12skipper

Hello Rich,
We are excited right along with you! Can't wait to see your future posts!

Chuck

WhiteWolf McBride

My Feedback: (3)

Butch:

Please contact me... no sign of the shipment. I'll see if Crappy Post screwed up and dinna leave me a parcel note, but thats only happened twice in 20+ years. Now UPS & FedEx, they never leave 'em, something about people claiming parcels that ain't theirs, idiots.

Contact me, ok?


Hope you're still doin' ok...
WhiteWolf

Rich404

Dauntless Captains,

I just got back from the archive center. I spent about 6 hours in Dauntless heaven. I have learned a few new things today and reinforced the things I already knew.


When Dauntless was launched, she went through some changes to look like the Dauntless we now know. She did not have the bridgeshelter top on when she was launched, she just had a windshield just like the sketch in that write up we were chatting about a page or 2 ago. She also had a venturi, much like the one on her forward cockpit but it was below the windshield,again, like the drawing. I also saw a picture of her full speed at sea without the shelter top with a series of metal bars going around the entire bridge deck, making her look like a government experiment rather than a personal yacht. Very strange but very cool. It was an arial view taken from a helicopter or plane.

When Dauntless was launched, the local papers raced to take pictures to get the first write up. She was a major hit! I have to find the original article.

I was able to check out many interesting pictures, but according the the center, there are still tons of pending pictures that are not cataloged yet. I am going to check back with them for updates. I did not get to see the interior, ok a glance here & there, but I was able to get all the colors that were cataloged in the designers notes. I did see the ships wheel & other details that were very beautiful!



Some other quick notes:

Dauntless did not have ladders in her aft cockpit. It was just seating along the entire back wall with another 2 leather upolstered fishing chairs. All of the seating there and in the bridgedeck was done in red leather. I did not see any ladders on her exterior, but she had one removable boarding ladder that clipped to the hull. It was varnished mahogany.

The exhaust out the back was also really interesting. They were not just 1 exhaust pipe on each side, but 2 really large exhaust pipes on each side but they were also offset from each other rather than next to each other. It was interesting and I have never seen it like that on other yachts. That is why we seen so much water rushing from there.

There were a bunch of other things as well. I have to go through my notes and sort it all out. I took about 10 pages of detailed notes today.

Laurance had his own model of Dauntless made. It was small, 1/24 scale or so, and it was an exact replica of Dauntless in a nice display case. It was cool to see the owners personal miniature. It was likely made by S&S and was a custom scratch build.

Many of the photos seen today looked just like how I have envisioned Dauntless so we are on the right path!
Now, It's time to sort through & apply this info.

-Rich.

kz2wqj

Thanks Rich, I have some honey do's to catch up before I get back into my Dauntless project. I'll let you know how it turns out.

Rich404

Dauntless Captains:

Here is something that can be useful to you all.

Below is the official original color arrangement to Dauntless:

Hull: Royal Blue

Bottom: Signal Red

Cabin sides exterior: Semi Gloss White

Hull Decks, cabin decks, tops and fly bridge interior sides: Battleship Grey

Interior/exterior Trim: Varnished mahogany

Helm: varnished mahogany with Chrome controls for port & STBD engines.

Ships Wheel: Varnished mahogany

Aft cabin interior: International grey with mahogany trim

Main cabin: Cream with mahogany trim

-Rich.

WhiteWolf McBride

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Rich:

PLEASE tell us you were able to make copies of these 'as-first-launched' pictures!

It would be very interesting to see what those rails might have been...

My guess? Depending on location, perhaps they were for navigating the side-decks while the boat was at speed? That was one thing I did note - no way to get from fore-deck to cockpit safely: no handrail, no edge-rail or safety line. But after the 'sea-trials', they may have been removed as 'un-necessary equipment' as most wouldn't be traversing fore/aft while the boat was in transit, yes?

Would also like to see the cockpit without the permanent canopy... That 'Design Section' article shows it without the permanent top... and one might tale the lines running back from the fore-deck safety-line to the cockpit door to be those 'bars' you mentioned, a safey-line attachment point I guessed at?

The 'inboard profile' plan diagram shows the uncovered cockpit, and the 'venturi' (aka wind deflector) down at the base of the cockpit windscreen, and the windshield on the bow seating area one can be seen (and is noted) as well. I remember some of the later 40's and early 50's cars had these at the 'top' of their windscreens by the roof, often done in chrome. Many tractor-trailor semi's have them now too, and on the nose of the engine cowling as well.

Shame about the ladders... after all that (idle) work making a few from balsa. Ah well, can always use 'em as display items... or mebbe use 'em on my refitted AE.

Hope you can get those pics up (or mailed)... if you got 'em.
WhiteWolf

PS: I was just looking back at images of the aft cabin enterior, and something looks odd... mebbe a negative got flipped or summat? Here is whats baffling me:

All three images posted here in the past (labelled Kv17005, Nt46108, & Xq44864) show an access ladder to the deck being on the LEFT side of the image, right? BUT any shot of the forward access from that aft cabin area to the main cockpit would put that access ladder/door on the RIGHT side of the image, correct? Now Kv & Nt appear to be of the same era, but not left/right of the same cabin. Nt has a fire extinguisher beside the ladder, Kv has an odd cast-pewter-ish emblem on the cubboard, and Xq has a shorter ladder (4 steps to the floor-block vs 5 of the other two) I'd personally say Nt & Xq are the same cabin, but at different times, due to the standard location of the sink on the far wall, the range/stove on the right, AND the differing electronic gear behind the access ladder, not to mention the curve of the deck/cabin support the ladder is attached to. So why the shorter ladder to the deck-box in Xq? Redesign when the engines were changed, perhaps?

So that leaves Kv as the odd picture out. There are distinctly odd things in the Kv image: what looks like a round porthole on the right side above the counter facing aft, and an oblong one on the left above the counter facing the side, and the edge of a second be seen above the seating. The only place on the boat where there are oblong windows is the forecabin! This ~should~ make it the main cabin galley, forward of the cockpit, facing aft... BUT the ladder is too big! Plans show its only two steps up, and to the main cabin, NOT the cockpit, and plans show the access centered in the hull. Also, the curve of the deck/cabin support the ladder is attached to is less pronounced... if I had to assume flipped negs, I'd assume this is the one facing toward the cockpit, and the other two face AFT, toward the rear 'sundeck'...

Mebbe Rich's research can provide some answers. (not that I'm going to build the interior, its just inconsistancies and puzzles like this really bug me)

PPS: Anyone notice Dumas also missed that loop-antenna on the starboard foredeck? Its mast can also be seen in the images of the film cameras being set up (its the dark upright rod on the foreground of the image) Was that for the radio-telephone, or was the extra whip on the mast (the .041 piano wire) used for that? Rich, if your verbal data is this enlightening, I'd gladly be willing to donate a few bills for images/scans. Let us know, won't you?

dauntlessfan

Wow, great nuggets of info Rich, thanks for taking the time to post some of your finds! I finally moved out of an apartment and into a house. So I got my garage back and hope to start updating my Daunless as soon as I find all my dang tools .

Rich404

Hi Whitewolf,

No, I didn’t get that picture with the rails, I kinda wish I did, but I ran out of time. The place had closed when I found out I could get pictures so I missed the opportunity to get a bunch of those pictures.
I have no idea what those rails were. They were only in the bridge deck area. It seems that you could throw your hand up and grab one anywhere you stood in the bridge deck area. They were not on Dauntless when she was launched. It was done afterwards for some reason still unknown.

Your guess is right about the wind deflectors. It was an aerodynamics thing and was just like the one depicted in the original drawing. Actually, the yacht looked just the one depicted in the drawing. In person, Dauntless looked awesome without the shelter top. In the pictures she looked like a large floating hot rod. You could tell that Dauntless meant business and she was no slow gentleman’s yacht. In fact, she was referred to as a speedboat. Dauntless was not about luxury, but about speed and had a PT look to it. I am incorporating that look into my boat, which is very different from how I originally perceived her. What I thought Dauntless looked like and what she is becoming is pretty different.

The shelter top makes her look more refined, but she was very impressive without the top. Had it not been for all the work done to make up the shelter, I would consider setting her up without the shelter.

I will have to get back to you on your next set of questions, I don’t have the pictures you are referring to near me. I am guessing the Dumas pictures vs the S&S blueprints. If that is the comparison, Dumas’s window placements, ETC are not consistent with the S&S blueprints. I modified everything to be consistent with the S&S drawings.

On the PPS, That is probably for the boat radio. I am not use where the radiophone antennae was, probably also on the radar mast like you suggested. I am going to add that antennae once the rails are on. Behind it also on the starboard side is the direction finder. In the main S&S picture that we have on this forum, it looks like a bulls eye thing on the center of the main cabin. It was actually starboard after all. The base was grey & the circular part was red.

I did get 2 pics from the center & will likely get more later on. I cannot post them here because of copyright reasons. I had to be interviewed and sign a bunch of legal disclaimers before looking at anything.

The best picture of the day was taken by a local newspaper. This showed Dauntless without the top and she was in the process of being docked. This picture was chock full of detail. I am going to locate the article with the picture for this forum. This way, I don’t break any archive rules and can link us to that awesome article and picture.
I will work on locating it soon, I took down all the info, dates, etc.

Dauntlessfan,

Congrats on getting a house with a garage! It would be awesome to see you hook up Dauntless.

Ok captains, the epoxy should have dried, so it is off to painting. I am using lots of grey today.

-Rich

WhiteWolf McBride

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Ok Rich, I'll tackle this item by item...

The 'cockpit rails' - where they inside the cockpit, or outside, and at roughly what height? About where the trim-rail is shown on the drawings, the level where the main cabin 'steps' inward on the sides for the cockpit walls? perhaps higher or lower? Without images, I'd ~bet~ they were rails for attaching a safety-line to for traversing fore/aft while the boat was in motion, or in bad weather. If you went overboard, you could hawl yourself back, or someone could use it to pull you back. They are used all the time on the racing sailboats. No special name, just called safety lines.

I wonder if it would be possible to assemble ~two~ cockpit upper partial-cabins: one without the permanent shelter top, that sits atop the roof of the main cabin; and a second one, built as per Dumas images, but is designed to use the same mounting points as the open assembly (would have to rig some up). Think of it as a variation of the removaable cockpit canopy idea for the cockpit that was discussed. This way, one could have ~three~ options: #1 - original fully-open cockpit; #2 Dumas-imaged semi-enclosed cockpit (hardroof'd in front); & #3, Forward Hardroof w/ aft tarpaulin in place for bad weather.

See the attached image for the best Dauntless image so you can see the wire-loop antenna on the main cabin roof, starboard.

Good luck on finding the articles... Would really like to see those images of the rails, the cockpit w/o the partial-roof, and the other stuff...

WhiteWolf

Rich404

The rails took up the entire bridge deck. They were seemed to have began from one central point, behind the helm from one large stanchion and branched outward to different areas around the deck where they were mounted to the decks. I cannot describe it, I would need to get you a picture. It was only in one picture and the other pictures from that time period did not have it.

It could have been a safety line of sorts, it could have been useful for the crew to grab onto in rough seas when the yacht was flying, but it is just speculation. It could have been the rods to an early bridge rag top. The actual picture could be a discussion in itself, I will make sure to request it.

Yes, I’m sure it would be possible to assemble two different shelters for Dauntless.

The wire loop antenna is the direction finder. I have seen close ups of it. It is actually on the starboard side just ahead of the bridge shelter. The long base is grey & the circular part is red. It rotates for reception.

Once I get good pics, I will share with you.
-Rich.

WhiteWolf McBride

My Feedback: (3)

Rich:

The rails were on the ~inside~ of the cockpit? Then I'd guess they were for harnesses to hold crew in place, if there were no proper seating arrangements like in a race boat. it would prevent the crew from being thrown to either side or backward away from the controls. When you're pushing a boat like that to its top speed, it bounced something fierce over the wavetops... (ever seen the race-boat scenes from the new Miami Vice movie? They have crash buckets, AND multi-point harnesses to boot!

If ya can't do a pic, how about getting some popsicle sticks (or similar) paint 'em black, and using silly-putty or that blue poster-tak stuff, tack bits in place to show where the rails were in your cabin, hmmm? I'd do it to my unfinished one, but mine isn't that far assembled... Wonder if I could tack/tape mine together for a 'guesswork-simulation', and you can tell me where my guesses are wrong. How about it?

As for the loop, I'd figured it was a direction finder... seen too many in the movies on the WW2 detection trucks/vehicles.

Rich404

Hi Whitewolf,

I am going to make sure to get that picture & will forward it to you. I am not going to add that feature to my Dauntless because I am going to keep the bridge shelter. My Dauntless will portray the 1950's "refined" version which was like the picture you posted above, but once I get you the picture you might want to add it to your yacht. It was very cool & someone should do it. The main stanction that all those bars were connected to did carry into the bridge shelter. It was behind the helm so that the captain could grab on if needed. It was necessary for a yacht that fast. Dauntless had 2 captains chairs beside the helm and seating along the entire back wall. There was no seat at the helm. There was a varnished wood stand that the captain would stand on to get a better view.


The designers of Dauntless did a great job on Dauntless. She reminded me of a tribute to the might of the U.S. forces during WWII, which the owner was a big part of. Although Dauntless was a powerful and masculine looking yacht, she also had grace and tons of charm. It took some creative people to tie together a military look while making her appear classy at the same time. She was certaily unique and very different from the all common white & varnished wood yachts that were common amongst the wealthy at that time. She was a colorful yacht that commanded attention and possibly a salute.

On a seperate note, the interior of my Dauntless was painted grey. She looks great, very military. I still never would have thought this a week ago. [8D]

This yacht seems to be taking me on an interesting journey & I am glad to share this with you all. I wish all of the Dauntless-fans were with me at the archive center. It was so cool.

-Rich.

werdonmorris

My Feedback: (7)

Hi Gang, I been off doing nothing at Veterans Hospital for a while. For every time I would look up at the night sky, I would get head spins, and pass out. I would come to, and be yucky for a good hour.
The doctors found out, I had a spinal healing spur pressing against my spinal cord. Plus there is about 21 spinal spurs on my neck and back, and no cushion, just bone to bone.
They want to send me 40 miles away to a surgeon, to operate pretty soon. When I just get great news after three years waiting for my ssi, or ssd. They finally approved me for both.

Butch

Rich404

Wow Butch,

Hang in there buddy & feel better!

Dauntless captains:

Here is a little research assignment for you guys:

There was an article written about Dauntless on Tuesday, June 8, 1948 about Dauntless. This article was the first article written about Dauntless contained a very cool picture of her without the shelter top. This picture was full of original details.

The name of the newspaper was: "The Standard Star" - New Rochelle, New York Tuesday, June 8, 1948. The parent company of the newspaper was: Westchester County Publishers, Inc.
I don't know the name of the article, but we need to track down the newpaper company, the archives and try to locate that paper from that date.

I did not get the name of the article, (I could not find it) but was able to get those listed details.

Have fun!

-Rich.



-Rich.

WhiteWolf McBride

My Feedback: (3)

I agree with Rich there, Butch,

Glad to see they are finally coughing up for medical. Been there myself, and may have a fight again myself. They may want me to shell out $700 US for my IV feeds pump (thats just the pump, no ambulatory battery pack or charger), when the former gastro-feed pump and IV pole were bought for me. I'm pretty sure they'll buy it for me like the last one, but that paperwork was really messed up, and by the time they'd bought it, I was a few months from not needing it!. I can even 'donate' 'em back, if they get snooty about it...

Rich:

I did a google on the name, and I got a few ~critical~ tidbits you could follow up on:

Standard Star (current address)
92 North Avenue
New Rochelle, NY 10801
914-694-5331
Publisher: Westchester Newspapers, Inc.
Dates of publication: 1923-1998
Description: Ceased Oct. 1998.

Historically: (1923) Two of New Rochelles's daily newspapers, The Evening Star, established in 1909 by Robert Lucas Forbes, and The Standard first issued in 1909, merge to become The Standard Star.


But you know all that, right? HERE is the critical tidbit: ARCHIVES!

The following locations apparently have archive copies of the relevant year: originals, microfilm, etc.



SUMMARY HOLDING: New York State - Rgn, Albany, NY

Dates Available: 1923-1998
Last updated: 06/2003

Available as: Microfilm Service Copy
Dates: 1931:1:2-1998:9:30
Last updated: 06/2003



SUMMARY HOLDING: Westchester County Historical Society, Elmsford, NY

Dates Available: 1948
Last updated: 08/2001

Available as: Original
Dates: 1948:6:17
Last updated: 08/2001



SUMMARY HOLDING: Westchester Library System, Ardsley, NY

Available as: Microfilm
Dates: 1923-1998 0,5,8
Last updated: 12/1998

-

How's that for research Rich? You have the date, and probable locations (the Historical Society seems iffy... I'd try the other two first.) Do I get brownie points for finding your archival copies? (or what we HOPE are archival copies...)

WhiteWolf

Rich404

Great find Whitewolf,

You have certainly earned your stripes!

I will give them a call & see if I can get them to e-mail me a PDF copy of it. The article was just as interesting as the one done by yachting magazine.

-Rich.

kz2wqj

Hi Captains, I'm almost done glassing my dauntless. Thanks for all the great tips. One tip was really great. One post suggested usind an old credit card to smooth out the glass and cloth. This works very very good. The hull requires very light sanding after using this process. I cant find who sent that post, but I thank you. Also, could someone give me a quick lesson on how to upload pictures on this site. Thanks. Mike

dauntlessfan

When you hit the "Post Reply" button, you'll be taken to the reply screen. At the bottom left of the box you write your message in is a link that says "click here to upload images and files". That will bring up a new small window where you hit the top "Browse" button and find the location on your PC of the pic you want to upload. Do this same step for up to 12 images. Once done, hit the "OK" button and it will say please wait... Then you'll see a confirmation that the files uploaded sucessfully. Press "OK" and you'll be back at the original reply form.

Here's where people get hosed: Eventhough it won't look any different or show any pics in the reply form, click "OK" and the pics should appear.

Hope this helps.

kz2wqj

Thanks for the lesson. Mike

kz2wqj

Hi Captains, No pics of my Dauntless yet But I want to test How to upload pictures. Here are a couple pics of my other boat project. I am restoreing a 1965 Chris craft 43' Constellation. my current project is replacing the rotted wood around the pilot house windows. Mike

WhiteWolf McBride

My Feedback: (3)

*sigh*

I'd love to work at restoring a historical boat... or tank, jeep, whatever. Closest I can come is restoring a model boat (like my A.E.) and its been a chore to get it back to a near-bare hull. I still need to take the deck down to an even level, as it was badly stripped with a Dremel drum sander, and has drum-divots all over it. I'm going to see if nephew's GF's dad has a belt-sander, as my small B&D Mouse-type detail sander just isn't up to it (though its handled the rest, both A.E. & Dauntless, admirably)

Just remember Mike:

LOTS OF VENTILATION. First time I tried to waterproof a hull, OY. I did it in a basement with no fans and no open windows. No buzz, sadly, but one HECK of a headache by the time I was done. From then on, I had at ~least~ one 12" fan pulling air out & away from my work. And here, I have ~two~ 16" fans, though I try to pick days when its decent outside for work like that.

Good luck with the Connie Mike... gonna give her a Tuna-Tower? Or is that too cliche/passe' these days?

WhiteWolf
~almost~ ready to begin planking that d*mned bow...

Rich404

Hi Mike,

I'm glad the glassing tips worked for you! The same techniques can be applied to your Chris Craft if you decide to glass it, it is all relative.

That is a great project you have there with the Constellation! I grew up around many of the old cruisers and have always been fond of them. (and I also slaved over as well as enjoyed them in the summertime) It is that charming style that initially drew me to Dauntless. Once I eventually move back to the city, I plan on picking up an old cruiser, but likely from the 50's.

Best of luck on your restoration project & I can't wait to see your Dauntless progress underway!

It will be great when you can kick back and sail Dauntless off the back of the Chris Craft!

-Rich.

kz2wqj

No tuna -Tower Whitewolf. I have enough work just getting her back to original condition.

kz2wqj

Rich, If you like building wood models you will love working on an old Chris craft. A fifty's boat would be awesome, I picked the connie because it has a fiberglass upper deck. My hull is very solid. Once I get the pilot house done I should be able to keep up with the maintenance.

The dauntless project is going well. I'll be glad when I can put the sanding block down and get back to building the model. Once I getthe final sanding done onthe hull I'm going to Install the running gear and motors before I move on tothe upper cabins. I'll send pics of the final sanded hull. Also Rich and Whitewolf, Can you recommend some good electric motors andESC'S. I want it togo fast, VERYFAST. Talk to you later. Mike.

Rich404

Hi Mike,

I have a passion for charming old yachts & cruisers, so the day will come when I will get my chance to maintain or restore one. My wife and I plan on moving back to the city in the next couple of years, so I will have dock access again. I can’t wait, but until then, I will get the Dauntless project completed.

To get Dauntless to go fast and be reliable, I would recommend Astroflight motors. They are heavy duty, great quality & will give you fast speeds. The Astroflight 25’s or 40 Marine would be a really good motor to choose from. I will be running (2) brushed 25’s in mine @ 12V giving her about 10,000 RPM’s, but since I bought them, Astroflight went brushless on all their motors. I think the new brushless 25’s and 40’s put out even more power. Check with Astroflight.com and look up the specs on the new 25 or 40 marine motors and pick the faster one.

M.A.C.K. marine also have a fast motor combo for Dauntless, so perhaps you might want to check with them as well.

**I would not recommend high RPM racing boat motors (17,000+) because although they are rated at high RPM’s they don’t have the power needed to push a heavy boat like Dauntless. They will just draw lots of Amps, give you awful runtime and burn out. Save those for the super light hulls.

There are a few good forward & reverse ESC’s out there but to stay consistent, I went with Astroflight Harbor Master ESC’s, but there are other good ones that someone could recommend that may cost less.

Dauntless captain:

Here are some recent pictures.

-Rich.