Why do pattern guys do this?
 

The only good reason I have ever heard for stopping the engine in the air is some of the retract planes with center mounted wings had landing gear legs too short for some of the 16 and 17" props being used. I've seen guys never let the tail rise on take off so the prop tips don't get knicked. And I agree with whoever said that an idling engine produces more drag than an engine turned off.

Why do pattern guys do this?
 

This has strayed way beyond informative......

Therefore...Here is a good reason we came up with at the field this morning....

#1 Reason: Because we can!

Because we have the utmost control of our world...and because we choose to kill the motor yet another way to demonstrate how much control we have.

Not only can I maneuver the model through all 3 axis in extreme precision for 7-8mins in a F3A sequence.......but I have so much control over my model and my fun that I can determine how and when it ends!

Not everyone can determine on their own accord when the ride ends...but I CAN. and as for a power trip many wish they had such control!


TN

Ohhhhhhh
 

Good explaination Troy it's almost Zen like.

Why do pattern guys do this?
 

Ego trippers eh???

Yeah, I'll buy that.


It's a pattern thing, you wouldn't understand..

I'm very much like TonyF, I'll cruise in with my engine just tonking over (it's a 2 stroke and has such a low idle it just sits there and goes tonktatonktatonktatonktonktonk) and my ship will sail gracefully onto the field.

Then it's time for some RC car work. I don't see why I should have to carry my plane back when it has wheels!

No ego thing
 

No its not an ego thing....
Rather we have such little control of so many things....For example

We are hanging a $3000 plane on the fact that a small #4 bolt is going to hold....hanging on some work and structure that was done a year ago....a small tugsten coil inside the glow plug......a single screw into the servo arm on the elevator.....a single small signal wire into that elevator servo....a single small wire as the antenna to the RX.....a single small crystal in the RX.....a single small contact in the switch.....and on and on......not to mention that when that plane slips the surly bonds of earth you are flying on a radio wave that you can't see, you can't touch, is subject to interference, and must be received without noise, and perfectly encoded in order to perform the perfect 4pt or 1.5 snap....

There are so many things that can fail in a complicated machine like a model airplane....There are so many times that the fun ends without it being our choice.....

As far as I'm concerned killing the motor on landing is a way of telling the universe that for this small operation, for the making and taking of fire that sits inside that 1.4cu-in chamber....for this small moment in time...

I am in charge! its me the pilot that has the control...not the small little things that can help me end it on their terms.....but my TX and my thumb flipping the switch!

It all boils down to a measure of control.

BECAUSE I CAN!

Troy Newman
-----------------
Team JR, YS

Why do pattern guys do this?
 

Troy,

I love it. Best explanation yet.

Why do pattern guys do this?
 

Man, whoever said that pattern flyers don't have a sense of humor should read THIS thread!

Why do pattern guys do this?
 

Hey Troy,
All that stuff applies to my planes too.........(Well maybe not the perfect 4 point and 1.5 snap)hee hee.

Why do pattern guys do this?
 

Troy:

You remind me of Kane on Kung Fu

Why do pattern guys do this?
 

OK now, don't anybody take this too seriously! This is getting to be fun! So here's what I have to say about that,

What a pile of bullpucky!! Not buying a bit of it.

Why not demonstrate that you CAN, land the model in a realistic, smooth, controlled manner like nearly all powered aircraft do, with the engine running? Why not show that you CAN complete the flight with a high degree of finesse, displaying complete control by returning it under it's own power to the point it began it's flight? Why not show that you CAN extend your mastery of the entire regime capable of the aircraft? Why not show that you CAN tune your aircraft's system's to allow all operations? Why not extend the satisfaction of a flight well done, by showing that you CAN maintain your excellence by landing and clearing the runway quickly for the next flier?

Here, IMO, is what's happened. Since F3A quit judging the take-off and landing, many F3A pilots have gotten slack about ground ops. Their example has trickled down to the AMA classes.

You think when Patty Wagstaff or Sean Tucker complete their routines, they shut off the engine and have to be towed back? At least Bob Hoover, when he would shut off his engines during an airshow flight, would have the decency to taxi it back to the ramp!

OK, what's next?

slowing it down
 

I had this problem with my Prophecy when trying to land. I thought killing the engine helped... but it was because I was forced to land then. This airplane would gain speed fast anytime you put the nose down. So I dirtyed it up a bit by using elevator to flap mix (spoliers in effect). Ailerons went up when I pulled up on the elevator. This made the airplane land like a *****cat. I one time made the mistake of killing the engine when I had the mix on and nearly dumped it about 40 yrds out. Airbrakes. spoilers, what ever you want to call it, it works.. The spoiler effect makes the nose come up exposing more of the wing area creating the needed drag to slow the plane down. I literaly went from 5-6 pt landings, including some -0-'s to 9 and 10's because of the increased control while still having the engine running.
It will probably vary from plane to plane, trans to trans on the setup up but I used about 15% mix on ailerons to the elevator input. You can grease em in with the power up a touch and have the best rudder control and best of all it gives you that nose high landing that the rule book calls for.

Wayne

Taxi Back?
 

I can Do that too!

See isn't life great!

TN

taxi'n back
 

Yahhh I like that too. I got tired of chasin airplanes when I flew by myself. Thats why my freeflights are all sittin in a box on the top shelf.

WG

Why do pattern guys do this?
 

Troy..

Methinks you speak bulls**t :D

-Doug

Old days
 

I started flying pattern in the old days ( the 60's) and in order to get scored for the landing we had to successfully taxi our planes back to a box that was about 1 square yard. All this had to be done in a time frame or no points. What happened? Mike

Why do pattern guys do this?
 

Hey Mike,
I remember those days (well - on my 'good' days; haha). One big reason that the taxi back was eliminate was to keep traffic off the runaway. By the mid to late '70's we were running 3 flight lines (as were most contests) and it would have been a nightmare if there were planes taxiing all over the runway. The emphasis shifted more to flying, though take-off and landing were still judged.
I always land in front of me (ok almost always) so I can just walk out 10 steps and pick up my airplane.
I've actually been concerned about wear and tear on my landing gear so I've started landing inverted... :-)


KIDDING!!!
Will B.

70'S PATTERN
 

Yes... the few contest I flew in I remeber having to come to a stop before take off and stopping before running off the runway.

Seems brakes where an in thing baclk then also. It was a little tricky setting them up with retracts. Especialy if you used the down throw of you elevator to make them work. It still amazes me that we where able to get tri-cycle gear, brakes, Rom-Aire rettracts all in a .60 size airplane and still -try- to keep it under 8lbs.

Wayne

Electric brakes
 

I used to use these brakes on the nose gear. Talk about a pain and then there was Wing Mfg electric retracts on my Norm Page Avenger and Mach 1's. Opps sorry I'm having another senior flashback nightmare. Things are so much better now than back then. Mike

Why do pattern guys do this?
 

OK Tony F.,

I have the BEST reason yet for not taxiing the plane back to the pits. The joint between the asphalt and concrete sections on the Tailwinds runway! That ridge had taken plenty of prop tips and given plenty of scratches to wheel pants.

Jim W.

Why do pattern guys do this?
 

The reason why I shut my engine down while landing (Yes... I'm one of those guys that unexplainabily do that) is firstly: because the composite landing gear my plane wears bend if touches a bit hard the asphalt (Gusty winds after 10:00AM everyday :mad: ). Secondly: We suffer a lot because of the crosswind that blows over our narrow asphalt runway all day long, and the grass beside the runway damages LG plates when abruptly speeds down the plane, and finally: it's something that not everybody can do at my club under those conditions. It's kind of a signature for pros here (some ego thing :D ).
Greetings.

Doug....
 

Speaking a load of Bull.....?

Me?

What gave it away?

--Troy

Why do pattern guys do this?
 

I usually do it cause the engine shuts down for me.......

Why do pattern guys do this?
 

........yet YS still rocks?

Why do pattern guys do this?
 

So you're saying that every time you fly, the engine shuts down right before landing because it runs out of fuel? If you're running out of fuel during a sequence then you may want to try a bigger fuel tank. I just haven't heard of an engine that runs out of fuel right before landing every time.

fuel
 

Ryan,

These guys are like formula one drivers... they got it down right to the last moment. They are sooooo gooood. Heh! heh!

Hmmmm lets see if I set the limiters on my OS EFI and control the max rpm for a given duration and prop it to the load based on humidity, altitude and temp ahh dont forget the boost thing..... yah thats it... just enough fuel. hee hee!


Wayne