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Reasonable flying winds?

Old 02-16-2014, 07:45 AM
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Rob2160
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Originally Posted by Granpooba View Post
Wind directly down the runway, so that you have a head wind is no problem. But now a crosswind is a totally different animal. EVERY aircraft whether it be a model or real life full size aircraft, has a crosswind component limitation. Which in simple terms means, that in certain velocity cross winds no matter how good the aircraft is, or the pilot is, the aircraft will be unable to maintain straight flight. That is why they publish " Cross Wind Component " numbers/wind speeds in real time aircraft manuals.

Ever see one in a model manual ? LOL
You are so right.

The crosswind component for real aircraft is based on a rudder pedal pressure requirement or a rudder deflection percentage on take off. IE around 40% for most light aircraft. You do have a margin above this but the crosswind limit published is what the manufacturer believes is "reasonable" for the average pilot to accomplish.

I fly a real Global Express and just finished annual recurrent training in the Simulators at Bombarider in Montreal.

Each year we practice a take off at Max weight with "greater than" the maximum certified crosswind component. (you wouldn't do it in real life but it makes for good training)

The Global has a long highly swept wing, so when you rotate on take off just 6 degrees of bank will result in a wing strike.

With high sweepback you need plenty of aileron into wind during the rotation to keep the wings level

We practice landings in crazy crosswinds also and that is no fun either.

Occasionally in the real aircraft you land in totally calm conditions and it feels so easy by comparison.

Give me calm air any day, Full Size or RC.

Except on slope soaring days.

Last edited by Rob2160; 02-16-2014 at 07:55 AM.
Old 02-16-2014, 07:52 AM
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Flying in higher winds will make you a better pilot.
Old 02-16-2014, 07:57 AM
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Originally Posted by airraptor View Post
Flying in higher winds will make you a better pilot.
It will certainly give you more experience and improve your overall skills as a pilot by expanding your comfort zone.

I have flown my planes in all types of winds but there is a point when it is so windy that it stops being fun. (for me anyway)
Old 02-16-2014, 08:01 AM
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I pays to keep a "beater" for flying in less than ideal conditions. I have a coroplast US Aircore "Nighthawk" W/a Saito FA91s on the nose. It's tough enough to take a beating & has enough power to get out of trouble if throttle is the answer.
Old 02-16-2014, 08:17 AM
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I like the idea of having a "beater" but I want it to be a "real" model. For example, what's the point of hovering a foamie around by the propeller on windy days? Ideally, I'll like something with about the same weight as my "good" models and ideally something similar, e.g. since I build and fly scale WWI biplanes, I'd like to have a beater biplane.

Sounds like I need me another Puppeteer of BUSA Pup.
Old 02-16-2014, 08:40 AM
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Originally Posted by abufletcher View Post
I like the idea of having a "beater" but I want it to be a "real" model. For example, what's the point of hovering a foamie around by the propeller on windy days? Ideally, I'll like something with about the same weight as my "good" models and ideally something similar, e.g. since I build and fly scale WWI biplanes, I'd like to have a beater biplane.

Sounds like I need me another Puppeteer of BUSA Pup.
The Nighthawk isn't a "foamie". It isn't scale, but it is a taildragger.
Old 02-16-2014, 09:40 AM
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Pretty much 15 on crosswind and 20-25 down the runway.
Old 02-16-2014, 09:41 AM
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Originally Posted by SrTelemaster150 View Post
The Nighthawk isn't a "foamie". It isn't scale, but it is a taildragger.
Sorry, I didn't mean your particular model. I was talking about those profile jobs which hover around with their nose in the air. If I'm going to fly in wind, I'd like a model that flies and responds like a real aircraft.
Old 02-16-2014, 09:47 AM
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Originally Posted by abufletcher View Post
Sorry, I didn't mean your particular model. I was talking about those profile jobs which hover around with their nose in the air. If I'm going to fly in wind, I'd like a model that flies and responds like a real aircraft.
The Nighthawk flies about like any high wing taildragger. My choice of putting the extra power of the FA91S in a 40 sized airframe had to do W/balance as much as power. My theory is that if the plane need nose ballast, the best way to add the weight is more reciprocating mass IE, a bigger engine.

I would think that any biplane would be a handfull on a day W/gusting, variable winds. Something scale in a low wing monoplane W/a wide landing gear stance & heavier wing loading might be a little easier to handle.
Old 02-16-2014, 10:05 AM
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Originally Posted by SrTelemaster150 View Post
I would think that any biplane would be a handfull on a day W/gusting, variable winds. Something scale in a low wing monoplane W/a wide landing gear stance & heavier wing loading might be a little easier to handle.
But that's just it. I don't want it "easier" to handle. I want a model that will force me to improve, but at the same time, one I don't care about cracking up. But, hey, at this point, I'd fly anything! It was seriously frustrating to drive two hours to a beautiful field on a cloudless day and not fly because the wind sock was flapping around a bit too much.
Old 02-16-2014, 10:15 AM
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Flying a small real airplane in high wind is just as much fun as flying a model. Shear and pockets make like driving on a potholed road at 100 mph. Everyone has limits or dont know what is going on.
Old 02-16-2014, 11:31 AM
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Originally Posted by Rob2160 View Post
You are so right.

The crosswind component for real aircraft is based on a rudder pedal pressure requirement or a rudder deflection percentage on take off. IE around 40% for most light aircraft. You do have a margin above this but the crosswind limit published is what the manufacturer believes is "reasonable" for the average pilot to accomplish.

I fly a real Global Express and just finished annual recurrent training in the Simulators at Bombarider in Montreal.

Each year we practice a take off at Max weight with "greater than" the maximum certified crosswind component. (you wouldn't do it in real life but it makes for good training)

The Global has a long highly swept wing, so when you rotate on take off just 6 degrees of bank will result in a wing strike.

With high sweepback you need plenty of aileron into wind during the rotation to keep the wings level

We practice landings in crazy crosswinds also and that is no fun either.

Occasionally in the real aircraft you land in totally calm conditions and it feels so easy by comparison.

Give me calm air any day, Full Size or RC.

Except on slope soaring days.
Am retired now, but am TYPE rated in Falcon 20, Falcon 200 , Falcon 50/900 and Citation 500 series. As you state especially in the Falcon 50 / 900 series on take offs and landings, just 5 or 6 degrees of bank will give you a wing tip strike. If my memory serves me correctly, I believe that the Falcons have a 35 knot cross wind limitation. Probably because of a lot of luck and a little pilot skill, I can admit that I have exceeded the cross wind limit. Nothing to brag about, just fact. But then again, the factory always allows for that fudge factor.
Old 02-16-2014, 11:39 AM
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Originally Posted by TFF View Post
Flying a small real airplane in high wind is just as much fun as flying a model. Shear and pockets make like driving on a potholed road at 100 mph. Everyone has limits or dont know what is going on.
Have landed a Piper Cherokee 140 into a strong or should I say, very strong head wind. As soon as we touched down the aircraft came to a stop, with NO application of the brakes. Shear and air pockets, can make real life flying very interesting. Especially if a lot of your flying is done around mountains and in valleys.

Last edited by Granpooba; 02-16-2014 at 03:05 PM.
Old 02-16-2014, 04:04 PM
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One thing a person better be prepared to fly in any situation or he may not be flying at all, full or model aircraft. You never know what you will have next. If you do not have the experience you better get it.
Old 02-16-2014, 04:32 PM
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Originally Posted by Live Wire View Post
One thing a person better be prepared to fly in any situation or he may not be flying at all, full or model aircraft. You never know what you will have next. If you do not have the experience you better get it.

So true, have you ever took off in perfect winds and 5-6 mins later it speeds up or changes directions? Now you are already up and NEED to come down. You better now how to or..........you ll have a kit again. Remember they all start as a kid and ends like a kit, sometimes with way more pieces
Old 02-16-2014, 04:52 PM
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Originally Posted by lopflyers View Post
So true, have you ever took off in perfect winds and 5-6 mins later it speeds up or changes directions? Now you are already up and NEED to come down. You better now how to or..........you ll have a kit again. Remember they all start as a kid and ends like a kit, sometimes with way more pieces
The only maneuver that is mandatory is landing.
Old 02-16-2014, 08:12 PM
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Great video, you guys know how to have fun, thanks for shareing
Old 02-16-2014, 08:50 PM
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Originally Posted by lopflyers View Post
So true, have you ever took off in perfect winds and 5-6 mins later it speeds up or changes directions? Now you are already up and NEED to come down. You better now how to or..........you ll have a kit again. Remember they all start as a kid and ends like a kit, sometimes with way more pieces
I flew a 737 into Denver one day for my airline. We had to make a missed approach and when we missed the winds were calm. By the time we came back around to land the winds were gusting to 35 with wind shear reported. Yep, you better be ready.
Old 02-16-2014, 08:57 PM
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I have flown in stupid winds, like gusts to 30 mph. In my opinion it really isn't much fun. Just a constant struggle to keep your plane under control. The calmer the wind the more the fun.
Old 02-17-2014, 03:40 AM
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I know a fellow flyer that will not fly if a leaf shakes on the trees and he misses out some great flying days. I don't mind the wind much myself except when we have gusty crosswinds. I have dorked a couple in when side gust completely flipped my plane. That is when I should have not been flying as it has financial cost at that point. One club I fly at will once in a while put out a dare on windy days and those are challenging. The last time we had it I beat the dare and even came home without breaking my gear out. Three other folks broke out gear that day.

Flying on windy days will improve your skills, however I am like many in this thread that doesn't enjoy that as much. When it loses its fun factor there is just something missing and I don't care to fly when the fun is gone.
Old 02-17-2014, 03:49 AM
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Sometimes, everyone seems to be waiting around to see if anyone else will fly. And if one guy does it (and survives) a few others may give it a shot. But, yeah, there are guys who won't fly at all on any but the absolutely calmest day...and that's too bad.

People are also missing out if they never ever fly in any kind of a cross-wind. It's true that cross-winds are a pain, and make landing a WWI type almost impossible. But it's also neat to have a chance to practice crabbing and side-slipping.
Old 02-17-2014, 05:13 AM
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I found and ordered myself an anytime flyer. First, I looked at the Tettra 50-size Cub balsa kit for $140. But then I found a full ARF model from ModelCraft of the Brazilian Paulistinha P56 (an unlicensed copy of the Taylor Cub) for just $30 more. It is also 50-size and has a 6-foot wing span. Since I already have engine (Saito 56) and all the radio gear, this is a pretty minimal investment.

Plus, I've found that Cubs (and the like) fly fairly similarly to my WWI biplanes.

http://ishii-mokei.heteml.jp/eng/pro...roduct_id=2259

ModelCraft also have a 1/5 scale ARF Cub with an 82 inch wingspan...and I do have an unused Saito 82 sitting around. But I figure it would be easier to toss the smaller model in the van with my SE5a.
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Old 02-17-2014, 06:38 AM
  #73  
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Flying in the wind is allot of fun with the right airplane and of course just a little practice. Around 2004 flying my 3.3 Yak in 35 + mph gusting wind X the runway.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7oN0r...ature=youtu.be

Bob
Old 02-17-2014, 06:52 AM
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I've flown when I could "hover" at normal flying speed and attitude with a 40 size trainer. I first saw a friend do this with a Senior Telemaster so I tried it. Very short take-off roll. Downwind ground speed was something else and those - no, don't go there
The only requirement is that the wind must be steady.
Old 02-17-2014, 06:55 AM
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My plane of choice for the wind is a .40 size Stik. I've flown it in 20+ mph winds. Sometimes not the smartest thing to do, but it feels great to get it down in one piece. I also have a Multiplex Mentor that I usually fly with floats. I like to put the wheels on and put that up in the wind too. Both planes can be replaced for not alot of money and the experience is priceless.

Last edited by bruceal; 02-17-2014 at 06:56 AM. Reason: Spelling

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