I am trying to sort this out.
Ihave had planes from VQ, and Ihave had planes from Kondor Models.
Who is ESM who is selling what look to be some of the same planes as Kondor?
And it looks like VQ has copied them also?
The VQ planes I had were junk, covered in printed shelf paper, and they fell apart. Not happy. But the new ones look like Kondor Models?
The Kondor Models planes were a mixed bag.
Sort this out for me?

no way,dont wanna know...naananananananananananananan, it is just to much info! I think if you go to the ESM website hey might show both ESM and KMP.....I think

I don't want to get into internet bashing, but some of those companies, lets say it has been a bad experience.
But some of the models are tempting.
Iwant to know what the real story is, whether one is a copy of another, who is really making what.
Just been burned before.

vallawyer, you are not the only one confused! It has been rather difficult to keep up and try to keep it sorted.

ESM, YT International, and Kondor models are all the same product, I think. I think ESM is the actual manufacturer, and the factory is in China.

VQ Models are not the same in any way shape or form. They are a manufacturer that is in Vietnam. Along with Black Horse, and not sure but I think Seagull, and Phoenix models.

VQ Warbirds is a business name. That business sells VQ Models from Vietnam, as well as ESM models from China. They do not manufacture any model airplanes.

KMP/andrew kondor is developing his own line of warbirds and sport planes, and was a distributor of ESM planes as well

If you look at the ESM vs. KMP planes you will see there are somethings on the KMP planes which are not on the ESM planes, though they are the same airframe. For instance on the ESM vs. KMP T-28, they are the same size however the KMP plane features a hidden access for switches and air fill, as well as a functional (moveable) tail hook and cockpit. These items, from what I am told are not on the ESM model. This may explain the price differences.
I am just going by my research, and have not seen either in person, so correct me if I am wrong.
Thanks

ESM - Ever Soaring Models ( http://www.esmmodel.com/ ) is a Chinese manufacturer of ARFs.

YT International is the UK or european importer of ESM models.

KMP - Kondor Model Products is the previous ESM US importer that built the ESM name in the US. KMP is now producing their own line of ARFs that are not ESM (according to KMP)

TBM - Troy Built Models is the current ESM US importer.

VQ warbirds is seller of various model lines including VQ and ESM. I think they get their ESM stuff through TMB, but that may be in error.

VQ:
http://www.vqmodel.com/

You are right, these models are not the best in the whole market.

AND THIS POSTER WINS THE WHOES WHO COMPETITION,I dare say that the american importer, TBM, has a few distributers, but its Thomas at VQ WARBIRDS,who is the most prolific, KMP are nothing to do with ESM at all, the KMP models are built in a differant factory to our ESM brand, Both Thomas, and TBM import more than the ESM badge, and there lies the confusion, with one brand being called VQ,

Again:

ESM (manufacturer) produced planes ONLY for KMP in the USA and Canada (as well as YK INTL)

Now KMP (importer) dropped them and now TBM has them

YK still has them (ESM) (helped make ESM a real company)

VQ Warbirds (retailer) sold and now sells them as well as VQ and TMB and KMP

VQ is a manufacturer

KMP now imports CMP (maybe others)

And I could go into more detailed info but I won't

"KMP now imports CMP (maybe others) "
now thats a first lol , are you saying that CMP Is now making the new line for KMP ??? or that KMP is importing CMP under the CMP brand ???
China Model Products is a manufacture just like ESM , I would be surprised if they win the cake to build the new KMP line but hey nothing is that shocking .
Considering that esm is now being sold at $300 to $500 its makes the old CMP planes unattarctive in value and quality vs the $300 line of ESM planes .

I think the bottom line is a confusing array of brands and sources, with the common thread being ARF's pre-built by cheap overseas labor.

They're mostly pretty sweet-looking and well-designed for the price, but almost all of them have some ripples in quality of components and construction (after all, how fastidious would YOU be if you were some poor lackey putting them together for $0.75/hour?!)

I approach them as I would any ARF: buy what appeals to me, but don't expect really high quality or reliability. While I assemble them, I view everything with a jaundiced eye and re-build or replace whatever I don't like. Makes for a more tedious and costly assembly than just slappin' happy outta the box, but I've been rewarded with some long-lived birds, esp. a coupla VQ P-38's and a P-61. Getting there required several hundred dollars of LG and hardware upgrades and specific structural modifications and reinforcements. But not nearly as much time or money as if I had built the plane from scratch.

I view cheap imported ARF's as a good starting point rather than great finished product.


mt

That is spot on mt, I do the same thing.

not bad, but you dont win a coconut, some bits wrong, i take it YK is YT? and theCMP is that CMPRO??

Sounds like Abbot and Costello's "Who's on first"

Pete

To make things worse, there are a bunch of knock offs sold on the web cheap to be wary of.
They go by weird names not mentioned above. I don't want to start a fire fight by mentioning their names. But you guys know what I mean.

Now I'm more confused than I was before.
I don't know what is what here, and someone posted what I thought must be the real answer, it sure sounded like he knew what he was saying, then someone else who owns one of the companies says he is wrong.
I was looking at the Swordfish bomber, but I can't figure out what is what, who really makes it, and, without getting into slandering this company or that, reading this tread is like a murderers row of companies I have had problems with, I will pass on this plane.

whats so confusing?

There are about five different answers, everybody saying everybody else is wrong, and people saying they are definitely right or definitely wrong.

Like I said, I'll pass for now, too many bad deals with those companies, in the end, it does not matter which one makes the Swordfish to me.
I have not bought anything from YT, so I don't know anythng about them.
I do not really want to get into beating up this company or that, again, I see how that goes on the internet, I'm just not too interested in that, it's bad karma.  If someone has a specific question about a problem with a specific airplane, and I can help them, I will, but I don't want to be someone who posts a lot of negative stuff.
So I guess I did not get a perfect exact answer, but I heard enough to make my decistion, so the tread can be closed now, or do what you want, its OK by me.