tedeb

Hi
Does anyone have any experience with either the Meister or Ziroli Corsair kits. eg quality, ease of construction etc.....Thanks in advance

ProfLooney

TEDDEB you want the Ziroli over the Meister any day. not that there is anything terribly wrong with meisters stuff it is just his construction methods are nasty. I was going to do his 109 once and also enlarge it but the sides are built by glueing a bunch of thick balsa together and getting it to shape was nasty. With ziroli you just build a crutch over the plans, raise it up 6 inches or so and slide the formers on. Ziroli is much less hassle to construct and he has a lot clearer and understandable plans than meister but both are good fliers its just how much work you want to put into the construction.

Joe

rcwarbirdbuilder

My Feedback: (104)

I'm building a miester 109 now, i have built a couple of ziroli zero's too. ziroli's planes build like a conventional kit and the shapes comes out good, this is my first miester i built, the wing framed up in no time 1 day, the simplest wing construction yet!now its almost ready to sheet, I'm starting the fuse now and that looks like the tricky part, its not what I'm use to, instead of sheeting over the frame I'm using the sheets of balsa glued together to form the shape maybe it well be easier the second time around.

ProfLooney

Geo that was my prob everything else was a piece of cake but I hate his fuse construction. it also makes for a heavy plane too kinda like the Dave Platt they use tons of blocks for carving and thick sheets to build with. To me it almost seams like they dont want to spend the time or take the trouble to draw out formers that it is easier to say glue a block and carve to shape and stuff like that.

Joe

VoughtF4U

My Feedback: (1)

Teddeb,

I have built the Meister Corsair and enjoyed it. I also have several Ziroli plans. The ziroli plans are easier to read and build from. Meister plans, for the corsair at least, are full of little scale details and have a very good outline.

In my opinion, the Ziroli is better for someone without a lot of experience building from plans. You will end up with an easy to build, nice, scale looking machine.

The Meister plans require more studying prior to building to figure out what he is doing. You can get lost on the plans if you are not careful. There are several features on the Meister plans that are not scale, but these are easy to fix (the horizontal stab is not an airfoil shape, no flaps shown on the plans, etc). I still prefer the Meister over the Ziroli, just because I can change things to suit my building style easier on the Meister than I can on the Ziroli, but I am definitely in the minority.

Good luck with whichever you choose.

snoopys copilot

My Feedback: (3)

I don't understand Joe's problem with the Meister Plans or planes. There is nothing Nasty about the way the planes are built .I have been building planes for 15 years. I have built both Meister and Ziroli planes. I think Meister's planes are the easiest to build. You are sheeting 3" at a time on most of them. Not all that small planking. The sheeting templates are right on Meister's plans.
I am in the process of building 3 Meister P-47's right now. If I have all the parts cut . I can totally frame and sheet the fuse in less than 10 hrs. I know that seems short amount of time but I have built all their planes except the Corsair. Over the past few years I have built 4 Zero's, 3 Fw190 D-9's, 2 Fw190 A's, 1- Ta152 144" wing span (kitbash), 8 Me 109's, 3 84" Me 109's, 1 E-version Me109(kitbash) and when I get the P-47's finished it will be 5 P-47's .
Like others here have said the wings are the easiest parts to build. As far as scale. The 109 plans shows the scale outline on the plans. The Fw 190's, Corsair, P-47 and The Zero match the 3 view provided on the plan.
Yes if you are not an experienced builder you may need to read over the plans several times.
By the way nothing flies any better than the Meister's planes.

Ty

Katchmarek

My Feedback: (29)

Hi All, First I want to appologize in advance if this one is long winded...ran out of oil in my shop yesterday and have no heat! So to keep warm I'm typing lot's...sorry! Anyway, I would have to agree with Ty on this one. I've built 2 Meisters, a 109 and a 190 A. I have my 2nd 109 in progress, and I've only built one Zirolli, a Zero. Meister wings are fast and easy, maybe the Corsair is a bit more involved? I'm not a master builder by any means, but I can frame up and cover a Meister 109 fuse in about 3 or 4 days. The Zirolli that I built took a couple of weeks. I think Zirolli plans are more true to scale in general, but even so, my preference is Meister...they all just fly soooo nice! I have or have had, 3 Meister 109's (not counting one under construction now), FW 190 D9, Ta-152H built by Ty Brown (unbelievable airplane), two FW 190 A's, a Zero built by Ty, and a Corsair. The Zero is about the sweetest warbird I've ever flown, the 109's are close behind...heck they are all great airplanes. Don't get me wrong, Zirolli's birds are great too...I have or should I say had a Zero, and I currently own the P-38 J built and campaigned by Nick Zirolli himself. I guess when you get down to it, I like Meisters because they are BIGGER! Well that's my 2 cents worth.
Happy flying...or should I say building,
Rob / Pickupsticks

ProfLooney

Dont get me wrong I didnt say that ya couldnt build the Meisters worth a crap I just said they are nasty to build the fuses. If I remember correctly the fuse sides on the 109 were made from 1/4 or 3/8 pieces of balsa you had to glue together then fit to the formers then a bunch of sanding etc etc. with ziroli you buiold the crutch over the plans slide the formers on and glue the stringers and you are done. I have built all the ziroli warbirds but a couple and i can have his fuses framed up in abt 4 to 6 hrs. I also like to enlarge my plans some and with the way meisters are constructed they do not lend well to being blown up. Also my 109 plans were blueprints and were so bad of prints couldnt be read so i was sent another copy and they were almost as bad. Seems people cant come to the 2000's were you can use ink plotters to print these plans out now and the few that are having their plans still blueprinted dont seem to know how to do it. every time i get a set of plans that are blueprinted anymore I cringe. They used to all be that way and were good now i think people trying to be cheap and bought up unused blueprint machines to try and save a buck.

I guess I am spoiled or too picky but when I build a fuse I like the ones framed up with full formers as the slab sonctruction like meisters and the carve everything to shape like pica and platt makes for an unnecessarily heavy plane and makes the building more like work than relaxing and enjoyable. Give me a bates, Ziroli, or Vailly plane to build anyday the rest can keep and carve and sand the others to shape to their hearts content. I guess with the bad experiences I had with meister plans and getting the guy to resend plans i have just had bad experiences with them and thus biased against them.

Joe

warbirdz1

Teddeb......I haven't built a Meister F4U but I have the "Z" F4U with the 'glass fuse and it was relatively an easy plane to build ...it flys very good as well too.....the only changes I made were around the gear mounting area.......I made doublers for the ribs on each gear rail and the next rib out as well..I also beefed up the front spar with ply and doubled up the shear webs aft of the 4 ribs....have made some not-so-good landings in windy/crosswinds and no problems for the gear.... the only area that might take some extra time is the 3-piece flaps...due exactly as the plans/instructions ask and you'll be fine..the only thing I would change is using the Hobby-Lobby hinges ...they are a life saver and much easier to install than the Robart hinges...I use them on all my flap installations now....Bill.....

dinodigger II

hi guys
hope you don't mind my two cents.I'm building a meister corsair right now and I have very little experience building,but when I had to make the same decision I chose the meister for my first corsair because understanding was a meister was easier to build and much easier to fly and the ziroli was much more to scale.
well if I can build this plane with out to much trouble anybody can.
Now my queston for the Corsair builders is------d0 any of you have adrawing for the flaps.
Thanks,Dinodigger Email@hakesOp51

zusie

Question: What kind of difference could I expect between a Meister Bf-109 and a PCM Models Bf-109?
jg

F4u5

My Feedback: (81)

I probably am in support of Joe's opinion, and I think I know what he means. I think, for a person, any person, that has been building for a while, we tend to get comfortable with a certain style of building. I have built from just about as many building styles you can come across. About 2 years ago, I planned on building a Meister 109. While looking at the plans, I found them to be cumbersome and seemed to be an ailien building style, as I had never seen this style before. I passed, mainly on my comfort of building using Ziroli methods. Tht's not to say it WOULD be difficult, because I know a guy that says he can frame up a Meister FW190 in about 70 hours...I don't think I could. Now, given the chance to get used to the Meister style, maybe I could...who knows. However, I have flown, and have seen many Meister planes fly, and they do fly very nicely. While having a flat bottom wing, the Meister stuff has a pretty close scale outline otherwise, and I would not let the flat bottom wing deter from building. Eventually, I plan to tackle a PCM Me109...but I want to talk to Evan in detail about his experiences first.

ProfLooney

I havent built a PCM but from Evans pics theres a big difference. PCM are mainly glass fuse and foam wings what I consider a prefab kit and meisters you have to build it up from scratch.

Thats the main difference I can see the rest doesnt matter for differences as far as building it is just whether you want to start from a pile of wood or have the fuse and wings prefabbed for you and start from there. Financial aspect is also a factor. Even though most people have about the same in their projects when they are completed it depends whether you can afford to put out a chunk of money at once for a full kit or like me right now can only put out a little at a time so scratch building from a pile of wood is easier on the wallet.

Joe

zusie

ProfLooney,
Thank you for your input, I am new to the RC world being in the process of building a TF Cessna 182 Skylane (my full scale solo aircraft.) with all its BUILDING requirements. The whole idea of ARF means I will build less and FLY more, which I like. I guess the real question is without regard to the cost but which will get me in to the air quicker and with minimum ANGST!!
Your thoughts please,
jg

ProfLooney

Go With PCM or Yellow Aircraft for a kit thats not really an arf but is easy and quick build and you will be fine.

Joe

zusie

Joe,
I am sorry I missed your signature,
Chalk it up to what ever!!
jack

zusie

Joe,
Thank you. May I call you my E-mail friend?
jack

ProfLooney

Sure no problem also if ya have yahoo messenger can get me there under nick proflooney

Joe