (LOL)

The length of the straight line is not a criteria for downgrade, as long as it exists. That being said, a good 2 count presents better than a one count (or half count).

-Mike

Might just have to try the Masters Pattern, lol.

Well, now that it appears the position of the aircraft at stall turn following 3/4 turn up is our option in 2007 Advanced, shouldn't the maneuver be called "position optional stall turn w/3/4 rolls up and down" ?

Steve, are you saying the stall turn can be anywhere between calling the box and center?

I looked at the schedule again tonight and it dawned on me what Jon and Mike are saying. This stall with 3/4 up/dn ends up still going upwind rather than a classic stall turn where you end up going back the way you came in. Now it makes sense why the vertical is right over the center pole! The schedule flows well. I look forward to it.

Where can I find the 2007 sequences?

Dave

http://www.nsrca.org/competition/judging/judging.htm

There ya go.

Correct! Sorry I didn't make that clear earlier. Since it is a center manuever, I just assumed everyone was on the same sheet of music.

Steve/Brian,
The position that is optional is the belly or canopy facing toward you when you do the stall turn. The stall turn itself must pivot directly over the center pole, and must be upwind.

Jon

DANG!

I played with the new masters pattern today with my new YS set up. Man, that is a FUN combination! Is it next year yet??????????????????

First time I've been flying since the Nats. Man, I needed that.

But anyway, the trick to the figure M with 3/4 seems to be roll the same way up and down on the first one, and then opposite (but the same direction on the second one). Like left up, left down, push, right up, right down, etc. Wierd, and 1001 ways to get a zero....but way cool!

-Mike

I also noticed that there is a rolling triangle loop. Do you roll on all legs during the triangle?

No just across the top.